Bashing...
- Thread starter jaxwired
- Start date
- Status
Shadowfax
Well-known member
This is also very similar to the factions over at AudioKarma where it's more of Vintage vs Modern. It always seems to be the Vintage guys telling the Modern that they have wasted their money because their 1928 Sansui is still much better than anything modern.
I have a little bit of everything, except vinyl. When CDs came out, I was foolish enough to sell or give away all my old records after taping many to cassette. Still kicking myself for that and someday I may dabble again. I still play Cassettes I made in the 80s which sound fine.
I have tube gear and SS gear. I have a few newer pcs, and lots of 90s era gear. I like it all, vintage, modern, tapes, digital, vinyl. Why does anyone pigeon hole themselves into a single grouping?
I have a little bit of everything, except vinyl. When CDs came out, I was foolish enough to sell or give away all my old records after taping many to cassette. Still kicking myself for that and someday I may dabble again. I still play Cassettes I made in the 80s which sound fine.
I have tube gear and SS gear. I have a few newer pcs, and lots of 90s era gear. I like it all, vintage, modern, tapes, digital, vinyl. Why does anyone pigeon hole themselves into a single grouping?
Shadowfax
Well-known member
Keep in mind...I have admittedly; NEVER, heard a really, really good Vinyl rig. But that's another tick, in the digital column: if you tell me...I have to spend 5 figures on a deck; another 5 on the cartridge...another 5 on the phono pre. Then...only spin re-mastered, re-pressed; 200g virgin Vinyl (at $30 a pop, I might add)...cleaned on a kilo-buck vacuum-machine...just to "best" Digital. I'll stick with Digital
Ha
, but then there are those that will tell you you have to have a $13,000 K-03 and only play Unobtanium Coated Mobile Fidelity SACDHDCDGOLD disks in order to truly enjoy a CD.
audionirvana
New member
- Joined
- Jul 24, 2014
- Messages
- 82
I have heard some pretty good modest systems on vinyl that sounded great, I use to have a Linn LP-12 years ago and it was nice, all depends a lot on source material. Some albums were recorded horribly or not taken care of, same goes with CD. The issue I have with Digital, if you loose it or don't have 3 back up drives your screwed that's why I haven't thrown out my CD collection just yet. The biggest issue I have with digital is the sit on your ass and pay from your listening chair, sorry but that is just bad for business and your health. I still like visiting record stores and CD stores, what I have been seeing lately is more kids in the CD store I frequent. I just think the pay and play model is killing local businesses. Look at video stores, CD stores most all gone now because everyone wants a huge deal and would rather order it from Amazon or Ebay. 
<<<<<<<< Ok way off track!
<<<<<<<< Ok way off track!MusicDirector
New member
- Joined
- May 21, 2013
- Messages
- 2,013
+1
Design Audio Video
New member
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2013
- Messages
- 294
Sorry Myles. I read that on someone's post. My point was it's all subjective and some hear different than others. If someone says a certain type of gear is the best it needs to be followed by "to my ears or in my room or system." What I'm trying to say is there are no absolute truths in this hobby. Sorry I did not mean to point you out on something you didn't say. I will go back and read the thread and make the correction. It is all fun to compare the differences and give opinions on all types of gear but when people start saying that something is the best I feel that it starts heated arguments.
Face
New member
Is this taking the love of tubes too far? anic:
anic:
Toobs
New member
Some say tubes are better and some say SS is better. It is what it is.
The same thing goes for vinyl vs. digital. The only bashing I see is members bashing members.
Mike, Joe and Mark
This thread needs to be closed before it creates a lot of hostilities that aren't necessary.
If I'm out of line for saying this, I apologize.
The same thing goes for vinyl vs. digital. The only bashing I see is members bashing members.
Mike, Joe and Mark
This thread needs to be closed before it creates a lot of hostilities that aren't necessary.
If I'm out of line for saying this, I apologize.
MDP
Behavior Moderator (be nice police!)
Bob, that's what I was trying to point out !
It's the same old shit, recycled. It does nothing for us on an intellectual level.
But some people enjoy arguing !
I say, go put on some music of your choosing and relax.
Toobs
New member
CDLehner
New member
Can't say I agree. I mean, it's not helping anything; you're right...it's Coke or Pepsi (even thought that debate is easy :lol
But it's not hurting anything either; not yet. And hopefully it's testament, to the members here. I think both "sides", have put forth their point magnanimously; and if anything, found common...rather than divisive ground.
Because at the end of the day...any true audio lover; and not just someone, shilling for an ideology...thinks, it's ALL good! :audiophile:
CPP
Active member
Can't say I agree. I mean, it's not helping anything; you're right...it's Coke or Pepsi (even thought that debate is easy :lol
But it's not hurting anything either; not yet. And hopefully it's testament, to the members here. I think both "sides", have put forth their point magnanimously; and if anything, found common...rather than divisive ground.
Because at the end of the day...any true audio lover; and not just someone, shilling for an ideology...thinks, it's ALL good! :audiophile:
Right now everything is cool. Kinda like testing the waters / doing recon. Nothing can kill a site faster like bashing, rudeness and those that "KNOW IT ALL"..
Currently I have a hunk of vinyl playing the Yardbirds 'Over Under Sideways Down', (US sleeve) so there :audiophile:, and using tubes
MDP
Behavior Moderator (be nice police!)
octadyndude
New member
Coke or Pepsi really sums it up. Just like Dyn and Raidho!! You know what I mean Chris - not worth going to the 'DogHouse' :roflmao:Can't say I agree. I mean, it's not helping anything; you're right...it's Coke or Pepsi (even thought that debate is easy :lol
But it's not hurting anything either; not yet. And hopefully it's testament, to the members here. I think both "sides", have put forth their point magnanimously; and if anything, found common...rather than divisive ground.
Because at the end of the day...any true audio lover; and not just someone, shilling for an ideology...thinks, it's ALL good! :audiophile:
audionirvana
New member
- Joined
- Jul 24, 2014
- Messages
- 82
Well I like drinking both mostly (Coke) = Dynaudio and then (Pepsi) the Raidho, nothing wrong like having both if you can, same goes with using Tubes and Digital! :snicker: George!
Jerome W
Active member
There are fanatics in both camps.
Some SS guys listen only to the bass when they listen to a tube amp, just to find reasons to hate them, and they just listen to pops and ticks when an LP is playing.
Some tube and analog lovers listen only to mids and treble when they listen to SS amps and digital, to find harshness and loss of naturalness to prove their opinions.
When REALLY listening to the music, one must admit that both camps can make great sound. The rest is just about details and personal preferences.
Envoyé de mon iPhone à l'aide de Tapatalk
Some SS guys listen only to the bass when they listen to a tube amp, just to find reasons to hate them, and they just listen to pops and ticks when an LP is playing.
Some tube and analog lovers listen only to mids and treble when they listen to SS amps and digital, to find harshness and loss of naturalness to prove their opinions.
When REALLY listening to the music, one must admit that both camps can make great sound. The rest is just about details and personal preferences.
Envoyé de mon iPhone à l'aide de Tapatalk
Glareskin
New member
I love this type of discussion as I think we all know it is useless. There is no absolute truth. I am very interested in all discussions about the great technologies that are available and the sound comparison between tubes and solid state, or class A against A/B or D, or DSD against PCM, vinyl against digital....
In the end all theories, all emotions you create with a product are vanishing once you start listening. Because I have the absolute best instruments to judge this.
1 My ears:
These instruments are fantastic. They register every sound aspect that is there: detail, clarity, dimensions, volume, depth, dynamics. And even though I am aging like all of us the functioning remains superior over the years, although I have to admit that there is a slight reduction in the highest frequency range.
2 My brain
The brain is even more capable than the ears. It is the DSP and that is also the tricky part as it has the ability to deceive. If you don't have the discipline to be honest to yourself the brain could tell you a sound is good because you have read all these great stories and theories and the product looks good. That is one of the reasons why I was so agreeable on the other thread on this forum which was called the three second rule.
I did teach myself to have the discipline to be honest. So I do know almost immediately if something sounds good or not. Yes I need more time to understand the full differentiation but the basic assessment is quick and correct. I will not tell myself that you have to grow into the sound or learn how to listen to a certain device or speakers. Sorry that is not how it works. What is correct though is that my brain over the years picked up the ability to detect where flaws are coming from. I can detect bad acoustical circumstances or influences of other parts of a chain.
My brain has also my sound preferences that I have created as a human being over the years.
And this is unique to me, even though a lot of audiophiles have a preference in the same direction.
So no matter what: I am always right
Now to come back to the bashing. I am 50 years old and I have a vinyl record collection that is between 2500 and 3000 albums and a similar size cd collection. I still feel fond of the vinyls and less of the cd's. And I still have my turntable and sold my SACD player 5 years ago as I have to say that streaming is superior to the CD in sound quality and the comfort of use.
I do play vinyls once in a while but my every day music listening is going through the Linn. Incredibly fluid and natural sounding and the ease of use with the amazing Lumin app is just making a difference.
Tube or solid state? I don't care. I want the sound that is good for me!
In the end all theories, all emotions you create with a product are vanishing once you start listening. Because I have the absolute best instruments to judge this.
1 My ears:
These instruments are fantastic. They register every sound aspect that is there: detail, clarity, dimensions, volume, depth, dynamics. And even though I am aging like all of us the functioning remains superior over the years, although I have to admit that there is a slight reduction in the highest frequency range.
2 My brain
The brain is even more capable than the ears. It is the DSP and that is also the tricky part as it has the ability to deceive. If you don't have the discipline to be honest to yourself the brain could tell you a sound is good because you have read all these great stories and theories and the product looks good. That is one of the reasons why I was so agreeable on the other thread on this forum which was called the three second rule.
I did teach myself to have the discipline to be honest. So I do know almost immediately if something sounds good or not. Yes I need more time to understand the full differentiation but the basic assessment is quick and correct. I will not tell myself that you have to grow into the sound or learn how to listen to a certain device or speakers. Sorry that is not how it works. What is correct though is that my brain over the years picked up the ability to detect where flaws are coming from. I can detect bad acoustical circumstances or influences of other parts of a chain.
My brain has also my sound preferences that I have created as a human being over the years.
And this is unique to me, even though a lot of audiophiles have a preference in the same direction.
So no matter what: I am always right
Now to come back to the bashing. I am 50 years old and I have a vinyl record collection that is between 2500 and 3000 albums and a similar size cd collection. I still feel fond of the vinyls and less of the cd's. And I still have my turntable and sold my SACD player 5 years ago as I have to say that streaming is superior to the CD in sound quality and the comfort of use.
I do play vinyls once in a while but my every day music listening is going through the Linn. Incredibly fluid and natural sounding and the ease of use with the amazing Lumin app is just making a difference.
Tube or solid state? I don't care. I want the sound that is good for me!
Jerome W
Active member
I love this type of discussion as I think we all know it is useless. There is no absolute truth. I am very interested in all discussions about the great technologies that are available and the sound comparison between tubes and solid state, or class A against A/B or D, or DSD against PCM, vinyl against digital....
In the end all theories, all emotions you create with a product are vanishing once you start listening. Because I have the absolute best instruments to judge this.
1 My ears:
These instruments are fantastic. They register every sound aspect that is there: detail, clarity, dimensions, volume, depth, dynamics. And even though I am aging like all of us the functioning remains superior over the years, although I have to admit that there is a slight reduction in the highest frequency range.
2 My brain
The brain is even more capable than the ears. It is the DSP and that is also the tricky part as it has the ability to deceive. If you don't have the discipline to be honest to yourself the brain could tell you a sound is good because you have read all these great stories and theories and the product looks good. That is one of the reasons why I was so agreeable on the other thread on this forum which was called the three second rule.
I did teach myself to have the discipline to be honest. So I do know almost immediately if something sounds good or not. Yes I need more time to understand the full differentiation but the basic assessment is quick and correct. I will not tell myself that you have to grow into the sound or learn how to listen to a certain device or speakers. Sorry that is not how it works. What is correct though is that my brain over the years picked up the ability to detect where flaws are coming from. I can detect bad acoustical circumstances or influences of other parts of a chain.
My brain has also my sound preferences that I have created as a human being over the years.
And this is unique to me, even though a lot of audiophiles have a preference in the same direction.
So no matter what: I am always right
Now to come back to the bashing. I am 50 years old and I have a vinyl record collection that is between 2500 and 3000 albums and a similar size cd collection. I still feel fond of the vinyls and less of the cd's. And I still have my turntable and sold my SACD player 5 years ago as I have to say that streaming is superior to the CD in sound quality and the comfort of use.
I do play vinyls once in a while but my every day music listening is going through the Linn. Incredibly fluid and natural sounding and the ease of use with the amazing Lumin app is just making a difference.
Tube or solid state? I don't care. I want the sound that is good for me!
Excellent Post !
Envoyé de mon iPhone à l'aide de Tapatalk
CPP
Active member
I love this type of discussion as I think we all know it is useless. There is no absolute truth. I am very interested in all discussions about the great technologies that are available and the sound comparison between tubes and solid state, or class A against A/B or D, or DSD against PCM, vinyl against digital....
In the end all theories, all emotions you create with a product are vanishing once you start listening. Because I have the absolute best instruments to judge this.
1 My ears:
These instruments are fantastic. They register every sound aspect that is there: detail, clarity, dimensions, volume, depth, dynamics. And even though I am aging like all of us the functioning remains superior over the years, although I have to admit that there is a slight reduction in the highest frequency range.
2 My brain
The brain is even more capable than the ears. It is the DSP and that is also the tricky part as it has the ability to deceive. If you don't have the discipline to be honest to yourself the brain could tell you a sound is good because you have read all these great stories and theories and the product looks good. That is one of the reasons why I was so agreeable on the other thread on this forum which was called the three second rule.
I did teach myself to have the discipline to be honest. So I do know almost immediately if something sounds good or not. Yes I need more time to understand the full differentiation but the basic assessment is quick and correct. I will not tell myself that you have to grow into the sound or learn how to listen to a certain device or speakers. Sorry that is not how it works. What is correct though is that my brain over the years picked up the ability to detect where flaws are coming from. I can detect bad acoustical circumstances or influences of other parts of a chain.
My brain has also my sound preferences that I have created as a human being over the years.
And this is unique to me, even though a lot of audiophiles have a preference in the same direction.
So no matter what: I am always right
Now to come back to the bashing. I am 50 years old and I have a vinyl record collection that is between 2500 and 3000 albums and a similar size cd collection. I still feel fond of the vinyls and less of the cd's. And I still have my turntable and sold my SACD player 5 years ago as I have to say that streaming is superior to the CD in sound quality and the comfort of use.
I do play vinyls once in a while but my every day music listening is going through the Linn. Incredibly fluid and natural sounding and the ease of use with the amazing Lumin app is just making a difference.
Tube or solid state? I don't care. I want the sound that is good for me!
Well said.
What you are describing is individuality , the quality that makes one person or thing different from all others.
- Status