JOB 225 2-channel Power Amplifier ... update ...

Welcome to the forum zizione, thank you for joining.
 
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zizione said:
Hi Guys,
I live in France, near the border with Switzerland, and my dealer has the Metis 7 available for listening. My brother-in-law came from a Metis 5 plus an Audio Synthesis DAC, and sold everything after listening to the Metis 7 to buy it. He found it very detailed, opened, very good drive. Unfortunately, although this pre-series is available, it won't be available for sale before February 2016 at earliest. Is it just the INT in the Goldmund case ?

I did listen to it last week as well. I have not been impressed as we couldn't make it sound properly on 2 different pairs of speakers (Focus Audio FP88 and Dali Epicon 6). The bass was blur, uncontrolled. But this might just have been a bad day from power supply perspective or whatever. I will have to give it another try. But it matches with the feedback I read on the INT on stereo.net.au and on that same forum, mentioning a bump in the bass at a normal volume.

I suspect that Goldmund has delayed its release date to correct this aspect, and maybe also to work on the overheating aspect that the INT seems to suffer from time to time.
Click to expand...


You are referring to the Job INT, correct? Not the Job Pre2.... Just making sure which piece of gear has the "issue".... :)
 
zizione said:
Hi Guys,
I live in France, near the border with Switzerland, and my dealer has the Metis 7 available for listening. My brother-in-law came from a Metis 5 plus an Audio Synthesis DAC, and sold everything after listening to the Metis 7 to buy it. He found it very detailed, opened, very good drive. Unfortunately, although this pre-series is available, it won't be available for sale before February 2016 at earliest. Is it just the INT in the Goldmund case ?

I did listen to it last week as well. I have not been impressed as we couldn't make it sound properly on 2 different pairs of speakers (Focus Audio FP88 and Dali Epicon 6). The bass was blur, uncontrolled. But this might just have been a bad day from power supply perspective or whatever. I will have to give it another try. But it matches with the feedback I read on the INT on stereo.net.au and on that same forum, mentioning a bump in the bass at a normal volume.

I suspect that Goldmund has delayed its release date to correct this aspect, and maybe also to work on the overheating aspect that the INT seems to suffer from time to time.
Click to expand...
Now THIS is some serious info! Thank you very much! Between the 225, INT and Gato Audio, INT is now my last choice.

Randy, he is referring to the INT.
 
I thought so. By the way, my 225 runs very cool. I had it on all day Christmas and it was warm, but not even uncomfortable to lay my hand on the heat sink!
 
zizione said:
I live in France, near the border with Switzerland, and my dealer has the Metis 7 available for listening.

although this pre-series is available, it won't be available for sale before February 2016 at earliest. Is it just the INT in the Goldmund case ?

The bass was blur, uncontrolled ... it matches with the feedback I read on the INT on stereo.net.au and on that same forum, mentioning a bump in the bass at a normal volume.

I suspect that Goldmund has delayed its release date to correct this aspect, and maybe also to work on the overheating aspect that the INT seems to suffer from time to time.
Click to expand...
It seems that Goldmund released just a very small number of Metis 7 amplifiers, and only locally, to a dealer(s) very close to Goldmund headquarters, and without promoting it.
It also seems to me that Goldmund released Metis 7 in cheaper and simpler box and called it JOB INTegrated.
Could it be that both moves are made as some sort of testing a new product, possibly still not 100% finalized, or something like that - prior to more massive production and promotion of Metis 7? Would that make any sense with a company of such a reputation?

Also, we tend to think how JOB INT is incredibly good deal, because it costs 7-8 times less than Metis 7, which is (almost) the same amp.
But is our logic turned upside-down?
Should we perhaps think instead how JOB INT is just a good amp with a fair price, while Metis 7 is incredibly overpriced, costing 7-8 times more than it should...?
 
Well I had reconfigured my system putting the DAC on top of the amplifier. Hey it is a nice fit and looks good there. Well I was driving the system quite a bit harder today and noticed that the job definitely heated up :D.... so I put the Teac back up on top the McIntosh :).... So it has a big old shelf all by itself... I hope it is happy... but the little bastard does sound good... (I find electronics work better if you lovingly cuss at them once in a while)....

Now on to my Pre-amplifier dilemma. The McIntosh is working fine, but after hearing how good the Job Amp sounds would I be getting better sound with a separate pre-amp versus using the McIntosh? Was looking at the Job Pre2 or the Conrad Johnson Classic 2. A tad worried about the gain and low volume control with the CJ.

Then that would leave me to sell the McIntosh. Arguably the finest headphone amplifier on the planet, with 192 kHz DAC built in, 50 WPC McIntosh amp built in, pre-outs, BLUE METERS :).... and a gorgeous little set of Black Piano finished McIntosh speakers. $6000 retail (would give someone a spectacular deal for a fast sale).

Or I could just continue using the mc as a pre-amp....

Any thoughts, opinions, insights? I would love to hear everyone's thoughts because I am not sure what to do on this one. Would I hear a big difference... I just got these real nice Wireworld XLR cables that could not be used with either the Job or the CJ pre-amp. I could use the Teac internal headphone amp so that is covered (although not as good as the McIntosh, of course)...

Please help me decide this one :)....
 
Randy

I would leave things alone for a month and see what you think then after the amp break-in and CES. Also be careful about the Job Pre as it was designed specifically for that amp. It would cause you the opposite problem with amps that have normal input sensitivity. My favorite with the Job is the W4S STP-SE, which has also worked great with amps up to 1.5v input sensitivity. Fully balanced in and out and usually available used for just over 1k. Was a mint one for sale on AudioCircle last week. I am going to order a set of the Rothwell Attenuators so I can run the Job with the ModWright pre when the weather warms back up and the tube amps go on vacation.
 
Randy Myers said:
Well I had reconfigured my system putting the DAC on top of the amplifier. Hey it is a nice fit and looks good there. Well I was driving the system quite a bit harder today and noticed that the job definitely heated up :D.... so I put the Teac back up on top the McIntosh :).... So it has a big old shelf all by itself... I hope it is happy... but the little bastard does sound good... (I find electronics work better if you lovingly cuss at them once in a while)....

Now on to my Pre-amplifier dilemma. The McIntosh is working fine, but after hearing how good the Job Amp sounds would I be getting better sound with a separate pre-amp versus using the McIntosh? Was looking at the Job Pre2 or the Conrad Johnson Classic 2. A tad worried about the gain and low volume control with the CJ.

Then that would leave me to sell the McIntosh. Arguably the finest headphone amplifier on the planet, with 192 kHz DAC built in, 50 WPC McIntosh amp built in, pre-outs, BLUE METERS :).... and a gorgeous little set of Black Piano finished McIntosh speakers. $6000 retail (would give someone a spectacular deal for a fast sale).

Or I could just continue using the mc as a pre-amp....

Any thoughts, opinions, insights? I would love to hear everyone's thoughts because I am not sure what to do on this one. Would I hear a big difference... I just got these real nice Wireworld XLR cables that could not be used with either the Job or the CJ pre-amp. I could use the Teac internal headphone amp so that is covered (although not as good as the McIntosh, of course)...

Please help me decide this one :)....
Click to expand...

I have tried (multiple times) to simplify my system and eliminate my standalone analog preamp but have always gone back to one. This is highly user and system dependent, but I certainly prefer the drive, dynamics and increase in soundstage that a good preamp brings. Take this with a grain of salt, as I've never used the unit you are working with, but have owned units from Wyred, Weiss, Aesthetix, Counterpoint, Levinson, Modwright (amoung many others).

Here's one idea... pick up a lightspeed attenuator. New they are around $300, used they are around $200, so not much at risk here. Use in in lieu of the Mc piece as your preamp - if you need multiple inputs, retain the Mc and feed the Lightspeed via fixed outputs on the Mc. This way the Mc is your dac and input swtich, with the Lightspeed unit acting as a VC unit. If you like the sound, you could leave the lightspeed in place, or experiment with other preamps later. The lightspeed becoming useful then if the preamp you try has gain > 10db or so - use it at the inputs of the 225 to bleed off some of that excess gain. This is what I did with my Modwright preamp in front of my 225 and I couldn't be happier.

Don't be put off by the low price, the lightspeed is a VERY good sounding piece of kit.
 
Jack said:
Randy

I would leave things alone for a month and see what you think then after the amp break-in and CES. Also be careful about the Job Pre as it was designed specifically for that amp. It would cause you the opposite problem with amps that have normal input sensitivity. My favorite with the Job is the W4S STP-SE, which has also worked great with amps up to 1.5v input sensitivity. Fully balanced in and out and usually available used for just over 1k. Was a mint one for sale on AudioCircle last week. I am going to order a set of the Rothwell Attenuators so I can run the Job with the ModWright pre when the weather warms back up and the tube amps go on vacation.
Click to expand...

I don't have a Job amp, but I do have the W4S STP-SE and its a nice pre-amp.
 
Jack said:
Randy

I would leave things alone for a month and see what you think then after the amp break-in and CES. Also be careful about the Job Pre as it was designed specifically for that amp. It would cause you the opposite problem with amps that have normal input sensitivity. My favorite with the Job is the W4S STP-SE, which has also worked great with amps up to 1.5v input sensitivity. Fully balanced in and out and usually available used for just over 1k. Was a mint one for sale on AudioCircle last week. I am going to order a set of the Rothwell Attenuators so I can run the Job with the ModWright pre when the weather warms back up and the tube amps go on vacation.
Click to expand...

Hi Jack, if you're only considering passive attenuation, the EVS Ultimate Attenuators or Endler Attenuators would be worth hunting for (may require some patience to locate a set). When I was looking for an attenuator to use at the 225 inputs (so, like you, I could use my Modwright preamp with the 225), I contacted Rick at EVS to try to talk him into making me a set, and he pointed me to the Lightspeed unit, which has worked out very well for me.
 
srosenberg said:
I have tried (multiple times) to simplify my system and eliminate my standalone analog preamp but have always gone back to one. This is highly user and system dependent, but I certainly prefer the drive, dynamics and increase in soundstage that a good preamp brings. Take this with a grain of salt, as I've never used the unit you are working with, but have owned units from Wyred, Weiss, Aesthetix, Counterpoint, Levinson, Modwright (amoung many others).

Here's one idea... pick up a lightspeed attenuator. New they are around $300, used they are around $200, so not much at risk here. Use in in lieu of the Mc piece as your preamp - if you need multiple inputs, retain the Mc and feed the Lightspeed via fixed outputs on the Mc. This way the Mc is your dac and input swtich, with the Lightspeed unit acting as a VC unit. If you like the sound, you could leave the lightspeed in place, or experiment with other preamps later. The lightspeed becoming useful then if the preamp you try has gain > 10db or so - use it at the inputs of the 225 to bleed off some of that excess gain. This is what I did with my Modwright preamp in front of my 225 and I couldn't be happier.

Don't be put off by the low price, the lightspeed is a VERY good sounding piece of kit.
Click to expand...

I appreciate the input. All sources go into the Teac as it stands now. Really just an optical out from the CD player and USB from the Surface Pro 3. The Teac feeds the McIntosh through the XLRs and the McIntosh is the volume control and remote at this point. So the lightspeed would be hooked up to the Teac outputs it sounds like.

That might be worth investigating because then I could sell the McIntosh and be able to use the lightspeed to bleed off a little extra gain later depending on pre-amp... not a bad thought.
 
I was going to use the "source side" Rothwell's as I still need to be able to us the Vandersteen HP filters on the amp side. They seem to have a lot of good reviews and satisfied owners for many years so probably worth the $50 gamble. No rush though as I have a few months before the heat gets bad again.
 
Jack said:
Randy

I would leave things alone for a month and see what you think then after the amp break-in and CES. Also be careful about the Job Pre as it was designed specifically for that amp. It would cause you the opposite problem with amps that have normal input sensitivity. My favorite with the Job is the W4S STP-SE, which has also worked great with amps up to 1.5v input sensitivity. Fully balanced in and out and usually available used for just over 1k. Was a mint one for sale on AudioCircle last week. I am going to order a set of the Rothwell Attenuators so I can run the Job with the ModWright pre when the weather warms back up and the tube amps go on vacation.
Click to expand...

Would these work as well as the Rothwell Attenuators?http://www.amazon.com/Harrison-Labs...mr0&keywords=Rothwell+RCA+In-Line+Attenuators Amazon UK has the Rothwell, but in US these are what they have... can get in 6 db or 12 db...
 
Randy

I would tend to trust the ones from Rothwell more as they specialize in Preamps and Phono Preamps. In addition their product has been around for over a decade and been tested by many of the respected British and European publications. I am only familiar with Harrison from the in-line speaker HP filters used in the Auto Stereo arena. The Rothwell owner/designer participates in several of the forums and will respond if you e-mail him.
 
Thank you Jack,

I just order a pair from Rothwell. Even if I stick with the Mc for now they will be a good addition since I have the McIntosh trimmed to -6 dB and it still could use a little more.
 
Randy

Are the Mc's adjustors trimming to total output or in input from each source? I'll order my pair closer to the time to put the tube amps away for the Summer. Interested in what you think about them.
 
Jack said:
I was going to use the "source side" Rothwell's as I still need to be able to us the Vandersteen HP filters on the amp side. They seem to have a lot of good reviews and satisfied owners for many years so probably worth the $50 gamble. No rush though as I have a few months before the heat gets bad again.
Click to expand...

Are you using the X2's or M5-HP filters?
 
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