Magico S5 mk2

[LVB]

However, looking at e.g. Ayre, and how they allow their products to keep their value for many years through reasonably priced upgrades, there is a logic and working model available that could be leveraged. I guess it is no news to current Magico owners, that based on the current model are a rather bad investment, e.g. when considering what is the going price for pre-owned V3s nowadays.

Magico used prices, on an average, are as good (or bad) as any other high-end brand (in fact quite better than some, see Alexandria X2 on AG for $51K, or a typical Raidho or the big YG for 70% off ). I looked at Ayre, again, same as the rest averaging ~50% discount (Magico on an average is actually doing better). The V3 is 8 years old, and hold their value better than a similar era WP7 or Focal.

But hey, don't let the facts ruin your story

 

[bzr]

Magico used prices, on an average, are as good (or bad) as any other high-end brand (in fact quite better than some, see Alexandria X2 on AG for $51K, or a typical Raidho or the big YG for 70% off ). I looked at Ayre, again, same as the rest averaging ~50% discount (Magico on an average is actually doing better). The V3 is 8 years old, and hold their value better than a similar era WP7 or Focal.

But hey, don't let the facts ruin your story

There are no facts in audiophile land, we all see differently with our ears! :hey:

 

[the professor]

I read his statement as:

If a company has reasonably priced upgrades, then you don't have to sell your "old" model at a loss and then buy the new model. Thus saving a whole bunch of money to get the latest and greatest.

Like Magico did with the Q7 upgrade.

Magico used prices, on an average, are as good (or bad) as any other high-end brand (in fact quite better than some, see Alexandria X2 on AG for $51K, or a typical Raidho or the big YG for 70% off ). I looked at Ayre, again, same as the rest averaging ~50% discount (Magico on an average is actually doing better). The V3 is 8 years old, and hold their value better than a similar era WP7 or Focal.

But hey, don't let the facts ruin your story

 

[Elberoth]

Adam, why settle for second best for sake of a few months. There are many brands out there so worth having there is always a 3 month waiting list. By a pair of PSB's for now.

You are probably right. I usually keep the speakers for no less than 3 years. 3 months will not make that much of a difference. I will borrow something just for the time beeing.

I just paid a deposit for the S5 mk 2

 

[Elberoth]

However, looking at e.g. Ayre, and how they allow their products to keep their value for many years through reasonably priced upgrades, there is a logic and working model available that could be leveraged.

It is easier to upgrade the amp or a DAC than it is to upgrade the speakers. Often all that is needed is a small PCB change.

In case of the S5, they have changed ALL the drive units (which probably means that also the x-over got reworked) plus they changed the top and bottom plates of the enclosure, so there is very little left unchanged - front, side panels and maybe some internal bracing. That's it. The upgrade would have to cost as much as the speaker itself.

 

[Alpinist]

You are probably right. I usually keep the speakers for no less than 3 years. 3 months will not make that much of a difference. I will borrow something just for the time beeing.

I just paid a deposit for the S5 mk 2

Smart move, Adam. The best things in life are worth waiting for.

And that will give them a few months to work any bugs out.

Best,
Ken

 

[Kuoppis]

It is easier to upgrade the amp or a DAC than it is to upgrade the speakers. Often all that is needed is a small PCB change.

In case of the S5, they have changed ALL the drive units (which probably means that also the x-over got reworked) plus they changed the top and bottom plates of the enclosure, so there is very little left unchanged - front, side panels and maybe some internal bracing. That's it. The upgrade would have to cost as much as the speaker itself.

I guess you are right, an upgrade is usually not easy.

And your point about the cost of an upgrade is very sensible, if everything is changed everything needs to be paid. In case of the Ayre KX-Rs the upgrade costs 50% of the original, as the casework is kept and several of the key components on the inside are changed. In case of the Ayre QB-9 DAC, in the latest "upgrade", they changed even the DAC chip, so it is essentially a new product. Nevertheless there is there is always the benefit of not having to sell the old gear. That I find a bit bothersome.

This is a crazy hobby afterall, which has very little to do with rational thinking. Spending the price of a car on a component is for sure not very smart. But well, you either get on the bus or off the bus .

 

[Kuoppis]

I read his statement as:

If a company has reasonably priced upgrades, then you don't have to sell your "old" model at a loss and then buy the new model. Thus saving a whole bunch of money to get the latest and greatest.

Like Magico did with the Q7 upgrade.

Well observed . I think the Q7 are a good example.

 

[Alpinist]

Well observed . I think the Q7 are a good example.

Yes, the Q7 mk2 upgrade was a great job by Magico and certainly not the path of least resistance.

Ken

 

[Kuoppis]

Is it possible the hype is deserved? Have you heard the S7?

I guess that is a question of personal preference. As already a second time Magico owner, I love their design, believe in their engineering and enjoy their sound. No question about that. While I complain about the hype, I also do enjoy it and read all the writings .

Magico is a phantastic marketing company as well, way better than most of the high-end joints. But the question is what is too much. Sometimes, when you are truly outstanding, a little understatement is way cooler. E.g. while the M-Project is probably the most exciting speaker out there currently, in many people's eyes JVs 4-article series about it discredited the author, the magazine and the brand. In comparison, Rolls-Royce technical specs typically refer to any model's horsepower as "sufficient". In case of the S7, there has been a lots of marketing, but no reviews yet. Personally, I would have waited a bit before announcing the S5 mk2, as some of the S7 energy will now evaporate.

I heard the S7 in Munich, not for very long, not in the best conditions, not in their best demo (phase glitch). So, I will have to set aside time for a more quiet demo. But as a concept they are exciting.

What also needs to be understood now, is what we will get with the S5 mk2 in comparison to the S7. I personally preferred the S3 to the original S5 due to the improved midrange. And as I am not a bass head, I am not sure whether I will need three 10" woofers instead of two (also, I'm not sure whether the S7 also features the graphene coating in the woofers as announed for the S5 mk2 or if they are just aluminum). For me personally the S5 mk2 is now the most exciting product in the line-up (also strongly prefer the new design, just love it), while the S7 is yesterday's news. In European scoccer terms, when someone puts the ball in their own net, we call that an own-goal.

 

[Myles B. Astor]

I guess that is a question of personal preference. As already a second time Magico owner, I love their design, believe in their engineering and enjoy their sound. No question about that. While I complain about the hype, I also do enjoy it and read all the writings .

Magico is a phantastic marketing company as well, way better than most of the high-end joints. But the question is what is too much. Sometimes, when you are truly outstanding, a little understatement is way cooler. E.g. while the M-Project is probably the most exciting speaker out there currently, in many people's eyes JVs 4-article series about it discredited the author, the magazine and the brand. In comparison, Rolls-Royce technical specs typically refer to any model's horsepower as "sufficient". In case of the S7, there has been a lots of marketing, but no reviews yet. Personally, I would have waited a bit before announcing the S5 mk2, as some of the S7 energy will now evaporate.

I heard the S7 in Munich, not for very long, not in the best conditions, not in their best demo (phase glitch). So, I will have to set aside time for a more quiet demo. But as a concept they are exciting.

What also needs to be understood now, is what we will get with the S5 mk2 in comparison to the S7. I personally preferred the S3 to the original S5 due to the improved midrange. And as I am not a bass head, I am not sure whether I will need three 10" woofers instead of two (also, I'm not sure whether the S7 also features the graphene coating in the woofers as announed for the S5 mk2 or if they are just aluminum). For me personally the S5 mk2 is now the most exciting product in the line-up (also strongly prefer the new design, just love it), while the S7 is yesterday's news. In European scoccer terms, when someone puts the ball in their own net, we call that an own-goal.

This should answer your woofer question. It's more than quantity.

http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/magico-s7/

No hype, this is a totally new speaker. So good, technology here (as with the Mpro) is going to trickle up and down. What would people want Magico, a technology driven company to do? Sit on this new groundbreaking technology? (Note there are other speakers too using very new technology for their speaker drivers too. I think when people really get to hear the new versions, they will be amazed at the price/performance ratio.

 

[Kuoppis]

You see, Myles, you already proved me wrong. I should have said full reviews .

As you had the opportunity for a 1:1 comparison between the S7 and the old S5, the interesting question now is, how would the S5 mk2 and S7 compare. If I have understood correctly, the S5 mk2 should feature many of the innovations as well, which were introduced earlier in the S7.

Maybe you have to re-do your comparison...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Myles B. Astor]

You see, Myles, you already proved me wrong. I should have said full reviews .

As you had the opportunity for a 1:1 comparison between the S7 and the old S5, the interesting question now is, how would the S5 mk2 and S7 compare. If I have understood correctly, the S5 mk2 should feature many of the innovations as well, which were introduced earlier in the S7.

Maybe you have to re-do your comparison...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yes, it's too bad the new S5 wasn't ready when I was out at Magicos in August. I'm sure that Bob @ Rhapsody will probably have the new S5 Mk. 2 when its available.

You know the real problem is that technology is moving at pace that people are uncomfortable with. You buy a DAC or transport and its obsolete before you plug it in. In fact, there may be a new digital format before you plug it in.

 

[asiufy]

Magico used prices, on an average, are as good (or bad) as any other high-end brand (in fact quite better than some, see Alexandria X2 on AG for $51K, or a typical Raidho or the big YG for 70% off ). I looked at Ayre, again, same as the rest averaging ~50% discount (Magico on an average is actually doing better). The V3 is 8 years old, and hold their value better than a similar era WP7 or Focal.

But hey, don't let the facts ruin your story

LVB,

I don't know where you saw big YGs for 70% off. I monitor Audiogon frequently. Right now, there's not a single current production YG in there, and there hasn't been for quite a while.

Can't say the same thing for Magicos, Focal, Wilson, etc.

 

[Elberoth]

And as I am not a bass head, I am not sure whether I will need three 10" woofers instead of two (also, I'm not sure whether the S7 also features the graphene coating in the woofers as announed for the S5 mk2 or if they are just aluminum).

As far as I understand the whole nanotubes / graphene technology, the nanotubes - and now the graphene - are used as an additive to the resin that holds carbon fibre together (carbon fibre by itself is a soft fabric; to make it stiff you need to soak it in resin; adding nanotubes powder changes the mechanical properties of the resin). As the woofers' diaphragms are made from aluminium, it is not possible to coat them. The only part of the woofer where graphene could be applied, is the dust cap, which is made from carbon fibre.

 

[Rhapsody]

Yes, it's too bad the new S5 wasn't ready when I was out at Magicos in August. I'm sure that Bob @ Rhapsody will probably have the new S5 Mk. 2 when its available.

You know the real problem is that technology is moving at pace that people are uncomfortable with. You buy a DAC or transport and its obsolete before you plug it in. In fact, there may be a new digital format before you plug it in.

Our S7's are fully broken in and our S5II's are scheduled to ship in about a month from now.....time will tell. And Myles, thx for the free commercial

 

[Mike]

As far as I understand the whole nanotubes / graphene technology, the nanotubes - and now the graphene - are used as an additive to the resin that holds carbon fibre together (carbon fibre by itself is a soft fabric; to make it stiff you need to soak it in resin; adding nanotubes powder changes the mechanical properties of the resin). As the woofers' diaphragms are made from aluminium, it is not possible to coat them. The only part of the woofer where graphene could be applied, is the dust cap, which is made from carbon fibre.

Thanks for the explanation Adam, I was wondering about that.

 

[CharlesL]

You are probably right. I usually keep the speakers for no less than 3 years. 3 months will not make that much of a difference. I will borrow something just for the time beeing.

I just paid a deposit for the S5 mk 2

Wow congrats !:congrats:
I consider the S5 one of my best audio investment as it gave me tons of enjoyment over the last 2.5 years.

 

[Elberoth]

Thanks for the explanation Adam, I was wondering about that.

[h=3]The following errors occurred with your submission[/h]

• Mike has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space.

 

[Mike]

[h=3]The following errors occurred with your submission[/h]

• Mike has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space.

HA! I just deleted some old messages.