High-End Audio - Obsolete?

Shadowfax said:
Bill, that is all correct. The original thread over at AVS is more about HE being dead, which it clearly is not.

Just because some cannot appreciate or afford it, does not deem it dead, just for them.

I surely cannot (choose not) to afford it, but I am still here appreciating all the good gear that I know is far superior than anything I have ever had or have now. We shall see about the future.
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We might add a special category of equipment enthusiast however, many of whom aren't strictly dumpster divers: those would be the vintage equipment lovers. Often it's the aesthetic they love, not the sound so much, e.g. what's not to love about this face ...

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Or this one ...

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I've heard too many collections of expensive audio gear that only reproduced sound but not music, and I heard some reasonably priced audio systems that could sing. No, these did not have the dynamics, frequency extension and microdetails of a top-shelf system but imaging and tonal accuracy were there, as were PRaT.
My friends and colleagues sometimes ask me to "build" a system for them, at various price points and with different acoustic priorities, and I can assure you that indeed, now is an excellent time to build good systems at resonable price points. And let me tell you something: I am much happier when I have to put together a good system under a tight budget than when I'm given free reign over a wad of ca$h.
 
Can someone please define High-End Audio? :) $250,000/pair of tube monoblocks? - $60,000/pair of speakers? - $20,000 turntable?
...$10,000-30,000 CD player? ...$5,000 stereo preamp? ...$500 asynchronous USB DAC (jitter-free)? ...$200/pair of monitors?
...$50/pair of analog interconnects? ...$20/pair of lockin' bananas? ...$5 AC termination (plug)?

...$55 HD music tracks (hi-res music download for one album)? ...$40 for a remastered LP 200gr @ 45rpm?
...$30 for a SACD or Blu-ray Audio? ...$20 for a CD?

What is high-end audio exactly, and is it the same for you, I, her, him, and the rest of them?
Are there various levels of high-end audio?

Does money come into the equation? Or is it most importantly about quality music recordings, and in combination with quality audio gear to reproduce it faithfully in all its fidelity?

Where does it all start and where does it all end, or is there truly a limit to high-end, or the sky's the limit?

Is high-end audio obsolete; I'd say no, and it never will. ...Till audio forums keep existing on the Internet, and that high-end audio dealers keep fructifying.
...And that people like Wizard have their blogs available to everyone. ...Man, does it have some cool toys there! ...And most of it quite sophisticated, European (French, German, Italian, Scandinavian, Mediterranean, ...), extremely good looking with accent of silver, gold, titanium, diamonds, emeralds, exquisitely exquisite and unique, beautifully designed and not so cheap either, ...just super attractive and bewitching.
That, is that also part of high-end audio? ...To me it certainly is; exclusivity. ...For the people in search of a higher audio level with a firm statement to enunciate.

...And it is also true from the people at a lower echelon of the entire audio spectrum. ...Sweet music to our ears is a very relative/sensory emancipation.
And it is in the ears of the listeners that personal emotions are truly developed and formed.

High-end audio: From the artists performing, to the recording engineers, to the mechanical devices reproducing the music, to the ears of the listeners in their own environment and with their own unique vibrating/emotional chords of their soul.
 
High-end audio is a class of consumer home audio equipment marketed to audiophiles on the basis of high price or quality, and esoteric or novel sound reproduction technologies. The term can refer simply to the price, to the build quality of the components, or to the subjective or objective quality of sound reproduction

High-end audio equipment can be extremely expensive. It is sometimes referred to as cost-no-object equipment. Audiophile equipment can run the gamut from budget to high-end in terms of price range.
 
High End audio obsolete, Nah,,, the people that purchase High End cars, high end cameras, high end houses high end watches, high end shoes, clothes, art, coffee will still buy high end audio. Seriously, high end audio is alive for those that can afford what the manufactures consider their best. Even a lowly underpaid worker can purchase high end audio. In the end, it's all about the music and how one hears it using whatever means is at their disposal.
 
^^^ +1

Funny thing is, I have come across those that trash HE gear and in turn post about their $10k watches that don't tell time any better than a $50 Timex. At least for the most part, HE gear does outperform mass market gear.
 
Shadowfax said:
^^^ +1

Funny thing is, I have come across those that trash HE gear and in turn post about their $10k watches that don't tell time any better than a $50 Timex. At least for the most part, HE gear does outperform mass market gear.
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That's the point isn't it? Technology by itself will never make high-end obsolete, whether watches or audio or whatever. There will always be some people able & willing to pay a lot more for a little more performance -- or cachet.

There always has and always will be producers of high-end goods. The economics are simple: when people are able & willing to pay a lot more, niche producers can use higher grade inputs, more expensive, labor intensive production processes, and (at the same time), command higher margins.

But there have never been so many makers high-end audio equipment, etc., as today. And there is a sound, economic reason. In this day & age of widening income gaps and stagnating middle-class incomes, the ballooning wealth of a few tempts (or drives) producers to create even more expensive, higher margins wares.
 
Shadowfax said:
Ah, I confused AVS with AK, my bad. AK is where the dumpster divers roam.
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Yeah, I was going to ask you about that.;)
All gear is obsolete the minute you un-box it by straight definition in these times. To some folks the piece you bought 2 minutes ago is obsolete before you get it home.
Personally, everything I have is not obsolete and obsolete at the same time. If it still serves me and I like it and enjoy it, it is NOT obsolete in that sense. Technically speaking it was obsolete one minute after purchase
 
Shadowfax said:
^^^ +1

Funny thing is, I have come across those that trash HE gear and in turn post about their $10k watches that don't tell time any better than a $50 Timex. At least for the most part, HE gear does outperform mass market gear.
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Not always. Sometimes one pays a lot more for the same thing with a different badge. Not always the case of course, but does come up from time to time.
 
CPP said:
High End audio obsolete, Nah,,, the people that purchase High End cars, high end cameras, high end houses high end watches, high end shoes, clothes, art, coffee will still buy high end audio. Seriously, high end audio is alive for those that can afford what the manufactures consider their best. Even a lowly underpaid worker can purchase high end audio. In the end, it's all about the music and how one hears it using whatever means is at their disposal.
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Agree! Except the part about an underpaid worker being able to purchase high end audio. I am that and my ability to purchase high-end is nowhere near everyday reality. On the other hand, I guess if one was able to save away a little each month or something then he or she could purchase a high end piece eventually. I'm not sure that anything I have is considered HE, but if it is, that's how I got it. Worth it in the end? Hmm, I can't say yes and can't say no either. Then again, I'm not into gear, gives me a headache.
 
MusicDirector said:
Agree! Except the part about an underpaid worker being able to purchase high end audio. I am that and my ability to purchase high-end is nowhere near everyday reality. On the other hand, I guess if one was able to save away a little each month or something then he or she could purchase a high end piece eventually. I'm not sure that anything I have is considered HE, but if it is, that's how I got it. Worth it in the end? Hmm, I can't say yes and can't say no either. Then again, I'm not into gear, gives me a headache.
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Ha! :D If I saved what I could every month, it would take me 50 year to save for a pair of Raidho D3's; (that's allowing for interest accumulation).
 
Feanor said:
Ha! :D If I saved what I could every month, it would take me 50 year to save for a pair of Raidho D3's; (that's allowing for interest accumulation).
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That's me too. That's why I said "eventually". I was trying to allow for any range of time. Took me almost 2 years of saving (and some sacrifice) to get my Paradigms if that's any indication.
No idea what Raidho D3s go for, but I imagine it's in the tens of thousands. For me it wouldn't be 50 years, it would be a non-starter.
 
CPP said:
High End audio obsolete, Nah,,, the people that purchase High End cars, high end cameras, high end houses high end watches, high end shoes, clothes, art, coffee will still buy high end audio. Seriously, high end audio is alive for those that can afford what the manufactures consider their best. Even a lowly underpaid worker can purchase high end audio. In the end, it's all about the music and how one hears it using whatever means is at their disposal.
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You sir, got the essence! In a world of capitalism, high-end everything is accessible to the high-end people. ...Not necessarily better but for sure more expensive.
Even drug lords have access to high-end audio and everything else including high-end girls.
 
If I was extremely well off (multi-billionaire), I would put my money into improving our air quality, feeding the poor, giving shelter to the unfortunate ones, get rid of all the bad dictators, give access to health care for everyone, cut the pollution levels across the globe, get rid of wars and guns, work with all enemies who preach hatred and destruction and terrorism, resolve all major issues including pharmaceutical companies who don't care about the well being of our societies but only to enrich their own selves, intervene in the drug cartels and clean up, get rid of all the violent gangs, teach the criminals the true values of life, teach our politicians and economists and insurance companies and lawyers what true respect and integrity mean towards living in a peaceful and better world, teach the congress and law makers the first priorities in our planet, share my wealth, reassemble the other 1% of all the richest people in the world and ask them to contribute in my beneficial goals for the best of everyone living on the same planet.

Just my idea of how I can fix few things that don't work so well and don't make good sense at all.

But high-end audio will never die; it will never become obsolete, and that is the reality, whatever we like it or not.
And from all my good goals enumerated above, things will get worse before they get better; I'm not a multi-billionaire, and before some of them fully wake up that'll be the day!

Enjoy the music, for what it is in all simplicity and satisfaction. :audiophile:
 
MusicDirector said:
That's me too. That's why I said "eventually". I was trying to allow for any range of time. Took me almost 2 years of saving (and some sacrifice) to get my Paradigms if that's any indication.
No idea what Raidho D3s go for, but I imagine it's in the tens of thousands. For me it wouldn't be 50 years, it would be a non-starter.
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It's no secret that 'the professor' has a pair D3's for sale for US$39,000 (as of Apr. 29th). A good price, no doubt.
 
To clarify - Jock has two pairs of D3's (one rev one being upgraded to rev two) and one new pair of rev two.


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There is High-End, and then there is "high-end"!

Buying a $20.000 Zenith with the mythological El Primero inside is High-End while buying a $20.000 Hublot watch with a lowly ETA 7750 inside is "high-end".

Buying a pair of $120.000 Boulder 3050 monoblocks is High-End while buying a pair of $275.000 Wavac distortion generators is "high-end".

Buying top-level technology and manufacturing skills is High-End while buying bling and esoteric claims not backed up by anything but rave reviews in S'phile is "high-end".

Unfortunately, the more idiots buy "high-end" the more manufacturers of High-End products will suffer. So I guess we all have to step in and loudly cry out that sometimes the emperor has no clothes!
 
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