Switched to Class D or get left behind?

Mechnutt said:
I have heard the Atma-Sphere class D monos at a friend's house and in my system. My friend also owns a pair of his tube monos that sell for over $20k. It is not even close, the tube amps sound so much better. He sold the class d amps and kept the tube amps. I also much preferred my Pass X250 over the Class d amps. I am not saying that the D amps were bad, its just that the other amps are better.
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You are wasting your time trying to talk to him about Class D. He thinks his NAD Class D is the savior of the world, we who use SET's are killing the world environment and are irresponsible for using tubes, and refuses to accept other people like different sound.

"
"Hear Here said:
Ralph has seen the light and states his main reason for going down the Class D route is sound quality. I wonder if he also recognises that price is so much lower than his very costly OTL valve amps that he is unlikely to stay in business if he offers only these costly monsters!"

Let's have some honestly in this thread: In talking with other ultra high end manufacturers who are now slowly moving from tube to hybrid and other tech, they will openly admit it has NOTHING to do with admitting Class D is 'better' and everything to do (as they openly admit) with the difficulty in a constant supply of the tubes they need.
 
As with most of our beloved hobby, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, both visually and audibly. And we are all entitled to our own likes and dislikes.

I like a little warmth in my sound, having musical tastes dating to the 60s and 70s, growing up listening to a 50s McIntosh system. But not too much. But the gear that I have listened to that was described as "precise", etc, was always too "thin" and "dry" for my liking.

My happy medium is 95db speakers, with good digital and analog front, using a good tube pre and the Atma-Sphere Class D mono blocks. I also like how the mono blocks are small, easy to move, and don't take an hour to warm up and sound "the best". Now that I live in Seattle, Class A heat is not an issue.

The bigger Atma-Sphere OTL amps just have too many tubes for my liking. As @Michaels HiFi stated above, quality tubes will become more difficult to source over time, and the price is rising.
 
Bones13 said:
As with most of our beloved hobby, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, both visually and audibly. And we are all entitled to our own likes and dislikes.

I like a little warmth in my sound, having musical tastes dating to the 60s and 70s, growing up listening to a 50s McIntosh system. But not too much. But the gear that I have listened to that was described as "precise", etc, was always too "thin" and "dry" for my liking.

My happy medium is 95db speakers, with good digital and analog front, using a good tube pre and the Atma-Sphere Class D mono blocks. I also like how the mono blocks are small, easy to move, and don't take an hour to warm up and sound "the best". Now that I live in Seattle, Class A heat is not an issue.

The bigger Atma-Sphere OTL amps just have too many tubes for my liking. As @Michaels HiFi stated above, quality tubes will become more difficult to source over time, and the price is rising.
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Why I went hybrid with the Canor AI 2.10, I also have my Qualiton X200 I fire up for the 60 days of winter we get in TX 😆
 
Maybe it’s just the musings of an old guy, but I find myself wondering if there really is such a thing as a “best” anything in audio, or if everything is just a matter of preference. Extended periods of focused attention are long known to create new neural pathways in the brain. That’s what audio freaks do, but our listening habits are as varied as we are. We listen to different music on different systems in different acoustic environments, so the development of those neural pathways is unique to the individual. We may hear via the same mechanisms, but we can’t help but process what we hear differently. That being the case, it’s unsurprising that no consensus exists in this hobby beyond a dead short is a bad thing. We all have different conceptions of what a “perfect” system should sound like.

Viva les differences.
 
2FarGone said:
Maybe it’s just the musings of an old guy, but I find myself wondering if there really is such a thing as a “best” anything in audio, or if everything is just a matter of preference. Extended periods of focused attention are long known to create new neural pathways in the brain. That’s what audio freaks do, but our listening habits are as varied as we are. We listen to different music on different systems in different acoustic environments, so the development of those neural pathways is unique to the individual. We may hear via the same mechanisms, but we can’t help but process what we hear differently. That being the case, it’s unsurprising that no consensus exists in this hobby beyond a dead short is a bad thing. We all have different conceptions of what a “perfect” system should sound like.

Viva les differences.
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Very well said. Two “Audiophiles” arguing over what sounds better, whether it’s amplifier class, tubes versus solid state, whatever, is generally just dancing on a conceptual pinhead. When someone says this sounds “better” and do not add the qualifier “to my ears” I’m pretty skeptical because the only certainty is how it sounds to you and if someone else says it sounds different to them, you have no compelling way to dispute that.

Some people like the sound of death metal. I know that death metal is an abomination against the human race, but I can’t prove it.
2FarGone said:
Maybe it’s just the musings of an old guy, but I find myself wondering if there really is such a thing as a “best” anything in audio, or if everything is just a matter of preference. Extended periods of focused attention are long known to create new neural pathways in the brain. That’s what audio freaks do, but our listening habits are as varied as we are. We listen to different music on different systems in different acoustic environments, so the development of those neural pathways is unique to the individual. We may hear via the same mechanisms, but we can’t help but process what we hear differently. That being the case, it’s unsurprising that no consensus exists in this hobby beyond a dead short is a bad thing. We all have different conceptions of what a “perfect” system should sound like.

Viva les differences.
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Very well said. Audiophiles debating what sounds better, whether it’s amplifiers, tubes versus solid state, whatever, is generally just dancing on a conceptual pinhead. It might be interesting, but there is no objectively correct conclusion. When I hear someone say this sounds “better“ without adding the qualifier “to my ears“ I’m skeptical. Stating a subjective preference as an objective truth is a logical fallacy. I can only say with certainty what sounds best to me. I cannot possibly know how it sounds to you.

Iknow, for example, that death metal is an abomination against the human race. I can’t prove it though.
 
2FarGone said:
Maybe it’s just the musings of an old guy, but I find myself wondering if there really is such a thing as a “best” anything in audio, or if everything is just a matter of preference. Extended periods of focused attention are long known to create new neural pathways in the brain. That’s what audio freaks do, but our listening habits are as varied as we are. We listen to different music on different systems in different acoustic environments, so the development of those neural pathways is unique to the individual. We may hear via the same mechanisms, but we can’t help but process what we hear differently. That being the case, it’s unsurprising that no consensus exists in this hobby beyond a dead short is a bad thing. We all have different conceptions of what a “perfect” system should sound like.

Viva les differences.
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I agree and well said.

I personally don't believe there is the best of anything nor do I need the best. I simply want to enjoy the journey.

Maybe that's why the ASR people I view as such nitwits: they want to argue about meaningless numbers and tell us how we're wrong rather than just letting us listen to the music and enjoy what we prefer.
 
Michaels HiFi said:
I agree and well said.

I personally don't believe there is the best of anything nor do I need the best. I simply want to enjoy the journey.

Maybe that's why the ASR people I view as such nitwits: they want to argue about meaningless numbers and tell us how we're wrong rather than just letting us listen to the music and enjoy what we prefer.
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Calling people names because they have a differing opinion or beliefs achieves what?
More discord. We all have differing opinions and tastes.
 
RepublicOfTexas69 said:
Calling people names because they have a differing opinion or beliefs achieves what?
More discord. We all have differing opinions and tastes.
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Agreed.

In this instance I'm referencing the fact that they are generally by and large an extremely hostile and uneducated crowd that act like a cult and don't care to have a true two way conversation.

Have you ever watched someone on the ASR forum try to have a debate with them and watch what happens? Many times Amir will simply delete and ban them for having a differing opinion.

Have you ever tried to explain to them it's not "1's and 0's" in digital audio? Or how you can hear a difference in cables?

It's impossible to converse with any of them as they can't accept people have a different opinion.

I feel comfortable referring to that behavior by them as that of a nitwit.
 
Michaels HiFi said:
Agreed.

In this instance I'm referencing the fact that they are generally by and large an extremely hostile and uneducated crowd that act like a cult and don't care to have a true two way conversation.

Have you ever watched someone on the ASR forum try to have a debate with them and watch what happens? Many times Amir will simply delete and ban them for having a differing opinion. It's impossible to converse with any of them as they can't accept people have a different opinion.

I feel comfortable referring to that behavior by them as that of a nitwit.
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I get it, still I generally prefer to stay away from folks that only surround themselves with like minded people. I avoid the ASR crowd and do not tolerate shills or trolls. Got me booted from a couple of forums but heck it is what it is and I learned to bite my keyboard now....
 
RepublicOfTexas69 said:
Calling people names because they have a differing opinion or beliefs achieves what?
More discord. We all have differing opinions and tastes.
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I agree that some of the folks on ASR are intolerant of any difference of opinion and sometimes quite rude, no doubt about it. I have to say though, that from what I've seen, Amir himself is generally civil and professional in his interactions, even when personally attacked in pretty rough terms. I certainly don't follow him enough to say that is universally true, but there is another forum on which he sometimes posts and he gets savaged every time in very personal terms. He usually sticks to his points which he makes forcefully-doesn't give an inch-but keeps it to the topic. I can appreciate that while disagreeing with the great majority of what he says and that makes for a worthwhile discussion.
 
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