Record Cleaning - What's your process?

socfan12

socfan12

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I stumbled across this relatively new website, The Vinyl Press. It's authored by Bill Hart, who I believe goes by whart on Agon.

One of the articles details his process for cleaning records, in particular old (but valuable) records. Bill uses a combination of an enzyme based bath followed by an ultrasonic cleaning in the KL (with a water rinse in between the steps). While I'm happy with my KL, I have to say I feel it takes 2-3 washes to get used LPs in a decent shape, and I'm still wondering even then is there still room for improvement...:skeptical:

One thing I did learn from the article is that KL does NOT recommend taking out a wet record as it could damage the electronics! When I wash 2-3 times, I will typically forgo the drying cycles on the first two washes. I would lift the record out just enough to get past the sensors and slide it back in to start another cycle. Maybe now I will just go with a 1 minute drying cycle to get it dry enough for the next wash. Odd that KL gives you the ability to turn off drying completely but are worried if you exercise that option.:weird:


Anyway I found the article really interesting and wondered what other people were doing to clean their records, in particular older, used ones?
 
This is where I believe the AudioDesk Glass ultrasonic enzyme bath system wins out.
 
Hi Allen,

Something else to consider would be to find a lightly used VPI-17 (or even 16.5) that could be used with an AIVS #15 + Ultra Pure water rinse type mix of solutions to first loosen, and then remove via vacuum a majority of the crud from used LP's. Once you're satisfied with the Vacuum RCM results then you could use your ultra sonic RCM to do the final cleaning.
 
1) pre-scrub with enzyme cleaner w/ few drops of surfactant (MoFi cleaning brush is preferred for this step).
2) goes into V-8 ultra sonic RCM, heated bath in diluted vers. of above fluid.
3) rinse/vac dry with deionized water and nitty gritty Fi1.5

i stopped using alcohol-based cleaners altogether.
 
I asked around before I bought my Klaudio, people that have used both recommended the Klaudio. I'm sure the AD is also very good, but I'm completely satisfied with the KL.
 
MikeCh said:
Hi Allen,

Something else to consider would be to find a lightly used VPI-17 (or even 16.5) that could be used with an AIVS #15 + Ultra Pure water rinse type mix of solutions to first loosen, and then remove via vacuum a majority of the crud from used LP's. Once you're satisfied with the Vacuum RCM results then you could use your ultra sonic RCM to do the final cleaning.
Click to expand...

Thx, Mike. That's pretty much the cleaning process I'm leaning towards. The more I read, the more I believe an enzyme based cleaning in combo with an ultrasonic RCM yields best results.




puroagave said:
1) pre-scrub with enzyme cleaner w/ few drops of surfactant (MoFi cleaning brush is preferred for this step).
2) goes into V-8 ultra sonic RCM, heated bath in diluted vers. of above fluid.
3) rinse/vac dry with deionized water and nitty gritty Fi1.5

i stopped using alcohol-based cleaners altogether.
Click to expand...

Thx Rob. Which enzyme do you use? I hear there are some enzyme cleaners with surfactants mixed in as well now. Have you ever used any of those?
 
For my ripping project, almost all of my records (15,000 of which I am ripping 10,000 with 93% completed!) were cleaned with a VPI with Disc Doctor fluids. When I got my Audio Deske three or four years ago (before the KL came out), I just give the already cleaned records one beep (one cycle) before I rip them. Since I rip an average of 10 records a day (easier when you are retired), the AD gets a good workout. The one cycle seems to be sufficient. I might have bought the KL if it had been available, but the AD is good enough for what I need and I didn't feel like spending another $4K. Besides, who knows whether there will be another $4K or more ultrasonic cleaner that will even be better on the horizon. I do like the fact that you can increase the cleaning time of the AD up to five cycles if so inclined. Buying classical records seems to have the advantage that people don't eat their meals using their records as their serving dished, like they appear to do with rock records!

Larry
 
astrotoy said:
...Buying classical records seems to have the advantage that people don't eat their meals using their records as their serving dished, like they appear to do with rock records!

Larry
Click to expand...

that and I find many used classical records were unplayed or but once maybe twice. used rock LPs are why i switched to 100% enzyme-based fluids they instantly dissolve fats, proteins or any biological matter than can be left on a record. I found that alcohol based fluids just smear it around and don't loosen it well enough. the only petroleum-based solvent that touches my LPs is Ronsonol. I use it for removing sticky residue left behind by price tags, it also works wonders for cleaning ring wear off glossy jackets.
 
My personal cleaning practice and view:

First Allen, I agree with MikeCh on your situation.
Also, my personal rule is “Never deviate from instructions”.

First I need to quantify by stating that I do not have an ultrasonic cleaner. (I wish I did, but for me with only 400+ records and I can’t even dream of affording one). I have a VPI 16.5.

That said, my view basically stated is:
1) Most dirt on records are protein based, so alcohol is not going to be much help and could make things worse for two reasons (amongst others) A) Some proteins can harden in alcohol and end up really bonding to the groove walls and 2) Alcohol can also bring brittleness to the pvc by drying out the plasticizers. There are some dirts are cleaned will with a little alcohol, so a tiny drop or two of high grade alcohol in a mix won’t bring any harm, but it’s not really needed.

2) I never use any petroleum product on my records. I have found that doing so can really gunk up the stylus. I also carry with me something I learned about detailing cars. Never use Armoral or any petroleum based product on tires, leather or vinyl. All it does is dry them out and crack them and there is no sorrier a sight than a cracked dashboard.

3) I try to evaluate the record I am going to clean to determine my attack. Different records may require different things. What I have found is the one sure thing is that different records will require different numbers of cleanings. Some records can be cleaned in one pass with any method, be it ultrasonic or non-ultrasonic. I do find classical records require one pass cleaning most of the time. It is true that most classical records were seldom played or very well taken care of. Rock records I have I found to need anything from one cleaning to 3 or 4 in some cases. My average is that I’ve been good to go with two cleanings. (My personal rule is that if the sound is not notably improved by cleaning number 3 or 4 then time to find a better copy).

I use AIVS fluids, MoFI and a home brew I made.

Since you have an ultrasonic I see no reason for me to type out my full procedure.

Anyway, just my personal take on it and not for everybody.

~Eric
 
VPI 16.5 - with an added cooling fan, must seal the corners of the top section with silicone caulking.
Separate brushes and vacuum wand for each of the three fluids.

Used records get AIVS enzyme treatment first

All records get AIVS record cleaner then distilled water rinse. (I get the AIVS water from time to time when I order)

I also have a steam maker for the really bad stuff, but often those just get tossed if its not something I REALLY want to hear.

Carbon Fiber brush used before each play.
Zerostat needle cleaner.

Considering an ultrasonic for Christmas if I am good this year.
 
I use the three step AIVS process (Enzymatic, Super Cleaner, Ultra Pure Water) with Disc Doctor brushes. The AIVS fluids work very well and better than the Disc Doctor fluids I used when I started down the record cleaning path. I don't have a RCM but use a small two gallon shop vac with a modified attachment. The nozzle is wrapped with soft microfiber cloth and removes the fluid between steps. It works well for my small collection, but if I had a significant number of LP's a RCM would be a required purchase.
 
Thanks, guys, really helpful. You're confirming what I am beginning to believe that a good enzyme wash is really necessary to get old records clean.

If you could post links to the solutions/applicators you use that would be greatly appreciated. I'd be especially interested in yours, Rob, where you say it's ultrasonic safe?

thx
 
socfan12 said:
I'd be especially interested in yours, Rob, where you say it's ultrasonic safe?

thx
Click to expand...


my dentist uses it in his machine, says you cant properly clean dental tools in plain water alone. they use enzymatic fluids in conjunction with heat. i'm following his lead and my results have been super.
 
Davkj said:
I use the three step AIVS process (Enzymatic, Super Cleaner, Ultra Pure Water) with Disc Doctor brushes. The AIVS fluids work very well and better than the Disc Doctor fluids I used when I started down the record cleaning path. I don't have a RCM but use a small two gallon shop vac with a modified attachment. The nozzle is wrapped with soft microfiber cloth and removes the fluid between steps. It works well for my small collection, but if I had a significant number of LP's a RCM would be a required purchase.
Click to expand...

That is exactly how I started. I got my VPI 16.5 when I hit the 280 records mark and then for medical reasons as well. I was destroying my hands with repetitive motion injuries o-plenty.
 
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