Magico S5 mk2

Many ppl match the Wilson Sasha mk1 and 2 with the ARC75, so the bigger ARC150 should be fine.
 
Rhapsody said:
Yes, your amp must be able to drive a 4ohm load, but the S5's don't dip down below 3 ohms. I believe the Ref 150 SE can drive a 3 ohm dip, with a nominal 4 ohm load with no problem.

The S3's do dip down to 2ohms, but I have never seen an issue with the S3's and the 50 Watt SET's don't really like ultra low impedances. Possibly though the amps that we have used were able to handle the 2 ohm or 3 ohm load at the one certain frequency, I think somewhere between 50Hz and 100Hz.

*****

Bif, ask ARC how the REF 150SE will do with a 2ohm or 3ohm minimum load, but a more nominal 4 ohm load across the majority of the spectrum.

*****
Click to expand...

Rhapsody,

ARC was one of the sources I alluded to. ARC had some concern whether the Magicos might be too difficult a load for the Ref 150 SE.

I checked out the S5 electrical properties here: http://www.soundstage.com/index.php...&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

While the impedance graph doesn't look too bad, it does drop in the 3 ohm range in the deep bass. By itself, I surmise the Ref 150 SE could manage that load off the 4 ohm taps. What gives me a little more pause, however, is the negative phase angle gets kinda' ugly south of 50Hz.

I don't recall seeing specs on the S3. If the speakers weren't so darn heavy, I would love to demo them in my house on my gear. There's an S3 for sale right now for $13,900. Not sure that is a good price or not.

Thanks.

BIF
 
BIF- you obviously love the ARC amp, why not find a tube friendly speaker for them? Nola shows great with ARC. Sonus Faber and Wilson too. You may even want to look at the Focal Scala V2 - very tube friendly.


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BlueFox said:
My guess is, except for the Q7, the rest will be discontinued. The reason is they are very labor intensive to manufacture. I would guess a new TOTL series to be introduced based on the M platform.
Click to expand...

Interesting comment. Speculation was that they discontinued the Mini II because it was so labor intensive to manufacture. I would love to see a Mini M based on the M Pro.
 
Mike said:
Now a S1 mk2? Wow. They sure are busy turning out the new models. I'm curious, how many speakers has Magico introduced since Harman introduced the Revel Salon 2 in 2006? I count:

M6
V3
M5
V2
Ultimate
Q1
Q3
Q5
Q7
S1
S3
S5
S7
Q7 mk2
S5 mk2
S1 mk2
M Projects...

17 speakers according to my calculations. Wow.
Click to expand...

That's quite a long list, Mike. But it is not as looooong as your signature. BTW, you forgot the Mini and Mini II.
 
Bifwynne said:
Rhapsody,

ARC was one of the sources I alluded to. ARC had some concern whether the Magicos might be too difficult a load for the Ref 150 SE.

I checked out the S5 electrical properties here: http://www.soundstage.com/index.php...&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

While the impedance graph doesn't look too bad, it does drop in the 3 ohm range in the deep bass. By itself, I surmise the Ref 150 SE could manage that load off the 4 ohm taps. What gives me a little more pause, however, is the negative phase angle gets kinda' ugly south of 50Hz.

I don't recall seeing specs on the S3. If the speakers weren't so darn heavy, I would love to demo them in my house on my gear. There's an S3 for sale right now for $13,900. Not sure that is a good price or not.

Thanks.

BIF
Click to expand...

To me $13,900 is as inexpensive as you are going to find for a VG condition S3 at this time. My guess is that they will work great, but like Mike said, if you are concerned find a more tube friendly speaker. There are many choices out there, several that Mike has mentioned.

My comments are only from playing the Absolare 50 Watt SET's on the S3's and they light the room up. I would think that your 150 Watt PP's would not have an issue, but again, if concerned then pick a tube friendly speaker.
 
Rhapsody said:
Yes, your amp must be able to drive a 4ohm load, but the S5's don't dip down below 3 ohms. I believe the Ref 150 SE can drive a 3 ohm dip, with a nominal 4 ohm load with no problem.

The S3's do dip down to 2ohms, but I have never seen an issue with the S3's and the 50 Watt SET's don't really like ultra low impedances. Possibly though the amps that we have used were able to handle the 2 ohm or 3 ohm load at the one certain frequency, I think somewhere between 50Hz and 100Hz.

Btw, when we tried ALL of the mentioned amps (not the Vitus amps) on the Raidho D3's we had no luck whatsoever, they could not handle the load on the D3's. That has something to do with why the Magico S series seemed "easy to drive" in our environment.

Bif, ask ARC how the REF 150SE will do with a 2ohm or 3ohm minimum load, but a more nominal 4 ohm load across the majority of the spectrum.

Here is a review of the REF 150SE that is driving the Wilson Sasha 2 which dips down to 2ohms (about the same as the S3) with no issues in driving this load.

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/blog/audio_research_reference_150_se.htm
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Bob,

I thought the Absolare 50 Watt SET drove the Raidho D3 beautifully when I heard them together. I have not found the D3 to be a difficult speaker to drive at all.

Ken
 
Mike said:
Ken - I had this combo on my D3's and LOVED it.

http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649203466-vac-tube-power-amp-and-pre-amplifier/


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Click to expand...

Mike,

I haven't plotted the impedance curve of the D3's but according to Raidho it is greater than 5.8 ohms, which would make them a pretty easy load for an amp to drive. David's experience running the D3 with lower powered amps also seemed to bare this out as he had excellent success with it.

Best,
Ken
 
Alpinist said:
Bob,

I thought the Absolare 50 Watt SET drove the Raidho D3 beautifully when I heard them together. I have not found the D3 to be a difficult speaker to drive at all.

Ken
Click to expand...

Ken,

You listen at low levels, or at least when you listened to the D3's/Absolare at my place you did. If I remember correctly in the 60db to 70db type levels, maybe 75db but I don't think much louder than that. I am talking about driving the D3's with the Absolare SET's at say 90db with 95 db peaks. At those levels it is the tweeters that suck the current from the amps. You can start to hear distortion in a female voice if really pushing the speaker at the 90db + levels.

Other than pushing the D3's with the 50 Watt SET's above 90db level (and this is in a 700 sq. ft. space), the sound was very, very good.

On the flip side I could drive either the S3's or S5's with the Absolare SET's easily to 95db constant with 100 db levels in the same big space with no problem or distortion. That is why I can't see the REF150SE, which is 150 Watts of Push Pull vs 50 Watts of SET power, not being able to drive them.

Although I have no skin in this game, just trying to help BIF out.
 
Bifwynne said:
Rhapsody,

ARC was one of the sources I alluded to. ARC had some concern whether the Magicos might be too difficult a load for the Ref 150 SE.

I checked out the S5 electrical properties here: http://www.soundstage.com/index.php...&catid=77:loudspeaker-measurements&Itemid=153

While the impedance graph doesn't look too bad, it does drop in the 3 ohm range in the deep bass. By itself, I surmise the Ref 150 SE could manage that load off the 4 ohm taps. What gives me a little more pause, however, is the negative phase angle gets kinda' ugly south of 50Hz.

I don't recall seeing specs on the S3. If the speakers weren't so darn heavy, I would love to demo them in my house on my gear. There's an S3 for sale right now for $13,900. Not sure that is a good price or not.

Thanks.

BIF
Click to expand...

BIF,

The net of it all to me is that if you are "hooked" on trying Magico speakers, then getting those S3's on AG, is a good way to test it all out. If you don't like the combination you can always sell the S3's for very close to what you pay for them. I would be really surprised if your REF can't drive them. Of course there will be spl limitations depending on how loud you play and what the size of your room is.

Either buy the used S3's or look for a tube friendly speaker instead....my two cents.
 
Mike said:
BIF- you obviously love the ARC amp, why not find a tube friendly speaker for them? Nola shows great with ARC. Sonus Faber and Wilson too. You may even want to look at the Focal Scala V2 - very tube friendly.


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Click to expand...

Thanks Mike. I will keep all the speakers you mentioned on my short list.

As an fyi, I spoke with Kal (ARC customer service tech rep) today about an unrelated matter. However, the issue of speaker matching came up. Kal said he would talk with Dave Gordon about possible speaker suggestions for me. I bet he hits on the same speakers as you. :scholar:

Kal asked me to draw a floor plan for my room to help the process along. I plan on doing that within a day or two. I'll let you know what he comes up with.

Mike, I gotta' tell ya' that speaker selection is one of the hardest thing to do. Most speaker I'd be interested in weigh in at 100++ pounds. And I am circumspect about buying from a dealer unless I can match up the speaker being demo'ed with an ARC amp like mine. Also, there is always the room issue.

Seems to me the best way to demo speakers is in my sound room. Problem is there a are few dealers near me who will accommodate that request.

Bruce
 
Rhapsody said:
BIF,

The net of it all to me is that if you are "hooked" on trying Magico speakers, then getting those S3's on AG, is a good way to test it all out. If you don't like the combination you can always sell the S3's for very close to what you pay for them. I would be really surprised if your REF can't drive them. Of course there will be spl limitations depending on how loud you play and what the size of your room is.

Either buy the used S3's or look for a tube friendly speaker instead....my two cents.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Rhapsody. As I mentioned to Mike, I am working with ARC and will collate the various suggestions and make a decision. I just measured out the metes and bounds of my sound room/basement. The dimensions are so weird, I'm thrilled my electronics even turn on. :S

Btw, I am listening the some tracks on Linda Ronstadt's 3 record box set where she's singing old standards, accompanied by the Nelson Riddle Orchestra. Equipment and sound room warts and blemishes aside, the LPs sounds heavenly.
 
I agree that Magicos are a lot easier to drive to loud volumes than the Raidho. I would rate both as being in the medium range of "hard to drive" at low to medium volumes, but at high volumes - Magico are still in the medium range and Raidho are in the difficult range of "hard to drive".

I heard the ARC control the original Wilson Sashas very very well. And with their low impedance dip, are not an easy speaker to drive at all.

Rhapsody said:
Ken,

You listen at low levels, or at least when you listened to the D3's/Absolare at my place you did. If I remember correctly in the 60db to 70db type levels, maybe 75db but I don't think much louder than that. I am talking about driving the D3's with the Absolare SET's at say 90db with 95 db peaks. At those levels it is the tweeters that suck the current from the amps. You can start to hear distortion in a female voice if really pushing the speaker at the 90db + levels.

Other than pushing the D3's with the 50 Watt SET's above 90db level (and this is in a 700 sq. ft. space), the sound was very, very good.

On the flip side I could drive either the S3's or S5's with the Absolare SET's easily to 95db constant with 100 db levels in the same big space with no problem or distortion. That is why I can't see the REF150SE, which is 150 Watts of Push Pull vs 50 Watts of SET power, not being able to drive them.

Although I have no skin in this game, just trying to help BIF out.
Click to expand...
 
the professor said:
I agree that Magicos are a lot easier to drive to loud volumes than the Raidho. I would rate both as being in the medium range of "hard to drive" at low to medium volumes, but at high volumes - Magico are still in the medium range and Raidho are in the difficult range of "hard to drive".

I heard the ARC control the original Wilson Sashas very very well. And with their low impedance dip, are not an easy speaker to drive at all.
Click to expand...

Jock,

That's a good way to put it!
 
Spent few hours listening to the S7 in Brussels New Music show. I think that the S7 in a in a different league all together then the current S5, I can't imagine anyone missing it. Truly a magnificent piece (and I am used to the Q3). Extremely smooth, rich and full without losing any resolution throughout the entire spectrum. The volume played was staggering but zero fatigue. These are one special speakers. If the new Mk2 S5 will be similar, it should make for hell of a product.
 
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