Magico M2

Hello Dre. That is kind of tough because I only spent a few hours listening with Myles. I really enjoyed meeting Myles and having a chance to hear his system about which I had read so much. A good friend up here in Boston suggested I visit because he had heard the system and remarked about just how good those S5mk2s sounded in that room.

I would say the main difference has to do with soundstaging and imaging: spatial resolution, listener perspective, scale and sense of presence. Myles has a fantastic music collection. He played for me two choral recordings, one of which I bought previously on his recommendation: Holst, Six Medieval Lyrics, Argo ZrG 5495, and The King's Singers, A French Collection, EMI CSD 3740.

We listened to a lot of music, but for the sake of simplicity, these two recordings should illustrate the sonic contrasts and differences from a system/room context that I heard. We played the first tracks from each LP. Both recordings sounded highly resolved and natural, but very similar in terms of presentation. I enjoy the music and I quickly forgot about the system and instead just relaxed and marveled at how good the system sounded. I was quite surprised because despite what I had read, I was expecting a really small presentation given the size of the room. I guess I was also expecting the speakers to perhaps overload the room, given their large size relative to the room. This was not the case.

The system and speakers disappeared and we were left with the music. The Holst is a large male choir with some string instruments. The individual singers were spread from left to right and filled the front wall. The image was recessed back behind the system near the front wall. Each voice was distinct, clear, and articulate. Myles remarked that if I liked the Holst, I would love the The King's Singers. This is a much smaller ensemble of six male singers. The recording is a stand out and sonic marvel. Resolution was off the charts. However, the singers occupied about the same space in the room, they just sounded bigger.

When I returned home, I bought a copy of the King's Singers to hear in my own system. In my room, there is a larger contrast between the two recordings. The image of the Holst fills the front wall from right to left, and the singers are slightly further back in the space than at Myles' place. The King's Singers however, are more forward, and are more or less at the plane of the speakers. They do not fill the front wall, but rather seem up close and personal, located from the outside edge of one speaker to the other. They are extremely present, in the room. The differences in scale, listener perspective, and sense of presence is more distinct between the two recordings. There is more spatial information and recording space acoustic. The contrast between the recordings is pretty clear.

At first I also thought Myles' system was a bit warmer than mine, with slightly more body and weight, though not energy. My sound had been a bit thin, I thought, based on what I heard at Myles', and some recent live music concerts, both large and small scale. I have been experimenting with cartridge loading and slight speaker positioning adjustments. This has resulted in considerably more weight, body, and warmth. I would now say that my system has a tonal balance which I think is very similar to what I heard at Myles. So, after the visit, I would have said that Myles' system had a richer, warmer tonal balance, and mine was thinner and slightly cooler, but I no longer think that is the case.

I don't know how responsive the S5 Mk2 is to such changes of speaker position and up stream vinyl adjustments, but the Q3 is a chameleon when it comes to upstream set up and gear changes. It really seems to have very little sound of its own. It is really hard to say that the differences I notice between our two systems have anything to do with the speakers. I think they are more likely based on the two rooms.

I did not hear differences that I might have attributed to solid stage versus tube electrics, belt drive versus direct drive turntables, etc. I should add that I was astonished at the spatial information and sheer experience of listening to his tape of Dark Side of the Moon. That was fantastic. It filled the room to a much greater extent than did his other recordings.

In the end, I actually think our two systems sound much more alike than I would have thought given the differences in components and typologies. In no way can I reach any conclusions about the sonic differences of the two speakers simply based on what I hear from our two systems.

Thanks for the reply.

From the original statement, I’d gathered there were no similarities other than the two you had mentioned. That seemed unusual in some ways.

Now that you have expanded on this observation, the one difference you have focused on was the perception of depth (I gather that is mostly from a few tracks from two vocal-based albums) and the associated subjective attributes you ascribed to that feature. Ok, Thanks.

I did notice you mentioned DSOTM sounded fantastic: which is a more full range performance and not as midrange-ish (single driver) limited as the first two albums you focused on. That was interesting.

I also learned you thought your system was on the cooler/thinner side at the time of the listening event compared to the warmer/weightier sound from the visited system in addition to your live venue experiences. Although, you have mentioned since that time you have taken steps to improve your perception of the sound you are getting; while not always the case, this can sometimes be the plus side of getting out more.

And finally, your affirming, in the end, that the two systems are more similar than different brings me full circle to why I had asked the question originally. It seems upon reflection, this latest and more complete response is more in-line with what I would have initially thought.

I had a feeling the additional clarity would be more beneficial and in better context than the original statement you had made.

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Dre
 
Thanks for the reply.

From the original statement, I’d gathered there were no similarities other than the two you had mentioned. That seemed unusual in some ways.

Now that you have expanded on this observation, the one difference you have focused on was the perception of depth (I gather that is mostly from a few tracks from two vocal-based albums) and the associated subjective attributes you ascribed to that feature. Ok, Thanks.

I did notice you mentioned DSOTM sounded fantastic: which is a more full range performance and not as midrange-ish (single driver) limited as the first two albums you focused on. That was interesting.

I also learned you thought your system was on the cooler/thinner side at the time of the listening event compared to the warmer/weightier sound from the visited system in addition to your live venue experiences. Although, you have mentioned since that time you have taken steps to improve your perception of the sound you are getting; while not always the case, this can sometimes be the plus side of getting out more.

And finally, your affirming, in the end, that the two systems are more similar than different brings me full circle to why I had asked the question originally. It seems upon reflection, this latest and more complete response is more in-line with what I would have initially thought.

I had a feeling the additional clarity would be more beneficial and in better context than the original statement you had made.

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Dre

You are welcome, Dre. I think this thread about the new M2 is not really the place to discuss how similar or different two other Magico speakers may or may not sound, especially considering that I have not directly compared them. The system and room contexts in which I did hear Myles' S52 and my Q3 are considerably different, and that is the point I was trying to make. Upon reflection, I am somewhat surprised that they sound as similar as they do.

It is interesting that visitors are not often asked to describe the differences between two members' systems in forums like these. In fact, such descriptions are usually made in isolation and not relative to other people's systems. Furthermore, people do often make pronouncements about specific components and how they sound compared to others without actually having heard them side by side.

When I wrote this:

Sorry, unfortunately, the system components and rooms are so different between my system and Myles' that I could not make any conclusions about the respective speakers separate from the system/room contexts. Both systems are highly resolving and analog based, but that is where the similarities end.

I was referring to the room and components being so different rather than my impressions of each system's sonic attributes.
 
That's a strong statement. When I started my magico journey, I wanted the M3 but it was out of my budget so I looked for the next best thing. To my ears, it was the s5mk2. Would be great to get your thoughts on your q3 vs. m3 in your system.

I asked my dealer this same question before I bought M3. His reply was, M3 make Q3 sound broken. My Q3 were on SPOD and I prefer their sonic attributes over the MPro I heard in another hi-end dealer show room. So I wouldn't go as far to say that M3 make Q3 sound broken. Alon Wolf made a big deal about the vast improvements brought about by the curved side/top surfaces of M3 (to counter diffraction effects) compared to the flat straight edges of the Q3 cabinet. Whether that is validated by measurement, whether true or not, I don't know. What I do know is both speakers can be made to vanish in the room, despite the enormity of their physical presence, curved cabinets or not. When you can achieve that it's a good starting point for everything else. The most apparent sonic difference between M3 and Q3 is that diamond coated Be tweeter. It really is something special. It allows the treble to keep pace and tonal balance with the bass texture through the operating volume range. Meaning M3 can bring on a thoroughly enjoyable listening experience at a lower volume compared to Q3, which needs more current and volume to snap everything into focus (in other words, bass tends to swamp treble in Q3 at lower volumes, but not so in M3). I have Mpods for my M3 but I haven't installed them yet. I expect that when I do the differences between it and Q3 will be more apparent.
 
I asked my dealer this same question before I bought M3. His reply was, M3 make Q3 sound broken. My Q3 were on SPOD and I prefer their sonic attributes over the MPro I heard in another hi-end dealer show room. So I wouldn't go as far to say that M3 make Q3 sound broken. Alon Wolf made a big deal about the vast improvements brought about by the curved side/top surfaces of M3 (to counter diffraction effects) compared to the flat straight edges of the Q3 cabinet. Whether that is validated by measurement, whether true or not, I don't know. What I do know is both speakers can be made to vanish in the room, despite the enormity of their physical presence, curved cabinets or not. When you can achieve that it's a good starting point for everything else. The most apparent sonic difference between M3 and Q3 is that diamond coated Be tweeter. It really is something special. It allows the treble to keep pace and tonal balance with the bass texture through the operating volume range. Meaning M3 can bring on a thoroughly enjoyable listening experience at a lower volume compared to Q3, which needs more current and volume to snap everything into focus (in other words, bass tends to swamp treble in Q3 at lower volumes, but not so in M3). I have Mpods for my M3 but I haven't installed them yet. I expect that when I do the differences between it and Q3 will be more apparent.

Thanks for sharing this. I found your comments on the tweeter especially insightful. In my small room the s5's disappear completely and i have them set up as a 9ft equilateral triangle - it's extremely impressive when 440lbs of aluminum just move out of the way! Reminds me of my old monitors in that sense.

I have a symphonic line kraft on the way...I am eager to see what that power and current (not that my current amp is a slouch) can get these speakers to do.
 
I own an S3 Mk2. Much of my listening is done at what I'd call low-moderate volume levels, and I'd have to say the combination of the S3 Mk2s and Gryphon Diablo 300 integrated is excellent at these levels.
 
Price of Magico M2: SRP US $ 56,000 /pair plus applicable taxes. Price M2 MPOD 3-Pt Stand: SRP US $ 7,600 /pair (optional)
 
Is the MPod stand better for any one type of surface; concrete, wood, tile, turf?


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Is the MPOD a stand, or footers?
The MPOD for Magico M2 or M3 speakers is the set of silver metal feet with vibration absorption material sandwiched in-between, that you screw into the base of the speaker instead of regular spikes. It's good in any situation where vibrations would be traveling between the floor and speaker enclosure.
 
The MPOD for Magico M2 or M3 speakers is the set of silver metal feet with vibration absorption material sandwiched in-between, that you screw into the base of the speaker instead of regular spikes. It's good in any situation where vibrations would be traveling between the floor and speaker enclosure.

Thanks. Sounds like an SPOD.
 
Actually, Mpods get screwed into a 3-point stand and the stand gets attached to the bottom of the speaker. With Spod, that is a direct fixing in the same hole as the spike that is being replaced. Magico have something called M-feet which is now the standard footer for M3. It is very similar to Spod, but much larger. Mpods and Spods are constructed differently internally.

M3 is carried by either four M-feet, or three Mpods on 3-point stand. I assume M2 is the same.
 
Zounds. Glad I retire next month and will no longer be able to afford this stuff. It is getting to be too much for my feeble mind to keep up with. :)
 
If one were in the market for a new Magico speaker for a particular room size, regardless of cost, would he compare an M2 to an S3 mk2 or S5 mk 2? I think the S series generally has fewer but larger woofer drivers than the comparable M series speaker which has more and smaller woofer drivers: M3 v. S5 mk2.
 
The M3 sounds noticably better than the S5 mk2. More natural and smoother, with greater tone density. The M3 tweeter is just out of this (dome) world great. Down low, I prefer the S5 mk 2 though. There is just no replacement for displacement :)
 
If one were in the market for a new Magico speaker for a particular room size, regardless of cost, would he compare an M2 to an S3 mk2 or S5 mk 2? I think the S series generally has fewer but larger woofer drivers than the comparable M series speaker which has more and smaller woofer drivers: M3 v. S5 mk2.

M3 has smaller woofers, but three instead of two. They’re totally different, but both great in their own way. The more difficult comparison is S7’s vs M3. Then it’s three bass drivers vs 3. Again, both are awesome.


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The M3 sounds noticably better than the S5 mk2. More natural and smoother, with greater tone density. The M3 tweeter is just out of this (dome) world great. Down low, I prefer the S5 mk 2 though. There is just no replacement for displacement :)

Well said. I agree 100%.


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M3 has smaller woofers, but three instead of two. They’re totally different, but both great in their own way. The more difficult comparison is S7’s vs M3. Then it’s three bass drivers vs 3. Again, both are awesome.


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Thanks Mike. Do you think the M3 and S7 are designed for the same size room? And which S series speaker do you think is more appropriate for someone considering an M2? I understand that the two series have different tonal characteristics, but I am curious about room compatibility and which models one would realistically be comparing in that sense.
 
The M3 sounds noticably better than the S5 mk2. More natural and smoother, with greater tone density. The M3 tweeter is just out of this (dome) world great. Down low, I prefer the S5 mk 2 though. There is just no replacement for displacement :)

That's interesting. Are you suggesting that Magico needs an M4/M5 to be consistently better in both the highs and lows than the S5 mk2? Do most customers prefer the lower frequencies of the S5 mk2 to those of the M3? I thought they are simply different, the S5 mk 2 being more about quantity while the M3 is more about quality. Is that wrong?
 
Thanks Mike. Do you think the M3 and S7 are designed for the same size room? And which S series speaker do you think is more appropriate for someone considering an M2? I understand that the two series have different tonal characteristics, but I am curious about room compatibility and which models one would realistically be comparing in that sense.

The M3 fills the 20 x 25 in the store beautifully. The S5 mk2/S7 do too.

M2 would be for someone considering S3 mk2. M3 is more for someone stepping up from the S5 mk2. I’m really anxious to get my M2’s. I think in the 17 x 25 room they will sing! My hunch on the M2 is that for many, it will be THE Magico to buy.


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