Headphone Evaluation

[Randy Myers]

Mike definitely is ordering them. The Dan Clark Audio Voce are certainly worth evaluating also. Not sure if either will compete with the Stax but I was very impressed with other Dan Clark's (Mr. Speakers) that I have owned.

If Abyss ever came out with electrostatics I just might have to try a Blue Hawaii amp ...

 

[CPP]

Mike definitely is ordering them. The Dan Clark Audio Voce are certainly worth evaluating also. Not sure if either will compete with the Stax but I was very impressed with other Dan Clark's (Mr. Speakers) that I have owned.

If Abyss ever came out with electrostatics I just might have to try a Blue Hawaii amp ...

So many new headphones are coming out. The New Dan Clark Stealth ( closed back) $4k. Maze Audio Elite $4k

Things are getting rather pricey in the headphone world.

 

[the professor]

Are you ordering the new top of the line Stax headphone?

 

[Alpinist]

Are you ordering the new top of the line Stax headphone?

The new Stax flagship:

The OMEGA LEGACY IS HERE WITH THE SR-X9000 (PRE-ORDER NOW)



– STAX Headphones

 

[veindoc]

previous post said Voce were beat out by Stax I think that cage match already was fought.

 

[Randy Myers]

previous post said Voce were beat out by Stax I think that cage match already was fought.

Sorry, missed/forgot that ... this adventure has been going for a while now ...

Yes, the headphone world is getting pretty crazy... if anyone would have told me I would have $12k+ in my headphone setup a couple of years ago I would have told them they were nuts (not including DAC, sources, etc )

 

[Cincy2]

Are you ordering the new top of the line Stax headphone?

Yes. Placed an order through Mike.

Eric

 

[Cincy2]

As I was switching balanced cable inputs from the MSB amp to the Woo WA33 it struck me there was a better way to do this. The method is simple but it requires me to violate a long term belief I've held....great DACs sound best when they feed the amplifier direct. The WA33 has a pre-amp mode. There are balanced outputs that can feed the MSB amp. Changing from Headphone to Preamp mode is a simple switch selection. I'm curious how using the WA will affect the sound of the MSB amp. On paper it sounds attractive because you would have a all tube preamp feeding a solid state amplifier. It would also clean up a problem I have with some of my files. They were mastered at low gain levels and in order to listen effectively I have to jack the Select II gain over 100. This is not recommended from what I understand. Do any of you guys with Select II's have experience mating them with PreAmps?

Thx
Eric

 

[Mike]

As I was switching balanced cable inputs from the MSB amp to the Woo WA33 it struck me there was a better way to do this. The method is simple but it requires me to violate a long term belief I've held....great DACs sound best when they feed the amplifier direct. The WA33 has a pre-amp mode. There are balanced outputs that can feed the MSB amp. Changing from Headphone to Preamp mode is a simple switch selection. I'm curious how using the WA will affect the sound of the MSB amp. On paper it sounds attractive because you would have a all tube preamp feeding a solid state amplifier. It would also clean up a problem I have with some of my files. They were mastered at low gain levels and in order to listen effectively I have to jack the Select II gain over 100. This is not recommended from what I understand. Do any of you guys with Select II's have experience mating them with PreAmps?

Thx
Eric

Two channel preamps? Yes. We use a two channel preamp exclusively with the MSB since we have more than once source.

Our favorites are Block Audio, Boulder 2110, Soulution 725.

 

[Cincy2]

Mike,

Do any of these preamps have headphone outputs? That's the beauty of the Woo. It provides a pass through mode to act as a preamp but also has headphone outputs. I'm going to give it a trial and see what happens.

Eric

 

[Mike]

Mike,

Do any of these preamps have headphone outputs? That's the beauty of the Woo. It provides a pass through mode to act as a preamp but also has headphone outputs. I'm going to give it a trial and see what happens.

Eric

Headphone outputs as in headphone XLR?

No. The new Esoteric N-05XD may work.

Wouldn’t you come out of the DAC into the pre and then output to the various headphone amps?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Cincy2]

I tracked down the Block preamp specs. It actually does have two headphone outputs: one jack and one four pin balanced. You could wire it up as you say but if the preamp does both functions (pre-amp) and headphone, you reduce the number of cables and electronics while still making it possible to use both electrostatic phones (MSB) and dynamic driver / planar magnetic phones (pre-amp). I'll give you a call to discuss the Block after I try out the configuration with the WA33.

Eric

 

[Mike]

I tracked down the Block preamp specs. It actually does have two headphone outputs: one jack and one four pin balanced. You could wire it up as you say but if the preamp does both functions (pre-amp) and headphone, you reduce the number of cables and electronics while still making it possible to use both electrostatic phones (MSB) and dynamic driver / planar magnetic phones (pre-amp). I'll give you a call to discuss the Block after I try out the configuration with the WA33.

Eric

Correct. Sounds good.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Randy Myers]

I also considered using the Woo as a pre-amp... only one input would not work for me as a main unit (I need at least two, but actually have four hooked up on my pre-amp). If I were doing only digital, for example, then it would work just fine. As it is I consider a very nice back up pre-amp. But if it works to allow you to feed the MSB headphone amp from it then that certainly would give you some real flexibility.

The Woo also lets you tailor the sound somewhat since they work well in rolling tubes.... I added a couple sets of driver tubes and a couple rectifier tubes because those provided by Woo were not at appropriate levels. The power tubes actually were on some trusted tube knowledgeable friends list of excellent tubes!

 

[Cincy2]

I also considered using the Woo as a pre-amp... only one input would not work for me as a main unit added a couple sets of driver tubes and a couple rectifier tubes because those provided by Woo were not at appropriate levels.

I've got everything hooked up and will do some critical listening today. Because I am running only a headphone set up, one WA33 output works just fine for me. I'm curious how this will work out.

Eric

 

[TheOctopus]

My only nit is one that all headphones have - No forward projecting soundstage. Someone will figure out how to fix that eventually with some type of processing, hopefully in the amplifier in the analogue domain so it doesn't screw up the digits. Hats off to MSB and Stax. They nailed it.

Eric

If you get a chance, listen to the German made, SPL line of professional headphone line of products designed for the recording industry. I had a lot of fun listening to my SPL Phonitor 2700B. The circuitry works very well as it is designed to give the mixing engineer a sense of what the soundstage will sound like with speakers while using headphones for mixing, etc. Their newer products offer even more. Fantastic headphone amps even if you don't use the circuitry by the way. The sound is profoundly powerful down low with a meaty midrange that is just right. The music has lots of drive and body while sounding completely neutral as a good amp should. The amp's 120 voltage rails are exemplary for control over any impedance headphone.

 

[ACHiPo]

If you get a chance, listen to the German made, SPL line of professional headphone line of products designed for the recording industry. I had a lot of fun listening to my SPL Phonitor 2700B. The circuitry works very well as it is designed to give the mixing engineer a sense of what the soundstage will sound like with speakers while using headphones for mixing, etc. Their newer products offer even more. Fantastic headphone amps even if you don't use the circuitry by the way. The sound is profoundly powerful down low with a meaty midrange that is just right. The music has lots of drive and body while sounding completely neutral as a good amp should. The amp's 120 voltage rails are exemplary for control over any impedance headphone.

That looks like an interesting alternative to the Smyth Realizer. It also reminds me of a demo I saw at a MEMS technical conference that used multiple MEMS as speakers in headphones, each of which powered with DSP to present very realistic 3D imaging and surround sound. The demo was many years from a product, but if people can figure out how to get micro-speaker efficiencies up it could offer some pretty amazing options.

 

[Randy Myers]

I did try a lower level SPL headphone amplifier. It certainly was a solid piece, and much better than most other headphone amps I have tried. However it was definitely not on par with the Bryston, SimAudio, and the Woo. Of course they might be doing something much different in their higher models, although they claim that their lower models perform on par with their higher models. Of course it did not have most of the extra features of this SPL model. I am only referring to sound performance and not features.

 

[TheOctopus]

I did try a lower level SPL headphone amplifier. It certainly was a solid piece, and much better than most other headphone amps I have tried. However it was definitely not on par with the Bryston, SimAudio, and the Woo. Of course they might be doing something much different in their higher models, although they claim that their lower models perform on par with their higher models. Of course it did not have most of the extra features of this SPL model. I am only referring to sound performance and not features.

I can only speak for the SPL 2730B as that’s the only one I have spent time with. I had at least a dozen other amps come through to compare with, WOO, Audeze, Bryston, various Schiit, Violectric V281, tubes, SS, Class A…

Played with about a dozen headphones such as Focal Utopia and Clear, various Sennheisers, Audeze, ZMF, E-MU, Fostex, etc…

The SPL 2370B was a professional grade instrument for recording studios, not a hobby grade headphone amp. It easily won the shootouts between itself and most other amps. Solid foundation of iron fisted grip down low with any headphone, dense and rich midrange that stood out against the more fragile and leaner sounding lesser contenders. The rich presentation did not come at the price of the amp sounding dark nor lacking any air or sparkle. It just sounded effortless and powerful. Music/recording quality always made the biggest impact rather than any flavor of the amp itself. An amp should amplify the signal with an iron fisted grip and not add much of anything of color or flavor to the music. It did exactly that.

In the end the WOO and Audeze amps made the cut and stayed. That’s only because I like a more romantic and sweeter presentation if not exactly accurate like the professional grade SPL presented the music with.

The Bryston was slightly leaner and more forward sounding compared to both SPL and Violectric (another German professional grade headphone amp).

 

[Cincy2]

I spent some time on the SPL site looking at their range of products. I had some questions that I posed to their tech support people. I am familiar with their Crossfeed feature. Years ago a company called HeadAmp did this in their amplifiers. It was interested but not revolutionary. The key question to SPL for me is "Do you manipulate the L/R signals in the analogue domain to create a front/center image?" I wouldn't want to use their DAC. I couldn't get the answer from their website.

Eric