Anyone dumping their power conditiner?

[TheOctopus]

I wired the surgery rooms and worked on the distribution switchgear at the University of Washington Medical Pavilion. I would say no. They do not have any specialied filtration systems so to speak. In each surgery room the power from the main switchgear goes to a battery UPS switchboard. From there it is fed to a panel at each surgery room with a isolation transformer. Its not a very sophisticated system.

And the fact that hospitals are purchasing the Shunyata equipment tells the whole story. Maybe you should get on the phone and start calling hospitals and labs. Explain who you are and advise them they are being fleeced. That the improved performance they are realizing is subliminal. They want it to be better so it appears so when its really is not.

It is possible things have changed. 5 years ago when I was bidding and PM electrical distribution packages for hospitals and data centers for Square D, the emphisis was on uninterrupted power and back up. As well as grounding. I did not see any radical breakthrough technology to quote on the blueprints. It was a pretty standard package.

I have no idea which hospitals are buying what. Does anyone know? I don't care what the audio manufacturer would say to be honest and not to sound offensive. I already mentioned that I worked with top health equipment providers in the world like Siemens, GE, Hitachi, Toshiba and many others. When I was setting up radiology departments, I would have never allowed any external or aftermarket equipment to be used due to liability issues and insurance policies that would have loved to hear about that aftermarket power cord if something happened. It was always all the equipment provided by the company and strict preventive maintenance practices with field engineers of the equipment. If other hospitals are buying power conditioners and power cords, that is their problem but I would have never taken that responsibility on my myself or put the institution at risk. I am sure Shunyata makes great products, my doubts of such things aside, but many do not even have a UL rated and listed product. That's a big NO for the health industry.

Trust me, when you are dealing with equipment that makes the liquid nitrogen, cryogenically chilled superconductor cables, drawing so much current as to make them dance, as the gradient coils are pulsing RF into the patient, to make the MRI machine see the hydrogen atoms/water map of your body (your organs), those companies think of everything, including power demands and how to keep power clean and provide so much power to begin with. Surgical suites and their equipment is state of the art in most places too, at least in the bigger cities.

 

[Kingrex]

I have no idea which hospitals are buying what. Does anyone know? I don't care what the audio manufacturer would say to be honest and not to sound offensive. I already mentioned that I worked with top health equipment providers in the world like Siemens, GE, Hitachi, Toshiba and many others. When I was setting up radiology departments, I would have never allowed any external or aftermarket equipment to be used due to liability issues and insurance policies that would have loved to hear about that aftermarket power cord if something happened. It was always all the equipment provided by the company and strict preventive maintenance practices with field engineers of the equipment. If other hospitals are buying power conditioners and power cords, that is their problem but I would have never taken that responsibility on my myself or put the institution at risk. I am sure Shunyata makes great products, my doubts of such things aside, but many do not even have a UL rated and listed product. That's a big NO for the health industry.

Trust me, when you are dealing with equipment that makes the liquid nitrogen, cryogenically chilled superconductor cables, drawing so much current as to make them dance, as the gradient coils are pulsing RF into the patient, to make the MRI machine see the hydrogen atoms/water map of your body (your organs), those companies think of everything, including power demands and how to keep power clean and provide so much power to begin with. Surgical suites and their equipment is state of the art in most places too, at least in the bigger cities.

I agree, the type of equipment you are referring to has its own cord which is generally hardwired to a breaker. I don't think any audio companies make 70 amp to 400 amp power cords.

But do you know Shunyata is not selling to the manufacturer?
Serg, your taking a very flowery story, but the product is being designed and customers are buying it. Are you trying to convince people that is a lie. If not, let it go. They make a product for the medical industry.

Industry such as medical are overflowing with subcontractors making the smallest fitting such as special nuts and bolts, to special glass for lenses, blaa bla blaaa. Its the way it is.

 

[TheOctopus]

I agree, the type of equipment you are referring to has its own cord which is generally hardwired to a breaker. I don't think any audio companies make 70 amp to 400 amp power cords.

The gradient cables were the size of a real Anaconda and under the floor with access panels. Also strapped down every 12 to 18 inches if I remember correctly, as they would literally start to wiggle and boogie from power pulses. Serious stuff.

 

[Kingrex]

The gradient cables were the size of a real Anaconda and under the floor with access panels. Also strapped down every 12 to 18 inches if I remember correctly, as they would literally start to wiggle and boogie from power pulses. Serious stuff.

Every job has a spec. Thats where you make or break the profits.

 

[TheOctopus]

One of my other hobbies is flying radio control 3D/Stunt helicopters. My models with the bigger electric motors draw over 200 amps peak from a 44.4V 12s LiPo battery that is no bigger than a 12x4x3 inches. Talk about power density! Of course they are extremely volatile if punctured or something shorts out or goes wrong with the chemistry inside them. VIOLENT! When I solder the connectors on, I have to be extra careful until the exposed leads are well covered and do not short.

I can see some of today's chemistry easily accommodating any audio components except the amps perhaps. I don't think it was really ever a big advantage though so we did not see the battery operated components take off or become popular.

 

[TheOctopus]

Very cool. But I think those cables need upgrading Don't take it so seriously guys. This is just a hobby after all.

Researchers in the UK have produced the most accurate cryogenic current comparator – a device used for comparative measurement of current. The new instrument is more exact than previous designs and can, in principle, be operated without liquid helium.

From the picoamps of ionizing radiation delivered to cancerous tissue to the hundreds of amps traded by electricity suppliers, accurate measurement of electric current is vital to modern physics. The most accurate device to measure a direct current is a cryogenic current comparator (CCC). As the name implies, however, it can only operate at temperatures close to absolute zero, which can be problematic for laboratories without ready access to liquid helium.

Superconducting circuits
CCCs rely on superconducting materials and a quantum magnetic flux detector to measure current ratios. To measure an unknown electric current, two wires are passed through a tube of superconductor. An adjustable current is passed in the opposite direction to the current being measured, down one of the two wires. The current induced on the inside wall of the superconductor is equal and opposite to the difference between the currents. This current in turn completes a circuit with an equal and opposite current on the outside wall – a current used to induce a magnetic field measured by a superconducting quantum interference device (SQUID). When the SQUID measures zero magnetic field, there is no current in the superconductor, meaning the current in both wires is the same. Vastly different currents can be compared by adjusting the number of times that each current-carrying wire passes through the superconducting tube – so a current in amps can be compared to a current in picoamps, for example.

 

[bluegrassphile]

I've owned a Furman power conditioner for about 25 years. I've only used it for my electric guitars and amps. I'm not even sure it's designed for home audio? I was wondering if I should give it a try in my system?

I have a dual power supply MSB Discrete DAC which is sort of a "power conditioner" in it's own right. Is it safe to give the Furman a try with my home audio components? Is there even anything to be gained with the Furman power conditioner?

 

[TheOctopus]

I've owned a Furman power conditioner for about 25 years. I've only used it for my electric guitars and amps. I'm not even sure it's designed for home audio? I was wondering if I should give it a try in my system?

I have a dual power supply MSB Discrete DAC which is sort of a "power conditioner" in it's own right. Is it safe to give the Furman a try with my home audio components? Is there even anything to be gained with the Furman power conditioner?

It won't hurt anything and neither will it change anything. Furman is not exotic enough or expensive enough to have audiophile fame

 

[Kingrex]

I've owned a Furman power conditioner for about 25 years. I've only used it for my electric guitars and amps. I'm not even sure it's designed for home audio? I was wondering if I should give it a try in my system?

I have a dual power supply MSB Discrete DAC which is sort of a "power conditioner" in it's own right. Is it safe to give the Furman a try with my home audio components? Is there even anything to be gained with the Furman power conditioner?

Your digital system is way beyond that conditioner. It will be a backwards move. It will most likely compress the stage and rob it of life. But its a solid well built device that is safe to use. And its always fun to experiment.

Out of curiosity, what are you trying to achieve. Do you think the DAC is polluting the AC and other gear. Or do you think the DAC is under performing because of dirty power?

 

[CPP]

I've owned a Furman power conditioner for about 25 years. I've only used it for my electric guitars and amps. I'm not even sure it's designed for home audio? I was wondering if I should give it a try in my system?

I have a dual power supply MSB Discrete DAC which is sort of a "power conditioner" in it's own right. Is it safe to give the Furman a try with my home audio components? Is there even anything to be gained with the Furman power conditioner?

You won't know till you try it and let your ears decide.

 

[brad225]

You won't know till you try it and let your ears decide.

And, only your ears can decide. Some one else's ears can't determine what you hear.

 

[Ritmo]

I have been using Shunyata’s conditioners for about 10 years. Currently using a Triton III. Eventually climbing up to Everest.

 

[BlueFox]

I have been using Shunyata’s conditioners for about 10 years. Currently using a Triton III. Eventually climbing up to Everest.

Same here. While I am sure the Everest sounds great, I am just absolutely satisfied with my current Shunyata gear. Of course, being retired also impacts my purchase decisions.

 

[Cincy2]

Getting back to the OP's question - Yes. I am. Just purchased an Everest to replace my P20 regenerator.

Cincy

 

[still-one]

I have no idea which hospitals are buying what. Does anyone know? I don't care what the audio manufacturer would say to be honest and not to sound offensive. I already mentioned that I worked with top health equipment providers in the world like Siemens, GE, Hitachi, Toshiba and many others. When I was setting up radiology departments, I would have never allowed any external or aftermarket equipment to be used due to liability issues and insurance policies that would have loved to hear about that aftermarket power cord if something happened. It was always all the equipment provided by the company and strict preventive maintenance practices with field engineers of the equipment. If other hospitals are buying power conditioners and power cords, that is their problem but I would have never taken that responsibility on my myself or put the institution at risk. I am sure Shunyata makes great products, my doubts of such things aside, but many do not even have a UL rated and listed product. That's a big NO for the health industry.

Trust me, when you are dealing with equipment that makes the liquid nitrogen, cryogenically chilled superconductor cables, drawing so much current as to make them dance, as the gradient coils are pulsing RF into the patient, to make the MRI machine see the hydrogen atoms/water map of your body (your organs), those companies think of everything, including power demands and how to keep power clean and provide so much power to begin with. Surgical suites and their equipment is state of the art in most places too, at least in the bigger cities.

I guess this Doctor must also be an Audiophile since he is easily duped.

Shunyata Research Medical Uses - The Audio Beat - www.TheAudioBeat.com

 

[Alpinist]

Getting back to the OP's question - Yes. I am. Just purchased an Everest to replace my P20 regenerator.

Cincy

Wow, you decided to go for it. Congrats!! Hang onto your P20 for a few months just until you’re sure you’re happy with the change. What brand of power cords do you have? I have found that matching power cords to the power conditioner is an important step to achieving synergy.

Ken

 

[TheOctopus]

I guess this Doctor must also be an Audiophile since he is easily duped.

Shunyata Research Medical Uses - The Audio Beat - www.TheAudioBeat.com

He is an audiophile and it says so the article. I am aware of the story. That’s not the point. Long before Shunyata, medical equipment was taking all that into consideration and will continue to do so.

To say that the top engineers at leading global health equipment such as GE, Siemens, Hitachi, Toshiba and others are incapable of designing equipment that is immune to inaccuracies due to a “noisy power” environment is frankly an insult and can only exist in an audiophiles mind. I have worked with those brilliant minds since the late 80’s.

Perhaps Shunyata should be involved with building a better MRI, PET or a robotic surgery station then? Obviously the engineers are incapable?

How did we ever get this far with such bad power cords? Scanning electron microscopes, spectroscopy equipment and other extremely precise laboratory equipment must be creating all kinds of erroneous results since their power cords are nothing more than the high quality, built to accepted, proven, engineering standards for such equipment.

Should we all start bringing a favorite power cord with us when going for a doctors appointment? (If one uses another brand, can that cause a misdiagnosis?)

I really don’t like these conversations and I can only hope that audiophilia does not start spilling out outside our listening rooms where it exclusively belongs. :weird:

Everyone loves the exotic vibration control and people spend as much as $40k on an audiophile rack in search of better sound when an “active” vibration platform used for precision instruments that are sensitive to vibration can be bought for less than $4k...

Of course when one realizes that there are NO components sensitive to vibration inside a DAC or a Preamp of the solid state variety (tubes can be slightly sensitive due to microphonics) but still hears a difference, it doesn’t mean that the scientific world should be turning to audiophile products because we think we can “hear” something that cannot be measured and worse yet falls apart with blind listening tests...

Back to listening to music... (not analysing the sound coming from my speakers)

 

[TheOctopus]

In case anyone remains skeptical and does not trust the scientific approach of the medical/scientific community (the absurdity of such a notion) here is a brief example.


Abstract
Ultrasound Doppler techniques are widely employed in detecting the velocity of moving fluids both in medical and industrial applications. Echo Doppler electronics systems include a highly sensitive front-end suitable to processing the very low power ultrasound echoes received by the transducer. Moreover, the front-end input bandwidth typically ranges between 100 kHz and 10 MHz, which is the same frequency range where modern switching regulators work. Thus, the front-end is particularly prone to the noise produced by the suppliers that power the board itself. Electromagnetic interference (EMI) filters and spread-spectrum modulation of the switching regulator frequency help, but the results are often not optimal, and unacceptable artifacts are visible in the Doppler spectrum. In this paper a spread-spectrum modulation is proposed that concentrates the switching noise in the low-frequency range of the Doppler spectrum (e.g., 0–100 Hz). This range is removed by the high-pass clutter filter normally used in velocity Doppler investigations, thus switching noise and artifacts are eliminated. The method is verified through mathematical simulations and tested in measurements carried out with a research Doppler system. An example is presented in which the artifacts present during the investigation of a 0.4-m/s flow in a 25.4-mm diameter pipe are effectively removed by the proposed method.


Electronics | Free Full-Text | Switching Power Suppliers Noise Reduction in Ultrasound Doppler Fluid Measurements

 

[Cincy2]

Wow, you decided to go for it. Congrats!! Hang onto your P20 for a few months just until you’re sure you’re happy with the change. What brand of power cords do you have? I have found that matching power cords to the power conditioner is an important step to achieving synergy.

Ken

Ken,

I've got Transparent power cables. I've owned Shunyata's in the past but to my ears, TA's always sounded better. The P20 is going to a new home so there is no turning back. I'm not worried because I've also owned Shunyata Triton and loved it too.

Eric

 

[Alpinist]

Ken,

I've got Transparent power cables. I've owned Shunyata's in the past but to my ears, TA's always sounded better. The P20 is going to a new home so there is no turning back. I'm not worried because I've also owned Shunyata Triton and loved it too.

Eric

Hi Eric,

You might want consider running an Omega XC power cord from the wall to your Everest like Mike does in his home system. That way you’ll experience the Omega/Everest synergy and can retain the Transparent power cords from your Everest out to your components. Mike has AQ Dragons from his Everest out to his components.

Enjoy,
Ken