Pass XS Phonostage

[FlexibleAudio]

Way too much generalizations and painting with broad brush strokes. Who are all these so called audiophiles tuning their systems? Outside of a few, most audiophiles value neutrality and faitfullness to the recording. We've never been in a period where the equipment has been striving for neutrality unlike the etched sound of the '80s and '90s.

It is only my speculation that much of the gear proliferation we see and the incumbent escalating price relates to each audiophile's personal affinity toward the unique overall character of one piece of gear over another. I believe a significant part of this character relates to tonal balance or lack there of, particularly in cables and speakers.

No question gear is better than in the 70's when it comes to resolution, neutrality etc., but my point is that regardless of what many profess regarding their pursuit of neutrality they will look to "season their system to taste" somewhere in the chain and we pay significant premiums for doing so.

Think of how many times when people are comparing reference grade products we have heard: "at this level they are all good it is really a matter of personal taste." What are we referring to hear but tonal character and a few other variables like imaging, appearance etc?

How do we define the term "voicing?" It certainly includes an aspect of tonal balance.

Think of how many people can't fall in love with Magico's Q Series which is arguably the most neutral speaker ever made but lacks any semblance of a unique tonal character.

Below is a post I made on another Forum which explains why I picked the name Flexible Audio which captures my personal thinking in this regard. I in no way consider this a bad thing, to the contrary it makes the hobby great fun for many; it is just a theory about why the market provides these products and why we all are happy to pay so much for very subtle differences in reference level gear. Of course it just my thinking and I could be completely wrong.

Help with New System => Flexible Audio

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My goal for a new system is to selct a very clean and nuetral system across the transducer, gain and front-end so I can always go clean and nuetral when in the mood, but still provide for the flexibility to add warmth as desired for certain music and mood (i.e., flexible audio...hot and cold). I am thinking that if I introduce coloration into the system and I want to easily remove it, I must add it at a point which is functionally easy to modify within the system chain.

The example would be to go as clean and nuetral as possible for the amp, speakers and preamp and use multiple dacs from tube to ss through a single preamp all fed by a single digital server. This would allow me to methodically evaluate levels of wamth and coloration in my listening environment as opposed to just the showroom after which you must make a fixed system commitment. Initial thoughts would be=> Aurender Server to multiple Dacs to Spectral(or Boulder) to Magico.

I want the ability to add and subtract warmth efficiently so I can evaluate what I like in my listening environment across music genres and time. I do not want to add wamrth and musicality through a fixed point in the chain like the amp using Tubes or a warm SS (like Dart or D'Augostino) because once you add this coloration at the amp or speaker you can't subtract it. I have heard so much about the clean (sometimes lean) qualities of Spectral/Boulder and Magico/Avalon and I think this is were I want to be, but with the flexibility to add warmth to taste.

This may be an impossible question to answer, but how much warmth do people feel can be achieved by using a tube Dac (i.e., can I approach the warmth from a tube amp/preamp by instead using a nuetral amp/preamp in combination with a great tube Dac like the Ayon, Accustic Arts, WaveLength, etc.)?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Myles B. Astor]

The problem with the Magico isn't the speaker but the gear that is chosen as ancillary components. Would you use those electronics with any other speaker?

Again I don't know people that want to season their sound. They want to hear the recording warts and all. There's no free lunch. Do you think changing FR doesn't affect other areas like phase relationships? The reason tone controls died out was that audiophiles heard their negative effects, not mentions those who thought if a little was good, more was better.

Otherwise just buy a SE amp.

 

[PeterA]

It is only my speculation that much of the gear proliferation we see and the incumbent escalating price relates to each audiophile's personal affinity toward the unique overall character of one piece of gear over another. I believe a significant part of this character relates to tonal balance or lack there of, particularly in cables and speakers.

No question gear is better than in the 70's when it comes to resolution, neutrality etc., but my point is that regardless of what many profess regarding their pursuit of neutrality they will look to "season their system to taste" somewhere in the chain and we pay significant premiums for doing so.

Think of how many times when people are comparing reference grade products we have heard: "at this level they are all good it is really a matter of personal taste." What are we referring to hear but tonal character and a few other variables like imaging, appearance etc?

How do we define the term "voicing?" It certainly includes an aspect of tonal balance.

Think of how many people can't fall in love with Magico's Q Series which is arguably the most neutral speaker ever made but lacks any semblance of a unique tonal character.

Below is a post I made on another Forum which explains why I picked the name Flexible Audio which captures my personal thinking in this regard. I in no way consider this a bad thing, to the contrary it makes the hobby great fun for many; it is just a theory about why the market provides these products and why we all are happy to pay so much for very subtle differences in reference level gear. Of course it just my thinking and I could be completely wrong.

I agree with this and it is similar to my approach (though some might not think my equipment achieves this). I especially like your previous post describing a highly resolving, transparent and tonally neutral system with various digital front ends, interchangeable to suite one's mood. I have chosen this approach with cartridges, though it is not as easy to swap them.

The Pass XS Pre and presumably the XS Phono provide this transparent, neutral and highly resolving platform.

 

[FlexibleAudio]

I agree with this and it is similar to my approach (though some might not think my equipment achieves this). I especially like your previous post describing a highly resolving, transparent and tonally neutral system with various digital front ends, interchangeable to suite one's mood. I have chosen this approach with cartridges, though it is not as easy to swap them.

The Pass XS Pre and presumably the XS Phono provide this transparent, neutral and highly resolving platform.

I have since decided to go analog instead of dacs and am considering the route I take to achieve this end. Thinking two arms (with cartridges) to start.

 

[JDLaudio]

Or stop trying to tune with $$$ in the chain where a particular piece of gear is tuned to sound unique and thereby command big bucks for its singularity and, instead, remove the stigma of tone controls and go back to how we did it in the 70's:

I wonder why Dan D. put good old fashion bass and treble controls on his pre???? Of course that would take a lot of the fun out of what we do. :happy: :lol:

I absolutely love the tone controls on the D'Agostino preamp. I think every preamp should have them. It would DEFINATELY cut down sales on new gear.

 

[FlexibleAudio]

The problem with the Magico isn't the speaker but the gear that is chosen as ancillary components. Would you use those electronics with any other speaker?

Re Magico electronics: Only if the nuclear reactor here in Chicago needed to be replaced.

I still believe the Q Series issue for some is bigger than you indicate. Alon's approach left many who want tonal character in their speakers looking for more. Look at Neil at Avalon as the opposite extreme. Avalon doesn't only tune to a house sound, as do many, but Neil tunes each speaker to his stylistic objective.

Again I don't know people that want to season their sound.

The market speaks for it self. If all reference gear was perfectly flat I don't believe we would see nearly as much fragmentation. There aren't enough significant variables to differentiate product after tonal balance. Almost all reference gear is highly resolving, images well, etc.

There's no free lunch. Do you think changing FR doesn't affect other areas like phase relationships.

Of course FR deltas impact phase as well as other variables but that doesn't stop there proliferation. Their affects are positive enough to a large segment of the market a trade off occurs. Indeed, their is no free lunch.

The reason tone controls died out was that audiophiles heard their negative effects, not mentions those who thought if a little was good, more was better.

I think you are partially correct about the reason tone controls died out but it was also the loss of face by anyone admitting not aspire to the purity you espouse. (Not to mention the lucrative nature of the current approach to manufacturers.) Many drew tired of pursuit of flat FR at all cost. My point is that the use of tone controls over the last 30 years by the vast majority of audiophiles (knowingly or otherwise) through the expensive optimization of the component chain is evidence of their positive effects.

As an aside, I would guess the tone control in Dan's preamp goes a long way to minimizing the negative effects of the lesser executed preamps, receivers and EQ's of the 60's and 70's. I doubt Dan feels it is a negative.

Remember Myles, just my thoughts and observations. I may well be completely wrong.

 

[XV-1]

I wonder if the 3 inputs have 3 separate phono modules that enables individual phono settings rather than changing the dials each time you change inputs/turntables as on the xp-25

My assumption is yes, as there is a save button. I hope it is not just an electronic input switch.

3 separate phono modules would account for some of the astronomical price, but perhaps also enable a slightly cheaper price point if the user does not require 3 inputs. Me, I am out of luck as I would like 4 inputs:skeptical:

 

[MDP]

Pass Labs Delivers New xS "State-of-the-Art" Moving Coil Phono Preamplifier | Analog Planet

 

[Mike]

http://www.analogplanet.com/content...w-xs-state-art-moving-coil-phono-preamplifier


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[WayneC]

The XS Phono does have three separate input cards for each channel a total of six input cards. This avoids switching very low signals and it has memory for the loading positions.

 

[Mike]

Thanks Wayne.

 

[Alpinist]

The XS Phono does have three separate input cards for each channel a total of six input cards. This avoids switching very low signals and it has memory for the loading positions.

Hi Wayne,

I just wanted to let you know how wonderful I think your XP-30 preamp is. Its natural warmth and tube-like sound always puts a big smile on my face. A terrific design!

Thanks,
Ken