Porsche
Active member
agreed, they are the worst company I have ever dealt with
OMG - WHAT? WHAT?
- Thread starter Mike
- Start date
Randy Myers
Well-known member
After moving to Wichita I ordered a new McIntosh amplifier from a local "dealer". Mc had a trade in offer going on at the time. He offered me a good deal and took my money. I called him several times and keep being told various stories. I finally called Mc and they looked into it. They said he never even ordered the amplifier and they had plenty in stock. A/E refunded my money to me (the dealer since has gone out of business).
McIntosh arrange to have an amplifier sent to their dealer in Kansas City, honoring the deal that I had reached with the defunct dealer, and paid them to to deliver it to my home and install it. They compensated the dealer for their service. A short time later I notice one meter would take about two minutes before coming on. The amp worked fine and I really was not worried about it. I called McIntosh, got a real person on the phone. Had a very pleasant conversation with him. He said we want every one of our products to be perfect and therefore sent a brand new one to the KC dealer and paid them again to deliver and set it up for me. I had recently had knee replacement surgery at the time and could not install the amplifier myself.
A short time after a FedEx packaged arrived at my door step. It was one of their $200 McIntosh history books. Absolutely gorgeous book I might add. They sent it to me as a thank you for allowing them to arrange and to resolve this issue with the terrible unethical dealer who tried to rip me off. They also immediately discontinued relationship with him.
No company ever has given me this type of service any anything I have ever purchased. I grew up next to the factory in Binghamton and loved many of the photos of my home town in the book. I will always love my McIntosh, and they deserve the reputation they have gained over their 75+ years in business (since 1949) and building in the same factory on 2 Chamber St. since 1956.
They have always been the company that everyone loves to bad mouth. I guess that happens to any organization reaching similar status in about any field. There is a very good reason they have the loyal following that they have and that they retained their resale value so much better than virtually any brand out there. I have bought and sold many different items on audio selling sites. Every McIntosh sells so fast it is scary (a day or two on average has been my experience) while other brands, even very highly regarded brands seems to take considerably longer.
McIntosh arrange to have an amplifier sent to their dealer in Kansas City, honoring the deal that I had reached with the defunct dealer, and paid them to to deliver it to my home and install it. They compensated the dealer for their service. A short time later I notice one meter would take about two minutes before coming on. The amp worked fine and I really was not worried about it. I called McIntosh, got a real person on the phone. Had a very pleasant conversation with him. He said we want every one of our products to be perfect and therefore sent a brand new one to the KC dealer and paid them again to deliver and set it up for me. I had recently had knee replacement surgery at the time and could not install the amplifier myself.
A short time after a FedEx packaged arrived at my door step. It was one of their $200 McIntosh history books. Absolutely gorgeous book I might add. They sent it to me as a thank you for allowing them to arrange and to resolve this issue with the terrible unethical dealer who tried to rip me off. They also immediately discontinued relationship with him.
No company ever has given me this type of service any anything I have ever purchased. I grew up next to the factory in Binghamton and loved many of the photos of my home town in the book. I will always love my McIntosh, and they deserve the reputation they have gained over their 75+ years in business (since 1949) and building in the same factory on 2 Chamber St. since 1956.
They have always been the company that everyone loves to bad mouth. I guess that happens to any organization reaching similar status in about any field. There is a very good reason they have the loyal following that they have and that they retained their resale value so much better than virtually any brand out there. I have bought and sold many different items on audio selling sites. Every McIntosh sells so fast it is scary (a day or two on average has been my experience) while other brands, even very highly regarded brands seems to take considerably longer.
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a.wayne
Well-known member
W9TR
Active member
My interactions with McIntosh over the years have been nothing but positive.
It’s odd that people have had such disparate experiences with the people in NY.
I understand their dealer relationships have been problematic for a long time. Still trying to maintain territories in the Internet age is failed strategy.
It’s odd that people have had such disparate experiences with the people in NY.
I understand their dealer relationships have been problematic for a long time. Still trying to maintain territories in the Internet age is failed strategy.
a.wayne
Well-known member
Were the 3500’s a step up , the Mk1 were fantastic amplifiers best of Mac for sure ..!
a.wayne
Well-known member
This is a big change from where mac used to operate at , my first mac was way back in 1977 and quite a few until 95. Back then service was Rolls Royce level , not to mention their free service clinics.
In 78 i needed a service Manual and a few items for the then discontinued MC3500 from 1968 and they dealt with my request promptly, documentation and any history on my models were detailed and plentiful.
At the Mac clinic’s if your mac never met specs it was serviced back to specs.
So hearing about these sudden burst into a Barbecue stories of death , is very much at odds for the Brand ..!
Hopefully they will get the fantastic Bose radio tech , personally have never seen one of those fail ..!
- Thread Author
- #47
This!
Randy Myers
Well-known member
I have had many interactions with McIntosh over the years and they have been nothing but fantastic for me. I even had some interactions with them as a dealer back in the day. Granted, that was a while ago. But I never had anything but positive interactions as a customer, even as recent as last year (documented above).
I can see issues with trying to maintain territories and dealer relationships in the internet age might very well be challenging however. I am also very sure these types of issues for higher end brands are not unique to McIntosh.
One thing I have noticed on various forums, when people complain about service they have rarely actually picked up the phone and called McIntosh directly. Instead they blame McIntosh for their retail dealers terrible service, and dealers are the same as many audio fans... they love to bash McIntosh... they have as long as I have been involved in this industry/hobby, so over 50 years. In my view they offer very good service when calling them directly, however people have to realize that almost any interaction will require a call back which I always receive without issue. The techs only have so many hours in a day... I have found this is very common for companies that do not use over seas call centers and you actually talk to English speaking Americans at their US facilities.
I have dealt with many American companies that give you amazing service so long as you are understanding that it will probably require a call back. Falcon Northwest may actually be the finest service know to man kind, but always require a call back. Talking to a human that knows their stuff does have some limits. Recent calls to Martin and Breedlove guitars (my two favorites) has also gotten the same excellent service, of course with a call back!
I don't know... maybe it is that I am from Binghamton, know how to talk to human beings and understand that we all are trying to do our best and don't expect a company to be able to answer my questions on the spot, and may require a call back. Maybe I am not as jaded as many people appear to be in audio forums... who knows... but in my experience, you get back from people what you give (an amazing concept in today's ridicules rude and ill-moral world that the US is turning in to).
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Michaels HiFi
Well-known member
Hmmmm.......maybe they keep going up in flames due to not talking "correctly" to them and asking them nicely not to blow up?
- Thread Author
- #50
I definitely called the Mother ship. Twice. No luck. I was left on my own. It’s fine, I’m resourceful.
Porsche
Active member
the problem with McIntosh is they live on there past, they think they know better than the dealer and the dealers market, they may be cool with customers but they are not with dealers, atleast not when I was a dealer, they where the worst I have ever dealt with, most folks buy mcintosh cause of there glory years but reality is there is so much better for the money and even less than they offer, just my opinion
Randy Myers
Well-known member
People have always said that from day one. There is better for the money. Ok, maybe so, but they still have the most loyal following and best resale value of any gear out there. When people get into a McIntosh setup they rarely look at anything else. This has been the case and continues to be the case to this day.
"I definitely called the Mother ship. Twice. No luck. I was left on my own. It’s fine, I’m resourceful."
Hmmm, I have called them on several occasions and have never had an issue. I almost always have gotten someone on the phone, and many times have had to leave a message to the appropriate person, but always have received a call back.
Another good option for someone having an issue with used gear is to get in touch with Audio Classics, who seem to be able to take care of anything McIntosh related. This only makes sense being that they are just down the Vestal Parkway from McIntosh and very much have the inside track on their gear. Again, I have always gotten in touch with someone when I call Audio Classics. (Chamber St is a one block street off of Conklin Ave., Conklin Ave leads straight into the Vestal Parkway)
Randy Myers
Well-known member
Pretty much like every high end company I have ever dealt with. My 50 year experience tells me that dealers want whatever they can sell easiest and make the most money on. Yes there are exception, but this is rare. Dealers have always loved to bash McIntosh because they have always had fairly strict policies with their dealers, and many dealers (like the one I used to manage stores for) like to deal with companies they can run over, that need them more than the dealer needs the company.
Times have changed now.... there are no longer multiple B&M stores in every decent size city, and there are far too many high end products for any of the dwindling supply of B&M dealers to carry. So the dealers do seem to subtly bash those with longest standing reputations, and the most fans, trying to syphon off potential customers. Tell me I am wrong... I need a good laugh today.
JohnJ
Member
a.wayne-
If you are referring to the 3500 "MK I" ie Woodstock, I have never owned or heard those but have seen several at Audio Classics.
If you are referring to the MC 75 mono blocks, mine were the MK II version. that were brought back into production around 2012 and abruptly discontinued around 2017. I have to say the these 75 monblocks were my facorite among those I directly A/B ed. Including MC 352 (sold state version), 452, 275 and 2301. For a while I was running these on the mids/upper and the 275 on the lower frequencies of my speakers. Later, I pulled out the 275 and preferred the 75's alone.
It was a shame when my dealer, Audio Classics determined the output transformed blew out and replacements were not available. My contact with Mc tech support expressing my disappointment with what now appeared to be an expensive bookend, yielded a snarky reply questioning how I could expect them to support a product over 60 years old. Biting my tongue, I (again) explained it was the MK II version purchased new 5 years earlier, 2 years out of warranty. The tone did change and a solution assured. I guess with the timing of just coming out of the Covid left little desire for Mc to interrupt production for a one-off transformer.
.Several months went by with no ETA and as the 3500's were on allocation, my lottery number came in. Using my good 75 and one Audio Classics had around we were able to A/B. Big improvement (as there should be) and I decided to go for the 3500's. The folks at Audio Classics were very fair with the trade/up grade/delivery package. From my understanding it took quite a while for them to finally get a replacement transformer.
Despite some bad taste in my mouth from this incident, I have been mostly pleased with McIntosh. There were issues with other pieces but these were quickly rectified by Audio Classics. They have actually done warranty repairs while I waited. It proves the dealer is key in customer satisfaction. It's also good to know of Randy's experience when his dealer fell way short.
All this said, I continue to understand Mike's dismay over the way he was treated and wonder if Mc was beginning to slump.. Now being owned by another electronics company opposed to PE might be a good thing. My understanding is Bose's interest in Mc's automotive and Mc in return with gain R & D capital. Time will tell.
Happy Thanksgiving!
John
Mr Peabody
Well-known member
A 01152025 clip from Strata-Gee
This week brought multiple communications from the field informing Strata-gee that McIntosh has terminated all of its remaining independent manufacturer sales representative groups. The notices of termination were made at the beginning of this month and will be effective as of January 31, 2025.
The announcement was met with a mix of resignation and anger by some reps…and shock and surprise by some McIntosh dealers. Most of the terminated groups have been long-time representatives of the brand – many for years, some for decades.
However, this move by the company appears to contradict certain statements made by Joanne Berthiaume, Bose head of Global Public Relations and Communications, back in November when the acquisition was first announced. Local TV station NewsChannel 34 in Binghampton, New York – the longtime home of McIntosh Laboratories – quoted Berthiaume as saying, “McIntosh will remain in Binghamton, and this announcement will not impact the workforce.”
This week brought multiple communications from the field informing Strata-gee that McIntosh has terminated all of its remaining independent manufacturer sales representative groups. The notices of termination were made at the beginning of this month and will be effective as of January 31, 2025.
The announcement was met with a mix of resignation and anger by some reps…and shock and surprise by some McIntosh dealers. Most of the terminated groups have been long-time representatives of the brand – many for years, some for decades.
Specialty Brands Typically Rely on Specialty Reps Serving Specialty Dealers
Of course, Bose has long relied on factory direct salespeople, and some point to this fact in suggesting such terminations were inevitable. Others suggest that the multiple sales teams were redundant, and this kind of rationalization is not uncommon in acquisitions. That is true in a combination of equals, but in this case, a large consumer brand has acquired a smaller specialty brand, and specialty brands often rely on the close relationships between its independent specialty sales reps and the specialty dealers.However, this move by the company appears to contradict certain statements made by Joanne Berthiaume, Bose head of Global Public Relations and Communications, back in November when the acquisition was first announced. Local TV station NewsChannel 34 in Binghampton, New York – the longtime home of McIntosh Laboratories – quoted Berthiaume as saying, “McIntosh will remain in Binghamton, and this announcement will not impact the workforce.”
- Thread Author
- #56
See third paragraph, Post 33.
Not surprised.
A 01152025 clip from Strata-Gee
This week brought multiple communications from the field informing Strata-gee that McIntosh has terminated all of its remaining independent manufacturer sales representative groups. The notices of termination were made at the beginning of this month and will be effective as of January 31, 2025.
The announcement was met with a mix of resignation and anger by some reps…and shock and surprise by some McIntosh dealers. Most of the terminated groups have been long-time representatives of the brand – many for years, some for decades.
Specialty Brands Typically Rely on Specialty Reps Serving Specialty Dealers
Of course, Bose has long relied on factory direct salespeople, and some point to this fact in suggesting such terminations were inevitable. Others suggest that the multiple sales teams were redundant, and this kind of rationalization is not uncommon in acquisitions. That is true in a combination of equals, but in this case, a large consumer brand has acquired a smaller specialty brand, and specialty brands often rely on the close relationships between its independent specialty sales reps and the specialty dealers.
However, this move by the company appears to contradict certain statements made by Joanne Berthiaume, Bose head of Global Public Relations and Communications, back in November when the acquisition was first announced. Local TV station NewsChannel 34 in Binghampton, New York – the longtime home of McIntosh Laboratories – quoted Berthiaume as saying, “McIntosh will remain in Binghamton, and this announcement will not impact the workforce.”
Not surprised.
Randy Myers
Well-known member
McIntosh will continue to build in Binghamton. They will continue to sell to loyal customers who will buy only McIntosh. McIntosh will continue to be both the fastest moving and highest resale value of any pre-owned gear on the market.
There will also continue to be ultra high end products that only 1%'ers can afford. These products will continue to be sold through exclusive high end dealers located only in larger cities and/or extremely wealthy areas of the country. These dealers will continue to bash McIntosh...
This is the same as it has always been other than then B&M stores selling the ultra high end products have become rarer and rarer... and the ultra high end products have become more expensive by many multiple times...
I do not know what McIntosh plans are, or should I say Bose's plans on distributing the products. I do know from several personal experiences that many/most manufactures representatives have a love of products they can move quickly at a high margin and cannot stand companies that have any control over what they are allowed to do. It has always been this way...
I do not know, but I suspect Bose will want to distribute the McIntosh line through their very established network.
And the world will continue to spin...
There will also continue to be ultra high end products that only 1%'ers can afford. These products will continue to be sold through exclusive high end dealers located only in larger cities and/or extremely wealthy areas of the country. These dealers will continue to bash McIntosh...
This is the same as it has always been other than then B&M stores selling the ultra high end products have become rarer and rarer... and the ultra high end products have become more expensive by many multiple times...
I do not know what McIntosh plans are, or should I say Bose's plans on distributing the products. I do know from several personal experiences that many/most manufactures representatives have a love of products they can move quickly at a high margin and cannot stand companies that have any control over what they are allowed to do. It has always been this way...
I do not know, but I suspect Bose will want to distribute the McIntosh line through their very established network.
And the world will continue to spin...
Randy, My local B&M (Overture, Wilmington, De) is one of the finest 'High End' dealers in the country. Their listening rooms are some of the best along with their product offerings, including McIntosh. They do not bash McIntosh, rather they are glad that it has broken away from private equity and hopefully can establish stability in ownership with Bose.
Randy Myers
Well-known member
Very cool, I wish that more dealers were that way. Most are not. Also, there is so much of the country, or the world where access to any dealer to actually touch, feel, and listen to gear is non-existent. When I lived in California I had to spend many hours driving to LA and then spend at least as much time crossing LA to find a dealer. In Kansas I have to drive up to Kansas City to find any dealer. There are no audio dealers in easy reach for a lot of people who are interested in audio. You have to plan at the very least a day trip just to visit a store. And this is even considering that the Wichita area has over 700,000 population.
I also personally share the optimism about the McIntosh and the Bose relationship that your dealer expresses.
Mr Peabody
Well-known member
Hot off the press Bose pulls McIntosh out of Magnolia.
The story is Bose sent out 25 secret shoppers and the results wasn't good.
Unless Mac is prepared to take back inventory this will probably be gradual.
I'd like to see Levinson do that as well. It's a two edge sword though, removing a line from a terrible presentation saves integrity but I'm sure having high numbers in those showrooms reaped some big numbers compared to where they will be now. Even with new dealers it wouldn't make up BB's volume. I still think it's a good move for Mac. BB is the worst
The story is Bose sent out 25 secret shoppers and the results wasn't good.
Unless Mac is prepared to take back inventory this will probably be gradual.
I'd like to see Levinson do that as well. It's a two edge sword though, removing a line from a terrible presentation saves integrity but I'm sure having high numbers in those showrooms reaped some big numbers compared to where they will be now. Even with new dealers it wouldn't make up BB's volume. I still think it's a good move for Mac. BB is the worst