Musical Paradise MP-D2 AK4490 XMOS BALANCED DAC DSD DOP 384Khz

Jack said:
Didn't know you had been there but since you have just buy one of the refurb MicroRendu's with the iPower with the MP-D2 and you are still close or just look in another direction like the Amber II. Also not sure what you mean about too much computer interfacing. If you transfer your music files to the streamers internal HD then the server/NAS is out of the equation altogether.
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Thanks for any recommendations that could allow this solution to work. And good point, to a degree. Yes, I could pick up a discounted MicroRendu, but the iPower is not capable of allowing the MicroRendu to produce anything close to optimal sound. The minimum cost I know of for a usable power supply is $400.00 (and that one, the Uptone LPS-1 is a steal, and back ordered). So, unfortunately, adding up everything, you are looking at close to $900.00 for the MicroRendu and power supply, and then the cost of the MP-D2 with necessary options. So, probably $2300-2500.00 total, and I started this with a $1500.00 max budget.

As far as the question about interfacing with servers/computers, etc, there is no internal HD that exists in the system. All of my music files are on a NAS. And it's already 80% full at 4TB.


JC
 
Slapshot said:
Thanks for any recommendations that could allow this solution to work. And good point, to a degree. Yes, I could pick up a discounted MicroRendu, but the iPower is not capable of allowing the MicroRendu to produce anything close to optimal sound. The minimum cost I know of for a usable power supply is $400.00 (and that one, the Uptone LPS-1 is a steal, and back ordered). So, unfortunately, adding up everything, you are looking at close to $900.00 for the MicroRendu and power supply, and then the cost of the MP-D2 with necessary options. So, probably $2300-2500.00 total, and I started this with a $1500.00 max budget.

As far as the question about interfacing with servers/computers, etc, there is no internal HD that exists in the system. All of my music files are on a NAS. And it's already 80% full at 4TB.


JC
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Get a Chord2Qute and keep your present transport. Not the Greatest DSD but decent PCM. It will allow you to play all via ANY input, USB, Toslink or RCA Spdif.

The rest of the connectivity suite is limited to one each coax, optical and USB digital inputs; the 2Qute offers support for ultra high-res 384 kHz/32 bit digital audio via coax and USB, and 192 kHz/24 bit audio over the optical connection. DSD64 is supported on all inputs and DSD128 is supported via coax or USB. Designed and made in England, the 2Qute is for the digitally committed audiophile ready to take the next step.

New, the 2Qute can be had for down to $1300 now. The older Qute EX can be had for less and also supports the same formats via the above mentioned connections. I have one for sale for $700 (incl shipping), if you are interested.
 
Slapshot,

Hello. I read back 2 pages, but not this entire thread, so I don't know if this has been suggested already. There is an R2R Ladder DAC that retails for $1600 (pegged to $2200 Singapore Dollar, so exchange rate will change this daily). It's the Pontus DAC. It's made in China by Denafrips. The sole distributor is Vinshine Audio in Singapore. The guy's name is Alvin Chee.

https://www.vinshineaudio.com/product-page/denafrips-pontus-r2r-dac

I received the Denafrips Venus (a step up from the Pontus) just two days ago and have been burning it in since unboxing it. I'm going to take it to an audiophile G2G in Bothell, WA tomorrow morning. This DAC will go head to head with an MP-D2 and a Metrum Octave. Especially for this G2G, a Modwright KWA 150 is being contributed by my buddy, Alan. I'm contributing my new Daedalus Audio Apollo speakers and the Venus DAC. Someone else is bringing their tube Preamp (forgot which one). If you can wait till Sunday night or Monday morning, I can post my thoughts here on HifiShark. Other attendees will post remarks to Audio Circle.

I already own a stock Gustard X20u. Even though it's not here to compare, I already know the Venus knocks the X20u's socks off (so to speak).

Regards,

Michael
 
Michael,

It will be interesting to see your report on how the shootout goes. Thanks.

JC
 
I had a problem with mine not powering up. Sent several emails to MP and never received a reply. I returned it and that was a good lesson learned. Sometimes these Chinese built products are hard to get serviced.

If that's how they approach customer service then I won't be buying anything from them ever again. caveat emptor!
 
Mikko said:
I had a problem with mine not powering up. Sent several emails to MP and never received a reply. I returned it and that was a good lesson learned. Sometimes these Chinese built products are hard to get serviced.

If that's how they approach customer service then I won't be buying anything from them ever again. caveat emptor![/QUO TE]
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Mikko said:
I've had just the opposite experience. Sometimes it takes the owner a couple of days to reply. I think its a one man operation so its not reasonable to expect instantaneous customer service.
The MP-D2 is a true bargain. If you just had the initiative to look under the hood and check the fuse the problem would've been an easy fix. I emailed him about the fuse and he recommended to replace it with a 3.5 amp slow-blow. I've had no problem since.

I find your criticism to be unfounded. It must be a PITA to deal with customers like you.
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I thought it was the same guy from Head-Fi with buyers remorse that couldn't be bothered to change a 25 cent fuse.
 
I have emailed Garry several times and he has been very quick to respond. He is based in China so the time difference needs to be factored in when sending emails. I hope to have mine sometime this week.
 
allears said:
Mikko said:
I had a problem with mine not powering up. Sent several emails to MP and never received a reply. I returned it and that was a good lesson learned. Sometimes these Chinese built products are hard to get serviced.

If that's how they approach customer service then I won't be buying anything from them ever again. caveat emptor![/QUO TE]
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Mikko said:
I've had just the opposite experience. Sometimes it takes the owner a couple of days to reply. I think its a one man operation so its not reasonable to expect instantaneous customer service.
The MP-D2 is a true bargain. If you just had the initiative to look under the hood and check the fuse the problem would've been an easy fix. I emailed him about the fuse and he recommended to replace it with a 3.5 amp slow-blow. I've had no problem since.

I find your criticism to be unfounded. It must be a PITA to deal with customers like you.
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Just for the record, he never bothered to respond.. and you can digitally kiss my cyber ass.
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:disbelief:
:disbelief:



Just for the record, he never bothered to respond.. and you can digitally kiss my cyber ass.
 
And this just replicates the way you acted on the other forum when people with experience with the unit tried to help you. Whether or not he actually responded wouldn't have made a difference. Others had dealt with Garry on the same issue and knew what the answer was. You just didn't want to hear it.
 
Slapshot said:
Michael,

It will be interesting to see your report on how the shootout goes. Thanks.

JC
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Hello, Slapshot.

I'm going to cut and paste my review from AC to this post. I'm a slow typist.

" Once we arrived at Greg's man cave, we immediately unpacked the Denafips Venus DAC and connected it to his Mac Mini and his preamp. Well, we suffered a Mac attack because his Mini didn't feel like talking to the Venus. I think it took a good 45 minutes to figure out which setting was appropriate, but we finally did succeed in getting them talking to each other.

We played several songs using Greg's speakers so he could get a clear idea of how good the Venus is. I'd like to point out that the Venus had just 150 hours burn in, and I've read that anywhere from 200 to 300 hours are needed for it to shine. [I'm still burning it in as I write this - at ~180 hours now.] I'll let Greg post his thoughts on this combo. Greg's Butler amp belts out something like 200w/ch and these speakers are 96.5dB/8 ohm. Try to imagine the potential there.
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After Greg was satisfied with his impressions of the Venus/Super V speakers, we disconnected his speakers and their bass amps in order to set up my new Daedalus Audio Apollo speakers. You can see in the picture that Aldcoll posted that these are not especially large speakers. This is good because I don't have a big living room in my Taiwan apartment. They actually looked kind of small in Greg's big man cave. Did anyone take room measurements BTW? Initially, we positioned the Apollos in the same spots as Greg's speakers. That must have placed them 10 feet apart and 5' from the front wall. [Correct me if I'm wrong.] There was just a little toe in, I think. Not much was necessary because the front baffle is already slanted inward. I'm biased here, so take my impressions with a grain of salt. THESE SPEAKERS ROCK!! See? Only a little bias.
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Here is the list of DACs that were present for the day's G2G: Metrum Octave, Metrum Pavane, Denafrips Venus, MP-D2 (2 units with different tubes and caps!), Lampizator Atlantic w/preamp function added. I think that's all, but I'm sure someone will correct me if I forgot one. Throughout the day, we switched DACs in and out to compare this one to that one. And, yes, the Mac threw us some nasty curve balls just when we began getting over-confident. There were nine participants, so there was usually lively conversation, bodies moving in and out, and plenty of distractions. Aren't we audiophiles solitary creatures who just listen for hours at a time?
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Important announcement: If I say something less than wonderful about your DAC that you don't like, please remember I'm stating my impression. I'm not attacking you personally. I'm not trash talking your favorite DAC. If you get upset, take a walk or drink a brew. Chill the f#*k out, dude. It's no different from my casually saying I prefer dome tweeters over ribbon tweeters. I'm simply offering my preference. Thank you.
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End of announcement.

Now where was I? Oh, yeah. I was about to trash talk people's DACs, but ever-so-politely. The Metrum DACs and the Denafrips Venus DAC are R2R DACs. I'm still learning what the means sonically. This was the first time I had ever heard one - let alone three. I can't tell you yet how they sonically differ from 'regular' DACs. I spent more time listening to the Venus, JakeJ's MP-D2, and the Lampi Atlantic than the others. I didn't try to avoid any. It just happened that way. Here is the order in which I like these DACs (least to best):

Metrum Octave
MP-D2 with the oil caps (I think)
Metrum Pavane (didn't listen to it very long)
Venus/JakeJ's MP-D2 (differences, but I wouldn't say one is better than the other)
Lampi Atlantic with preamp upgrade

MCA told me all the upgrades to his Lampi, but I didn't write them down. Perhaps he can remind us here? This DAC stood out from the pack. It is a WOW!! DAC. I get why folks fall in love with this beast of a DAC. It's not cheap though. It's more than double what most of the other DACs cost. Sure, it has an excellent sounding preamp function, which is a big plus if you don't already have a preamp. Mike, do I recall correctly that this DAC costs ~$6500 new?

There was a lovely tube sound coming out of JakeJ's MP-D2 that just made me feel like I'd been sipping a really nice Scotch on a cool winter evening. I'm sure he can fill us in on his tube and caps selections. I can't help but wonder if my adding this to my D Sachs Model 2 tube preamp/D Sachs KT88 Kootenay 120 tube amp combo would create too much tube sound. I probably won't try it, but I might try it with a SS amp someday. Jake, how much would your DAC cost with all the upgrades that you chose? It's worth it in my opinion.

The Venus is a great sounding DAC. It doesn't sound like tubes, but it doesn't sound like solid state to my ears either. I think most of us agreed that it hadn't burned in enough yet, so it hadn't opened up or 'bloomed' yet. Nonetheless, acoustic instruments like guitar, piano, cello, banjo, sax (not my favorite instrument btw), and harp just sound so real to me. I'm not a musician, so I don't describe these sounds like a musician would. The strings vibrate when plucked or struck. There is decay as the sound diminishes. Can I say they're three dimensional sounding? Sure, why not? [I should point out that the Lampi and Jake's MP-D2 impressed me the same way.]

That's about all you'll get from me tonight. Please forgive me if I didn't say wonderful things about your DAC. It's not you, okay?
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"

And more from something I added on another forum..

"Alan (an audiophile buddy) and I drove to Ferndale to pick up my speakers from Lou. While we were there, Lou asked to connect the Venus to his showroom system (Apollo speakers, Modwright KWA150SE, Gill preamp, Modwright modded Oppo Sonica DAC, and Lou's laptop with a huge store of hi-res music.). The Venus was cold from sitting in my pick up for 5 hours, but it sounded pretty awesome to me especially after 20 minutes with a little warm up. We listened for about 40 minutes before switching back the the Oppo. We played the same songs. I didn't notice enough difference between the two DACs to be able to pick anything out. Lou said he felt the Oppo sounded more tube-like whereas the Venus was a bit solid state sounding.

That's fair, I think. The modded Oppo has a tubed power supply and two tubes in the DAC. The Venus has none. I was pretty impressed. It was a short comparison, but I felt it was educational."

And lastly....

"Hmm. There was one other thing that occurred to me this morning that has slipped my mind. Oh, yeah. I remember. The MP-D2 DACs both come with an uninteresting volume control. How uninteresting? Well, with the volume set to zero and using a separate preamp for volume, the results were as I described above. As soon as we took the separate preamp out of the mix and used the included preamp function of the DAC, the SQ took a nose dive. Music became flat and uninteresting. It was so bad that everyone immediately commented on it. It took just a couple songs for folks to start calling for one of the preamps to be added back in.

In my opinion, Musical Paradise could cut costs by losing the preamp function, or raise the price a bit by including a superior volume pot. What it has now is a poor choice. And, yes, I know they're meeting a price point for marketability. Its having a preamp function is a selling point especially for folks who lack a separate preamp. "

Michael

I hope you find this useful.
 
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Anybody else find that the MP-D2 tube sockets to be extremely tight. I've had several occurrences of tubes sparking when removed or inserted. This has resulted in ruining three different tubes. In one case I probably didn't wait long enough after shutting down but in other instances, I've waited overnight before rolling the tubes and still they sparked. What's a good way to loosen the sockets?

Thanks,

Roy
 
Michael,

Thank you very much for including your comments on the various DAC's and how they compared. I am quite familiar with the Lampizator Atlantic and am not surprised that it stood our from the rest. Granted, as you noted, it's about twice the price, it should!

I would be very interested in what upgrades Jake made to his MP-D2 and the total cost.

Also, can you tell me if the MP-D2 is compatible with the newer USB standards and can be used without any drivers? I would like to consider one fed by my Aurender N100's USB output.

JC
 
I'll ask Jake about all his upgrades and which DAC chip his unit has. Then, I will post his answer here. Jake had mentioned his final cost, but I didn't pay that much attention to it at the time because I was paying more attention to the Lampi and the Venus.

As for USB questions, why not ask the man behind Musical Paradise?

I did not buy the Venus partly because I want to audition the Denafrips Terminator and partly because I cannot get the Atlantic DAC sound out of my head. I don't dare tell my wife I'm considering such an expensive DAC. Well, I'll eventually tell her, but I will first buy her something nice. :celebrate008_2:

Michael
 
JC

No driver needed for the MP-D2 with Aurender, Lumin, Auralic, etc. Only needed for Windows devices. Jake would have the 4490 as that was all that was available when we bought last year. If I was buying it again now I would buy it with the 4497 but leave everything else standard. You can buy your own NOS tubes and the capacitors are readily available from Sonic Craft or Parts Connexion if you want to try them after hearing the Obbligato's. If you want to buy it loaded like Joe did you will be out about $1850. I have swapped out countless NOS tubes but have never gotten around to swapping caps.
 
How would the ES9038PRO chip compare to the others?
 
Hello, Joe.

i was just debating whether to ask how the AK4497 differs sonically from the AK4490 when I got notification of your post.

Tack my question on, please. :yahoo1:

I've heard the Gustard X20u and the X20-Pro side by side, and the modded Oppo Sonica at a different time, so I'm reasonably certain of the 90xx series sound. I think "clear and resolving" can describe the sound. The DACs need 200 to 300 hours to burn off the brightness that is present out of the box. My understanding of the AK4490 (and perhaps the 4497?) is it's warmer sounding, but I don't know if this is accurate.
 
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Joe

From owning DAC's with the 9018, 9038 and the 4490 the difference is subtle but there and it is in the basic voicing of the chip to me. The ESS chips are all about detail and resolution while the AKM's are more mid-range friendly. Based on the DAC's you have had in house recently to me the AKM based MP should have been on one end and the Ayre with the 9038 chip on the other with the DS in the middle. The MP is the one that you can change slightly in one direction or the other with tube choices. That's based to me on the Nuprime and W4S (9018) the MP (4490) and the Sonica(9038). Others could hear it differently.
 
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