Jay's Audio Journey

SCAudiophile said:
Great point...a good number of people seem (IMHO) to over treat their rooms with absorbers, diffusors, resonators, etc...

The thing I have not understood (and it may be my lack of knowledge) is that you'll see a system and a speaker in a room,
there will be many room treatments on the wall and then a big speaker upgrade will occur and yet the speaker is brought
into the room with the treatments remaining in the same places of the same types, numbers of them, etc...

It's true there are certain aspects of a room that need treating but I tend to think that 90% of the treatments in the room are
to treat the room in the context of the system playing in that room as of then, including the specific speaker's behavior in-room.

If someone does a big upgrade (e.g. Alexia to Alexx V in Wilson terms or a cross-upgrade i.e. one speaker brand to another), it would seem that you should take all treatments down, install the new speaker, position it for best imaging, bass, mids, highs, etc...and then
and only then, start experimenting with room treatment if any is needed for the new speaker and build up only what is needed.

I've not been able to rationalize using the same room treatment treatment strategy from the prior setup after a major change in speakers/performance/playback personality.

FWIW and only one man's opinion and all that.
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Room treatment can be broken into 2 purposes - low frequency management and all above determined by the Shroeder frequency. For low frequency and using your Wilson upgrade example and assuming the same expectations in terms of listening volume little would change in terms of treatment and its placement. For mid / higher frequencies also little would change unless the speaker / sweet spot placement was significantly different and given that both speakers are fundamentally the same in terms of design and driver topology, they would probably end up in very similar positions. My experience in my rooms and others I've set up agree with this philosophy via the results. Moving from mini monitors to Gryphon Kodos and things start to deviate more so, but the fundamentals stay the same.

Net is - For low frequency in particular, the room doesn't care about your speaker type IF the low frequency drivers are at the same approximate placement as your previous model. Most rooms simply cannot reproduce very low frequencies adequately (high quality and linearly relative to adjacent frequencies) without subwoofers and / or EQ. Most rooms simply aren't large enough. So treatment is only part of a larger requirement to get high quality sound.
 
Alpinist said:
Mike,

The Fenice are tremendous sounding speakers!

Ken
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The sound is so clear and open that I don't believe they are a Sonus Faber. I've had some (which I loved) and I'm a fan of the brand, or rather, of some models.
By chance, I heard The Sonus Faber once, at the dealer, in an acoustically treated room, with Audio Research's top-of-the-line monoblocks, and it was the worst I've heard from the brand so far. Of course there were other audiophiles there who liked a lot but to my taste, the sound was loaded with coloration.
 
and me the wilsons, applies to both the alexxV and xvx.

jsut from hearing it is too difficult. one hears more his own system than the one on the screen.
 
sb6 said:
Agreed, however your example leaves at least 2 surfaces almost completely untreated. Why spend so much $ on gear and inadequately manage what many argue is the most important piece of the sonic puzzle. The best systems sound the best in the best rooms.
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Well, I've been there to hear the M9s and the Pilium amplification.

BobVandM9.jpg


And your comments about "at least 2 untreated surfaces" is based on what? The fact there are glass windows and doors? Look at my signature, you'll see the acoustician who designed my room is Dr. Bonnie Schnitta of SoundSense. When she visited she said she has no problem working with one reflective surface, so that leaves the wall with glass, which you notice has curtains and those have SoundSense custom acoustic lining.

When I walked into Alon's listening/showroom @ Magico, the first thing I noticed (and my traveling companion as well) was, "wow, this room feels and sounds a lot like my room". It was a great confirmation even though the Magico room is at least double the volume.

You can read about my room build-out here: Starting Point - Bob's new room and Alexia's new home

Around page 7 you'll start to see some pictures of the behind-the-scene treatment.

Now back to Jay's thread.
 
If you’ve watched Jay’s videos over the last couple months up to the most recent one, you’ll have an excellent idea what speakers are in his listening room.

Ken
 
Bobvin said:
Well, I've been there to hear the M9s and the Pilium amplification.

BobVandM9.jpg


And your comments about "at least 2 untreated surfaces" is based on what? The fact there are glass windows and doors? Look at my signature, you'll see the acoustician who designed my room is Dr. Bonnie Schnitta of SoundSense. When she visited she said she has no problem working with one reflective surface, so that leaves the wall with glass, which you notice has curtains and those have SoundSense custom acoustic lining.

When I walked into Alon's listening/showroom @ Magico, the first thing I noticed (and my traveling companion as well) was, "wow, this room feels and sounds a lot like my room". It was a great confirmation even though the Magico room is at least double the volume.

You can read about my room build-out here: Starting Point - Bob's new room and Alexia's new home

Around page 7 you'll start to see some pictures of the behind-the-scene treatment.

Now back to Jay's thread.
Click to expand...

I click on the link and it took me to Paul’s McIntosh thread.
a1bb9e87fcc2032dedd7950494f9c2d5.jpg
 
Bobvin said:
Well, I've been there to hear the M9s and the Pilium amplification.

And your comments about "at least 2 untreated surfaces" is based on what? The fact there are glass windows and doors? Look at my signature, you'll see the acoustician who designed my room is Dr. Bonnie Schnitta of SoundSense. When she visited she said she has no problem working with one reflective surface, so that leaves the wall with glass, which you notice has curtains and those have SoundSense custom acoustic lining.

When I walked into Alon's listening/showroom @ Magico, the first thing I noticed (and my traveling companion as well) was, "wow, this room feels and sounds a lot like my room". It was a great confirmation even though the Magico room is at least double the volume.

You can read about my room build-out here: Starting Point - Bob's new room and Alexia's new home

Around page 7 you'll start to see some pictures of the behind-the-scene treatment.

Now back to Jay's thread.
Click to expand...

Since you responded, allow me to explain.

Yes I saw the curtains over the windows, however via the picture your floor and ceiling don't appear to be treated. I didn't read your room thread details, however, congrats if you are happy. And if you believe your room, "Feels and sounds a lot like" the Magico room, awesome. And if you like the looks, even better.

The net of it all is - room treatment matters. And the better your system the more you have to lose by not treating it properly. With the scratch and time you spent on your room, I'm sure you concur.


And now back to the regularly scheduled program - Jay's speaker reveal...
 
Alpinist said:
If you’ve watched Jay’s videos over the last couple months up to the most recent one, you’ll have an excellent idea what speakers are in his listening room.

Ken
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If it’s just another Wilson that will be so boring as he’s owned half a dozen of them. XLF is fairly efficient but not the new stuff that drops down to 2 ohms.

I like Mikes idea and their resale should be in the Jay zone. Have always wanted to hear the beasts.

But the stack of crates in the latest video probably gives it away.
 
sb6 said:
Since you responded, allow me to explain.

Yes I saw the curtains over the windows, however via the picture your floor and ceiling don't appear to be treated. I didn't read your room thread details, however, congrats if you are happy. And if you believe your room, "Feels and sounds a lot like" the Magico room, awesome. And if you like the looks, even better.

The net of it all is - room treatment matters. And the better your system the more you have to lose by not treating it properly. With the scratch and time you spent on your room, I'm sure you concur.


And now back to the regularly scheduled program - Jay's speaker reveal...
Click to expand...

Please forgive me Jay... your big reveal comes tomorrow so I thought it would be OK to derail just a tiny bit longer.

My room was gutted—ceiling, walls, floor all part of the acoustic modeling, from studs outward to fabric faces in the album cabinet drawers everything was included. Even the computer generated random pattern custom BAD panels throughout the room have different drilling pattern 18” wide centered on ear height. The pad beneath the carpet has mass loaded vinyl layer beneath the foam, and between the pad and carpet (100% natural, untreated raw wool) is a layer of SoundSense “lumitex” custom liner. Ceiling has large custom “cloud” you can’t really see, it is backlit but in the room you never know it is there. Which was the goal, make an excellent sounding room where you are not aware it has been treated. WAF an extremely important consideration on this project.

It will be very interesting to see how placing three new pairs of speakers (each very different from the “box” speaker design that is Wilson) sounds in the room. Since there wasn’t anything in particular done in the room related to the Wilsons, I don’t expect there will be any anomalies. Speaker placement is always crucial, so it will be a learning curve for sure.
 
Bobvin said:
A nicely treated room need not look like an anechoic chamber or recording studio...
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I like the way Bob's room looks. It doesn't look like a lot of audio rooms that are so over treated that the room sucks the life out of the music.

I personally want a room that has a little life in it. Just a touch of slap echo.
 
I guess that M9 wasnt vaccinated :)

Have to agree with Jay on the WA vs M6, with classical music its an even bigger spread ..


Regards
 
a.wayne said:
I guess that M9 wasnt vaccinated :)

Have to agree with Jay on the WA vs M6, with classical music its an even bigger spread ..


Regards
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funny that you mention that because somehow i ended up playing classical the other night and was like omg... "ok classical music, you got my attention now"...
 
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