HIFi Five youtube channel

I can careless about reviewers being compensated, been happening for 30 years, not just mags now its you tubers are as well, do they need to be transparent about it, sure, but that will never happen and again another reason to trust. your own ears and a good dealer
 
BendingWave said:
Its not the positivity tour Michael it should be the honesty tour. The truth will set us all free LOL
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I love it - helping clean up hifi and exposing what you are ties in nicely with the HiFi Positivity Tour!

Thankfully the more we shine a light on the behaviors and people behind them, the easier it is for the rest of us who are in it for the love of music to focus on good parts.

I've noticed a new medical condition displayed by some lately - PDS: Positivity Derangement Syndrome. :)
 
Porsche said:
I can careless about reviewers being compensated, been happening for 30 years, not just mags now its you tubers are as well, do they need to be transparent about it, sure, but that will never happen and again another reason to trust. your own ears and a good dealer
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On this I disagree . We all have the power to foster change. Stop supporting those you don’t trust
 
BendingWave said:
On this I disagree . We all have the power to foster change. Stop supporting those you don’t trust
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I agree about change, but you and I both know all mag reviewers or you tubers, etc isn't gonna be honest, its there bread and butter per se. you may have some come out be legit, but now all, that's all im saying and at the end of the day a reviewer is just that, a reviewer, unless they have exact systems, as you do than you need to hear for your self and depend on a legit dealer that knows your systems and likes, etc. plane tickets are cheap
 
Porsche said:
I agree about change, but you and I both know all mag reviewers or you tubers, etc isn't gonna be honest, its there bread and butter per se. you may have some come out be legit, but now all, that's all im saying and at the end of the day a reviewer is just that, a reviewer, unless they have exact systems, as you do than you need to hear for your self and depend on a legit dealer that knows your systems and likes, etc. plane tickets are cheap
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I can't say all and I don't want to generalize. I can handle the truth and so can others. Let us end the pretense and just be honest about the process.
 
BendingWave said:
I can't say all and I don't want to generalize. I can handle the truth and so can others. Let us end the pretense and just be honest about the process.
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agree 100%, but you know as well as I do its been going on for 40 years and isn't going to stop. the other forum at axpona wouldn't enter my room this year cause we weren't sponsors and I was told only looking for big system, dunno, our system was just at a million with burmester and master artist speakers, not to shabby
 
Porsche said:
agree 100%, but you know as well as I do its been going on for 40 years and isn't going to stop. the other forum at axpona wouldn't enter my room this year cause we weren't sponsors and I was told only looking for big system, dunno, our system was just at a million with burmester and master artist speakers, not to shabby
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I had the same thing with a reviewer or at least he identified as one , just shorter lol, look in my room, looked at me and left. Why because I don’t have the same political views Fact!
 
BendingWave said:
Its not the positivity tour Michael it should be the honesty tour. The truth will set us all free LOL
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If you don't name names of reviewers and magazines that you have a beef with, how is that an honesty tour? It comes off as the Sour Grapes Tour because you are casting a dark shadow on all reviewers and audio publications.

The fear of being sued must run deep.
 
mep said:
If you don't name names of reviewers and magazines that you have a beef with, how is that an honesty tour? It comes off as the Sour Grapes Tour because you are casting a dark shadow on all reviewers and audio publications.

The fear of being sued must run deep.
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We just did a video and there was examples given and you can watch. I personally am never going to share my business with strangers on the internet sorry . Watch it its on Jays channel.
 
I'm not a dealer- I see it through the eyes of an ignorant consumer. The situation Florian described is not, in my opinion, a "loan." Its a barter transaction for services and I have to wonder if anyone is paying taxes on the MSRP of the equipment. Calling a chicken an eagle won't make it fly.

I've never bought anything significant used or on the internet-I value brick and mortar dealers for their expertise and, hopefully, service after the sale. That's gets harder, much harder, if you live in an area with few if any truly high end dealers. So reviewers, magazines, and shows can be important.

Here's a question that I don't remember being asked in these discussions: What is fair for a paid subscriber of the magazines to expect? I think it is fair to expect: (1) If something is presented as a review, that the reviewer be completely candid, detailing both positive and negative impressions of the product. Otherwise-its not really a review. If there are constraints on total candor-say so, just be honest about what you are doing, as in "we don't do negative or comparative reviews and if we think you can do better for less, we won't tell you," (2) full disclosure of any compensations, accommodations, whatever, that might call into question the objectivity of the reviewer-like otherwise unavailable big discounts or "loans" that extend beyond the time necessary for the review. What's the case against this very basic level of honesty? Isn't that the minimum respect that subscribers are owed?

I spent a good bit of time in both the Porsche room and Bending Wave room at CAF-both were superb and all the folks in those rooms were very gracious. Elliott gave me a nice Bending Wave hat which I've worn around town some. A few people have asked what a Bending Wave is, and I'm happy to explain. Maybe that makes me a Bending Wave shill.

At any rate, this can be cleaned up, at least in part, just by transparency and that's pretty cheap.

At its core, it seems that the economic model upon which these publications are based precludes complete candor with their readers. Just because its gone on for a long time doesn't mean its not FUBAR.

Sorry for the too long post-thanks to Jay for doing this enlightening video.
 
BendingWave said:
We just did a video and there was examples given and you can watch. I personally am never going to share my business with strangers on the internet sorry . Watch it its on Jays channel.
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I watched the video posted on this thread. There were claims made that had no names given. Who said they wanted to keep gear for 3 years and then sell it and they were going to keep the money? We can start there.
 
mep said:
I watched the video posted on this thread. There were claims made that had no names given. Who said they wanted to keep gear for 3 years and then sell it and they were going to keep the money? We can start there.
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that was a story that Florian told and I have no idea to whom he was referring to however the other things mentioned like the MBL and other things are fairly easy to piece together. It says you are a reviewer do some homework.
 
Kramer64 said:
I'm not a dealer- I see it through the eyes of an ignorant consumer. The situation Florian described is not, in my opinion, a "loan." Its a barter transaction for services and I have to wonder if anyone is paying taxes on the MSRP of the equipment. Calling a chicken an eagle won't make it fly.

I've never bought anything significant used or on the internet-I value brick and mortar dealers for their expertise and, hopefully, service after the sale. That's gets harder, much harder, if you live in an area with few if any truly high end dealers. So reviewers, magazines, and shows can be important.

Here's a question that I don't remember being asked in these discussions: What is fair for a paid subscriber of the magazines to expect? I think it is fair to expect: (1) If something is presented as a review, that the reviewer be completely candid, detailing both positive and negative impressions of the product. Otherwise-its not really a review. If there are constraints on total candor-say so, just be honest about what you are doing, as in "we don't do negative or comparative reviews and if we think you can do better for less, we won't tell you," (2) full disclosure of any compensations, accommodations, whatever, that might call into question the objectivity of the reviewer-like otherwise unavailable big discounts or "loans" that extend beyond the time necessary for the review. What's the case against this very basic level of honesty? Isn't that the minimum respect that subscribers are owed?

I spent a good bit of time in both the Porsche room and Bending Wave room at CAF-both were superb and all the folks in those rooms were very gracious. Elliott gave me a nice Bending Wave hat which I've worn around town some. A few people have asked what a Bending Wave is, and I'm happy to explain. Maybe that makes me a Bending Wave shill.

At any rate, this can be cleaned up, at least in part, just by transparency and that's pretty cheap.

At its core, it seems that the economic model upon which these publications are based precludes complete candor with their readers. Just because its gone on for a long time doesn't mean its not FUBAR.

Sorry for the too long post-thanks to Jay for doing this enlightening video.
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some great points and I also agree that a report is not a review and a reviewer by definition is a critic. Too many take the easy way out and IMO many are just not qualified , not all BTW some are
 
BendingWave said:
that was a story that Florian told and I have no idea to whom he was referring to however the other things mentioned like the MBL and other things are fairly easy to piece together. It says you are a reviewer do some homework.
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I'm not the one throwing accusations around with no receipts so why would I do homework to try and piece something together based on innuendo from a video?

How is sounding like sour grapes in videos going to bring honesty to the high-end if you don't name the bad actors?
 
mep said:
I'm not the one throwing accusations around with no receipts so why would I do homework to try and piece something together based on innuendo from a video?

How is sounding like sour grapes in videos going to bring honesty to the high-end if you don't name the bad actors?
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Ask the source dude, I did not say that so go ask for yourself. I'm no more responsible for him that I am for you.
 
Kramer64 said:
I'm not a dealer- I see it through the eyes of an ignorant consumer. The situation Florian described is not, in my opinion, a "loan." Its a barter transaction for services and I have to wonder if anyone is paying taxes on the MSRP of the equipment. Calling a chicken an eagle won't make it fly.

I've never bought anything significant used or on the internet-I value brick and mortar dealers for their expertise and, hopefully, service after the sale. That's gets harder, much harder, if you live in an area with few if any truly high end dealers. So reviewers, magazines, and shows can be important.

Here's a question that I don't remember being asked in these discussions: What is fair for a paid subscriber of the magazines to expect? I think it is fair to expect: (1) If something is presented as a review, that the reviewer be completely candid, detailing both positive and negative impressions of the product. Otherwise-its not really a review. If there are constraints on total candor-say so, just be honest about what you are doing, as in "we don't do negative or comparative reviews and if we think you can do better for less, we won't tell you," (2) full disclosure of any compensations, accommodations, whatever, that might call into question the objectivity of the reviewer-like otherwise unavailable big discounts or "loans" that extend beyond the time necessary for the review. What's the case against this very basic level of honesty? Isn't that the minimum respect that subscribers are owed?

I spent a good bit of time in both the Porsche room and Bending Wave room at CAF-both were superb and all the folks in those rooms were very gracious. Elliott gave me a nice Bending Wave hat which I've worn around town some. A few people have asked what a Bending Wave is, and I'm happy to explain. Maybe that makes me a Bending Wave shill.

At any rate, this can be cleaned up, at least in part, just by transparency and that's pretty cheap.

At its core, it seems that the economic model upon which these publications are based precludes complete candor with their readers. Just because its gone on for a long time doesn't mean its not FUBAR.

Sorry for the too long post-thanks to Jay for doing this enlightening video.
Click to expand...
@Kramer64 whos the "porsche" room?
 
BendingWave said:
Ask the source dude, I did not say that so go ask for yourself. I'm no more responsible for him that I am for you.
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My main point is that nothing is going to change if the goal of the videos you guys are involved in is to bring about honesty and all you people do is tell stories with no receipts.
 
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