Have Audiophiles and the Audiophile Press Become Irrelevant?

[Feanor]

Your statement, "
Sorry but what the Golden Ear dinosaurs don't want to hear is that measurements and blind testing have revealed is that a $2000 amplifier can perform as well or better than a $100,000 amp, or that a $200 DAC can perform on the level of a $20,000 DAC.", is just false in the inth degree, uber hyperbole

You owned a Pass amp if you say you couldn't hear any difference between that and your Hypex then you really have no business in this discussion at all. I don't care about your preference, that's your own bad taste but you certainly had to hear a difference.

Indeed I did hear a difference between the Pass X150.5 and my VTV Purifi 1ET400A amp. It seems to me, (subjectively afterall), that the Purifi amp was superior in all critical aspects, at least to my taste. The Purifi was more detail, transparent, and its bass was more articulate; the Pass' presentation was slightly warmer but not but sweeter sounding of the top end, (as one might expect).

I'll remind everyone that I'm NOT one of those that maintain that "All amps sound the same" -- they don't.

 

[Feanor]

Agreed. It wasn't measurements and blind testing that revealed a $2000 amplifier can perform as well or better than a $100,000 amp. That's only news for people who care about reading measurements and not actually listening to music.

Any subjective and honest listening confirms price has no bearing on which someone may prefer.

Let's not beat the issue to death. I'll reiterate that people are entitled to their own preferences. For me the $1500 sounded better than the $5500 amp that preceded it. Granted my particular music preference made it so.

Indeed I agree that price OUGHT to have no bearing on preference. But often, IMHO, beautiful industrial design or bragging rights are factors in addition to sound.

 

[Michaels HiFi]

Let's not beat the issue to death. I'll reiterate that people are entitled to their own preferences. For me the $1500 sounded better than the $5500 amp that preceded it. Granted my particular music preference made it so.

Indeed I agree that price OUGHT to have no bearing on preference. But often, IMHO, beautiful industrial design or bragging rights are factors in addition to sound.

I'm not beating anything to death. I'm simply responding to your posts about measurements and I share my thoughts - just as you do.

 

[Feanor]

I'm not beating anything to death. I'm simply responding to your posts about measurements and I share my thoughts - just as you do.

I suggest that one is more likely to find a correlation between measurements and sound that there is between price and sound. That is, regardless of one's sound preferences. So for example, if one likes a smooth/fuller/warmer sound one ought to look at the components harmonic spectrum to find high 2nd order harmonic distortion.

 

[Ricky64]

I would be curious in knowing what percent of audio dollar purchases are made by the uber wealthy, who really aren't "shopping around" for their equipment, and perhaps aren't critical listeners, but simply "want the best". For me, I want excellent sound, but there is a significant opportunity cost for my purchase. I need to do research to maximize my dollar. Also, for those of us that are hobbyists in audio, we like to spend thought energy to solve equipment "problems".
So yes, I suspect there are fewer of us audiophile hobbyists, who enjoy committing time to research equipment. I also believe there is a larger uber wealthy class that are spending large dollars, (this being recognized by manufacturers), who simply call a trusted dealer and accept a recommendation without spending a great deal of time with reviews. They are not hobbyists, nor do the consult the audio press.

 

[Michaels HiFi]

who simply call a trusted dealer and accept a recommendation without spending a great deal of time with reviews. They are not hobbyists, nor do the consult the audio press.

I would think we could say the same of the people who buy Ferrari's, McLaren's, Rolex, etc. and other things as well.

I've never known a Ferrari or Rolex owner to read reviews before they purchases.

There are also a lot of "normal audiophiles" who don't take the time to research (I don't know what that means since this is 100% subjective hobby so reviews are worthless) who simply buy based on looks and such, or Steve Huff with his "my new reference" B.S. he spouts off every month when a new piece comes in.

I don't think it's an income/class issue but for some reason in this hobby people tend to bring that up. I don't see the same comments in car forums from Honda owners about those who buy Ferrari's and such.

 

[Ricky64]

I would think we could say the same of the people who buy Ferrari's, McLaren's, Rolex, etc. and other things as well.

I've never known a Ferrari or Rolex owner to read reviews before they purchases.

There are also a lot of "normal audiophiles" who don't take the time to research (I don't know what that means since this is 100% subjective hobby so reviews are worthless) who simply buy based on looks and such, or Steve Huff with his "my new reference" B.S. he spouts off every month when a new piece comes in.

I don't think it's an income/class issue but for some reason in this hobby people tend to bring that up. I don't see the same comments in car forums from Honda owners about those who buy Ferrari's and such.

I'm not being critical of these folks at all. Just analyzing the AI responses re the diminished impacts of audiophiles and the audio press. I believe a lot of total audio dollars are being spent outside of the middle ground that contains the audiophile hobbyists, who are more likely to consult the audio press.

 

[Mike]

I would be curious in knowing what percent of audio dollar purchases are made by the uber wealthy, who really aren't "shopping around" for their equipment, and perhaps aren't critical listeners, but simply "want the best". For me, I want excellent sound, but there is a significant opportunity cost for my purchase. I need to do research to maximize my dollar. Also, for those of us that are hobbyists in audio, we like to spend thought energy to solve equipment "problems".
So yes, I suspect there are fewer of us audiophile hobbyists, who enjoy committing time to research equipment. I also believe there is a larger uber wealthy class that are spending large dollars, (this being recognized by manufacturers), who simply call a trusted dealer and accept a recommendation without spending a great deal of time with reviews. They are not hobbyists, nor do the consult the audio press.

I think we have a pretty good data pool to pull from with over 15,000 customers. The biggest misconception is that those buying systems at the highest end are just doing so because they want to just buy gear. The reality is that they are all music fans. The music drives their interest in pursuing the ultimate in musical reproduction. Many have worked hard their whole lives, raised their kids, got them through college and NOW they’re pursuing that audio system that they’ve always dreamed of.

I would say roughly half do not consult any medium for advice, they trust the dealer. The other half have perused various mediums to get some ideas of what they may or may not like.

 

[Michaels HiFi]

I'm not being critical of these folks at all. Just analyzing the AI responses re the diminished impacts of audiophiles and the audio press. I believe a lot of total audio dollars are being spent outside of the middle ground that contains the audiophile hobbyists, who are more likely to consult the audio press.

Hi Ricky - sorry I wasn't trying to say you were.

I meant in general I see that topic in hifi audio more than in any other.

 

[Kramer64]

I think we have a pretty good data pool to pull from with over 15,000 customers. The biggest misconception is that those buying systems at the highest end are just doing so because they want to just buy gear. The reality is that they are all music fans. The music drives their interest in pursuing the ultimate in musical reproduction. Many have worked hard their whole lives, raised their kids, got them through college and NOW they’re pursuing that audio system that they’ve always dreamed of.

I would say roughly half do not consult any medium for advice, they trust the dealer. The other half have perused various mediums to get some ideas of what they may or may not like.

I think that's right. I've invested more in my system than I ever thought I would and I like it, but you guys sell DACs for what my whole system cost so I'm not sure where high end starts these days. I bought what I have because I like the sound and I could afford it without ignoring any obligations. I listen every day and it brings me peace. Certainly not trying to impress anyone-most of my listening is alone, sometimes with my lady friend who could care less., as long as I keep enough cash to pick up the dinner check. And I don't tell people what my audio stuff cost, even the ones rude enough to ask. I'll bet lots of your customers-likely higher end than me-are the same way. This idea that anyone who pays for good sound is making an ego purchase is a myth as best I can tell. Its just what we value-like some people value watches or cars.