Congrats Lumin on MQA!

Mike

Mike

Audioshark
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Mike said:
Congrats to the great folks at Lumin for their MQA certification.

http://www.mqa.co.uk/customer/our-partners
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Mike, after clicking on the above "partners" link, it also shows Berkeley as a Playback partner.

Hopefully this means the the Ref II DAC with MQA will soon be ready to ship!

Early on it was stated that the new Berk DAC would have an MQA light on the chassis, is this still the case?
 
Odyssey said:
Mike, after clicking on the above "partners" link, it also shows Berkeley as a Playback partner.

Hopefully this means the the Ref II DAC with MQA will soon be ready to ship!

Early on it was stated that the new Berk DAC would have an MQA light on the chassis, is this still the case?
Click to expand...

I believe their will be an indication light. The hold up with Berkeley is final licensing bits in the contract. They hope to have ironed out in the next week or two. Subsequently, Berkeley is saying the MQA update, which required a complete rewriting of their assembly language code, improved PCM as well.


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Odyssey said:
Hopefully this means the the Ref II DAC with MQA will soon be ready to ship!
Click to expand...

According to a previous announcement, I believe their implementation is a MQA Renderer only, i.e. you need a MQA Core decoder to utilize it, such as Tidal desktop app, Audirvana, etc. (Lumin also plans to offer MQA Core decoding, but that's a different story.)
 
wklie said:
According to a previous announcement, I believe their implementation is a MQA Renderer only, i.e. you need a MQA Core decoder to utilize it, such as Tidal desktop app, Audirvana, etc. (Lumin also plans to offer MQA Core decoding, but that's a different story.)
Click to expand...

You will need an Aurender, Lumin U1 or Tidal desktop, etc. as the Berkeley is just a DAC.


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Mike said:
You will need an Aurender, Lumin U1 or Tidal desktop, etc. as the Berkeley is just a DAC.
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From Aurender web site [Edit: at the time of this post - see update in #12]: 'Aurender music servers do not perform MQA Core decoding, therefore they are unable to deliver the information necessary for an MQA Renderer to perform "the final unfold in its analog context"'. Without this functionality the Berkeley MQA Rendering cannot be used.

Case C:
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/...ler=page&path=ca/ca-academy/mqa-for-civilians
 
wklie said:
From Aurender web site: 'Aurender music servers do not perform MQA Core decoding, therefore they are unable to deliver the information necessary for an MQA Renderer to perform "the final unfold in its analog context"'. Without this functionality the Berkeley MQA Rendering cannot be used.

Case C:
https://www.computeraudiophile.com/...ler=page&path=ca/ca-academy/mqa-for-civilians
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You're confusing the issue. The Aurender can now pass MQA to an MQA DAC like the Berkeley to do the core decoding (once the Berkeley release is complete). Core decoding can only be done at the DAC stage.


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To my knowledge Berkeley is a MQA Renderer, not a Full Decoder, therefore it is not capable to perform Core Decoding. If Berkeley changed its plan since this announcement I've not read about it:

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/...qa-rendering-to-alpha-dac-reference-series-2/

Rendering can only be done at the DAC. Core Decoding can be done by Tidal desktop app, Audirvana, Full Decoder, or Lumin (after receiving MQA certification) in an optional mode.
 
Berkeley has developed an upgrade for their Reference DAC II which will decode MQA. It's release is expected in a week or two. The Aurender will pass it to the DAC and the DAC decodes it.


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Just spoke with Berkeley. Aurender is coming out with an update VERY SOON which will do core MQA unfolding on the N10, etc. Using that, we get full blown MQA with the Berkeley DAC acting as the renderer for that signal. The alternative is Tidal via PC which also does unfolding. Berkeley explained that the processing power for core unfolding would have required a separate box for them and sacrificed sound quality.

At the end of the day, this is all confusing for the end consumer and dealers.

All I care about is that my Lumin/Aurender/Berkeley customers will get full blown MQA at the end of the day. And that, they will. [emoji106]


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I'm sympathetic to Mike's comment that all of this is confusing. To add to the confusion, allow me to observe the following. The "unfolding" or "decoding" done by the Tidal app (or Audirvana, etc.) might prove far more crucial than the final rendering stage. It is the decoding/unfolding that unlocks the high-resolution we are looking for. The rendering at DAC level gives the MQA authorized sound by instituting a prescription of filters based upon hardware specific characteristics of the DAC. The rendering results in the MQA prescribed sound, but it also means that the MQA braintrust gets to hijack your DAC's designer in the crucial area of filter design. Paul McCowan of PS Audio won't allow the DirectStream to be controlled by outside people. Neither will Lukasz Fikus at Lampizator. I seriously doubt that Jason Stoddard and Mike Moffat of Schiit will play ball. If the MQA revolution succeeds, then there is a risk that all DACs will sound the same. No thanks.
 
BayStBroker said:
If the MQA revolution succeeds, then there is a risk that all DACs will sound the same. No thanks.
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I think we may be getting carried away worrying about that. One example of a fully MQA compliant DAC system is implemented in the Bluesound products, and while they offer an exceptional value they don't sound remotely similar other higher end MQA DACs. Just having MQA certify a DAC's final output does not make them all sound the same; there are still many differences apparently due to varying levels of build quality in their power supplies design, clocking circuits, specific DAC implementations, jitter handling, etc. Some designers may still object to making changes which MQA might require, but that doesn't mean that all MQA certified DACs sound identical.
 
audio.bill said:
I think we may be getting carried away worrying about that. One example of a fully MQA compliant DAC system is implemented in the Bluesound products, and while they offer an exceptional value they don't sound remotely similar other higher end MQA DACs. Just having MQA certify a DAC's final output does not make them all sound the same; there are still many differences apparently due to varying levels of build quality in their power supplies design, clocking circuits, specific DAC implementations, jitter handling, etc. Some designers may still object to making changes which MQA might require, but that doesn't mean that all MQA certified DACs sound identical.
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Well said Bill.


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2 years from now, I foresee there will be an "improved" MQA rendering version 2 with all new licensing for the improved version.
Assuming of course, that MQA still exists.
 
audio.bill said:
I think we may be getting carried away worrying about that. One example of a fully MQA compliant DAC system is implemented in the Bluesound products, and while they offer an exceptional value they don't sound remotely similar other higher end MQA DACs. Just having MQA certify a DAC's final output does not make them all sound the same; there are still many differences apparently due to varying levels of build quality in their power supplies design, clocking circuits, specific DAC implementations, jitter handling, etc. Some designers may still object to making changes which MQA might require, but that doesn't mean that all MQA certified DACs sound identical.
Click to expand...

I agree. Dac's from dCS, MSB, Meridian and Brinkmann playing MQA files do not sound alike.
 
Mike said:
Aurender is coming out with an update VERY SOON which will do core MQA unfolding on the N10, etc. Using that, we get full blown MQA with the Berkeley DAC acting as the renderer for that signal.
Click to expand...

Lumin S1 / A1 / T1 / D1 (in beta stage, going through certification) can also output MQA Core to its BNC-SPDIF if set to MQA Digital Output Mode (in addition to full MQA decoding to its analog outputs). Using it should also enable Berkeley to activate its MQA Rendering functionality.

We have also plans for Lumin U1 to output MQA Core (in alpha stage, not yet submitted to certification) to any of its digital output.
 
wklie said:
Lumin S1 / A1 / T1 / D1 (in beta stage, going through certification) can also output MQA Core to its BNC-SPDIF if set to MQA Digital Output Mode (in addition to full MQA decoding to its analog outputs). Using it should also enable Berkeley to activate its MQA Rendering functionality.

We have also plans for Lumin U1 to output MQA Core (in alpha stage, not yet submitted to certification) to any of its digital output.
Click to expand...

Excellent! I love the U1.


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I have been using Tidal on my D1 way more then I thought I would since I have 1400+++ cd's ripped on my nas. I am excited to hear the D1 on full MQA!
 
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