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Are class D amps evolving?
What's the latest and greatest?
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What's the latest and greatest?
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Class D amps.
- Thread starter Mike
- Start date
These look pretty amazing to me.
Bel Canto Black System
Bel Canto Looks Good in Black | Stereophile.com
Bel Canto Black System
Bel Canto Looks Good in Black | Stereophile.com
Last edited:
Jack
Active member
Mike
I think the best thought of theClass D amps are the Merrill's and quite pricey. I think your and Joe's dealer friend in NYC carries them.
I think the best thought of theClass D amps are the Merrill's and quite pricey. I think your and Joe's dealer friend in NYC carries them.
MDP
Behavior Moderator (be nice police!)
I know the reviews were mixed, but the Anthem M1's I had were very,very good !
Hi Fi News loved them, Stereophile not so much.
Hi Fi News loved them, Stereophile not so much.
I listened for some time to the Merrill Audio VERITAS Mono amps driving the TAD E1 at RMAF this past October. It was a very nice combination for sure. The music just poured, effortlessly from the E1's. For me, $12k for a pair of amps was out of the question, but I walked out of that room wondering if I could make it work.....and wanting to make it work.
Jack
Active member
These amps have been raved about for years on Audio Circle since the ICE modules became available. The only Class D amp I listened to did nothing for me. You can only tweak this stuff so far. Certainly not $12.000 a pair worth.
Thanks Mike,
I would have loved to hear that combo. I've been through many amps on my TADs and there are only a few that I like and less that I love.
I would have loved to hear that combo. I've been through many amps on my TADs and there are only a few that I like and less that I love.
KraemerDesigns
New member
I know a lot about class D amps and most importantly Hypex based amps, the one shown above from Bel Canto uses a Hypex SMPS and AMP board.
I'm very young at 26 but have been building amps for many years, it has always been fun for me and i get pleasure out of the final result.
That being said, class D has made leaps and bounds from the original designs made years ago. The biggest problems for class D is the roll off in the high frequencies and the dependence on speaker impedance on the outputs. But these problems are long gone (not in the cheap designs though). Bruno at Hypex has changed class D with his UCD and Ncore designs.
Hypex sells a board called the NC400 and it available exclusively for the DIY community, they also sell a board called the NC1200 for OEM solutions. Many companies offer pre built solutions for the NC400 for those customers that just don't know how to assemble and wire electronics. I have sold 20+ pairs of completed NC400 amps through my company Aluminati Sound but we have finally decided to discontinue this service as some new things are coming down the pipe line
I have heard from a few of my customers that the difference in sound between the NC400 and NC1200 is just not there and the price between the two is so drastic for the end customer. They do offer a significant difference in power and head room though.
You'd be surprised how cheap the NC1200 boards can be had for OEM. Just a little crazy that Bel sells a pair for $30K….
Here are some amps i have built Hypex and ICE Power based.
I still like ICE better
Matt Kraemer
I'm very young at 26 but have been building amps for many years, it has always been fun for me and i get pleasure out of the final result.
That being said, class D has made leaps and bounds from the original designs made years ago. The biggest problems for class D is the roll off in the high frequencies and the dependence on speaker impedance on the outputs. But these problems are long gone (not in the cheap designs though). Bruno at Hypex has changed class D with his UCD and Ncore designs.
Hypex sells a board called the NC400 and it available exclusively for the DIY community, they also sell a board called the NC1200 for OEM solutions. Many companies offer pre built solutions for the NC400 for those customers that just don't know how to assemble and wire electronics. I have sold 20+ pairs of completed NC400 amps through my company Aluminati Sound but we have finally decided to discontinue this service as some new things are coming down the pipe line
I have heard from a few of my customers that the difference in sound between the NC400 and NC1200 is just not there and the price between the two is so drastic for the end customer. They do offer a significant difference in power and head room though.
You'd be surprised how cheap the NC1200 boards can be had for OEM. Just a little crazy that Bel sells a pair for $30K….
Here are some amps i have built
Hypex and ICE Power based. I still like ICE better
Matt Kraemer
NorthStar
New member
I know a lot about class D amps and most importantly Hypex based amps, the one shown above from Bel Canto uses a Hypex SMPS and AMP board.
I'm very young at 26 but have been building amps for many years, it has always been fun for me and i get pleasure out of the final result.
That being said, class D has made leaps and bounds from the original designs made years ago. The biggest problems for class D is the roll off in the high frequencies and the dependence on speaker impedance on the outputs. But these problems are long gone (not in the cheap designs though). Bruno at Hypex has changed class D with his UCD and Ncore designs.
Hypex sells a board called the NC400 and it available exclusively for the DIY community, they also sell a board called the NC1200 for OEM solutions. Many companies offer pre built solutions for the NC400 for those customers that just don't know how to assemble and wire electronics. I have sold 20+ pairs of completed NC400 amps through my company Aluminati Sound but we have finally decided to discontinue this service as some new things are coming down the pipe line
I have heard from a few of my customers that the difference in sound between the NC400 and NC1200 is just not there and the price between the two is so drastic for the end customer. They do offer a significant difference in power and head room though.
You'd be surprised how cheap the NC1200 boards can be had for OEM. Just a little crazy that Bel sells a pair for $30K….
Here are some amps i have built
I still like ICE better
Matt Kraemer
Hi Matt.
CPP
Active member
I got a chance to listen to Wyred4Sound mAMP monoblocks, not bad for the dollar...not bad at all....
The only NCore amps I have heard were a pair of $2K mono blocks. A friend brought them over to place in my system and they were dull and flat sounding. I much prefer the cheap Class D amps from Home page I have a kit amp from here that sounds great. They are very dynamic, with great bass, air, transparency and a wide sound stage. They lean a bit to the sunny side and sound best with a warmer preamp and tubes. I use mine with a cheap chinese tube preamp/dac and my MMG speakers.
Audioseduction
Active member
One of our audio club members brought over a pair of Merrill Audio VERITAS Mono amps to have a shootout against my Pass Labs xa160.5s. The Merrills sounded sterile and less musical then the Pass. The 3 of us agreed the Merrills were boring non-engaging. I think 12K for them is a big joke.
I can't see a digital amp in the same league as a Pass amp. They are not there yet. The best digital amps that I have heard are the Nuforce Model 9se v2.0 monoblocks. But if feel that if you want to get HiFi sound for very little money in a budget system a digital amp can give you that. At least the Class D audio amp that I have has tremendous bass, tight, fast, with very good air and detail. 250wpc for less that $500. Even a cheap little digital integrated amp like my Dayton Audio DTA100a from Parts Express sounds awesome with a good source and my PSB B6 speakers in my bedroom.
Although, as a said before, the Ncore's that I heard where dull and flat. I am sure that there are better NCores
Although, as a said before, the Ncore's that I heard where dull and flat. I am sure that there are better NCores
George, with being said, given the capacitive characteristics of your stat panel I'd wager the Class D amps are far more speaker dependent.
Audioseduction
Active member
I would agree David. Not my cup of tea.
MerrillAudio
New member
That is too bad that your audio club member took my prototype VERITAS Monoblocks that he was not supposed to share with anyone but he did wanted them earlier until he got the final version. From all your postings it would appear that you certainly have it out for Merrill Audio, which is to bad and I certainly don't know what the issue is since we have not met, along with your friend who is a tube and horn guy.
Here is a pass lab owner who traded a Pass Labs X600 for the VERITAS and his findings.
AudiogoN Forums: Review: The Merrill Audio Veritas Monoblocks
And if you search the web, you will find many more like this. I understand your Florida Audio Club does not like Merrill Audio as we are a young company or the VERITAS Monoblocks, to each their own flavor of ice cream, as another member put it.
Those are rather strong words that you think the price is a joke, not having heard or seen the production version of the VERITAS.
Here is a list of the reviews from experienced, professionals reviewers who state this is a excellent amplifier and well worth the money, competing with amps much more expensive than the VERITAS. Click on the links to go to the reviews.
Positive Feedback
StereoMojo - Also given the Rare Mojo Maximum Award. (reviewer is a self confessed Tube lover with VTM100 and Wilson Maxx)
Dagogo
Enjoy the Music - Used the Sound Labs Majectc 845 electrostatic panels for the review.
Part-Time Audiophile (Also writer for The absolute Sound)
Tone Magazine
Here are some of the owners who have posted. The links will take you to their posts
www.tirnahifi.org - Irish forum
www.Xtremeplace.com - Singapore forum
AudiogoN Forums: Merrill Audio VERITAS Amps: Any other experiances? - Compared to ARC VTM200
AudiogoN Forums: Merrill VERITAS monoblock amplifiers - A long thread with a 6 month update.
And if you have the time to search the web, there are owners in Denmark, France, Germany etc who have posted their findings in their local forums.
Please don't take my word for the above. Do engage with the many owners and reviewers out there who find the VERITAS Monoblocks, Musical, Engaging and tremendous value for the money.
Do come and see us at Axpona 2014, Burton Room. We will be displaying the Sadurni Acoustics Staccato Horn Speaker System (110db efficiency) driven by the VERITAS Monoblocks and the souce will be Master Tapes from International Phonographic Inc and High Definition Tape Transfers.
There will be specific uninterrupted listening sessions at 11am and 6am everyday of the show, playing original Tape Masters on Reel to Reel from International Phonographic. One of the tapes is the original Benny Goodman recordings done in Germany.
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Audioseduction
Active member
I just don't care for class D amps period except for sub and bass amplification they work great! Now if I heard your final product that might be a different story. I just like the sound of class A amps better then AB or D amps.