Are audio reviewers biased or incredibly biased?

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Mike said:
What you have to remember, is that there are real people behind these products. Trust me, there is lots I would like to say, but like others, I "massage" the wording a bit because I don't want to hurt anyones feelings. If people are serious about something, they can PM me. I was pretty hard on the Polymer guy for example. BELIEVE ME, there was a lot more I wanted to say.....my tongue is a little raw from all the biting. :)

But at the end of the day, these are all just opinions and opinions are like....well, you know.

Sure...do your research, but listen for yourself, and ultimately, decide for yourself. I am constantly amazed at how many people would prefer to spend money, then time.
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I agree, that nothing beats listening and playing with for one's self. That's why I never read professional reviews or at least don't take them seriously in making a decision on something. User reviews I take more stock in, but one has to be careful there too, very much so. Once you've read a hundred of those or so you start to become better at recognizing the wheat from the chaff shall we say? I personally would still not base any decision on reviews of any type by themselves.
Personally, if I can't demo something in a shop at least after reading up on it, then I usually have a very hard time considering it. (I'm not fortunate enough to have the ability of demo at home and such).
 
Mike said:
Aren't sales numbers the ultimate reviewer?

I've always said, ignore the reviews and just watch what people BUY. When it comes time to put down all their hard earned cash, what are people BUYING? I read lots of brouhaha about Rockport for example....but I sure don't see lots of folks BUYING them. Just saying....
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The fact that sometimes people can be lemmings also needs to be factored in. Look at how many products that are junk or something that have sales numbers beyond calculation. Sometimes it also helps to try to find an honest dealer who can tell you how many returns there has been with those sales numbers.
There are many factors we have to consider really. Just my opinion.
 
+1
I know very well how to read thru underlying review intent. And certainly a scarcity of negative reviews makes all this gushing positive commentary hard to sort out. I love when objective data like you presented on the Polymer bass humps really adds credibility to a review. I do agree with Myles that a 3 month review does take a lot of time and effort. And certainly them getting a great price is also not an issue just simply state this in your review. What equipment a reviewer lists does not inform any reader what was a gift or greatly reduced. To keep it simple just state it once if it relates to the product being mainly reviewed

Nick
 
Penthouse-D said:
I can't remember reading a bad review. Ever....
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I sure have. I've written a few in my lifetime. Not fun at all.

But what is the reviewer's job? I think it's to accurately describe the sound of a component, both strengths and weaknesses. But in the end, what does trashing a component buy you in reality? I know of course that there are those out there who believe that TAS went downhill when HP stopped trashing equipment. I don't know. I think that it's also our job to promote the industry whenever possible. God only knows we have enough idiots out there already trying to trash high end who have never heard a high-end component and look soley at measurements.

And I'd aver that we live in the age where the quality of the components from the top to the bottom of the price scale is better than we've ever experienced.
 
MusicDirector said:
I agree, that nothing beats listening and playing with for one's self. That's why I never read professional reviews or at least don't take them seriously in making a decision on something. User reviews I take more stock in, but one has to be careful there too, very much so. Once you've read a hundred of those or so you start to become better at recognizing the wheat from the chaff shall we say? I personally would still not base any decision on reviews of any type by themselves.
Personally, if I can't demo something in a shop at least after reading up on it, then I usually have a very hard time considering it. (I'm not fortunate enough to have the ability of demo at home and such).
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This falls right in line with the Is High End Obsolete thread. If one cannot go to a store to see, hear, and touch gear, what's left? Reviews, right? At some point you have to trust one or many, or realize that the unit is not worth it. But then again, what sounds good to Fremer may not sound the same way to my ears, and the other way around.

As for the OP question, yeah I would like something way better if I got it for 1/3 what everyone else has to pay.
 
Shadowfax said:
This falls right in line with the Is High End Obsolete thread. If one cannot go to a store to see, hear, and touch gear, what's left? Reviews, right? At some point you have to trust one or many, or realize that the unit is not worth it. But then again, what sounds good to Fremer may not sound the same way to my ears, and the other way around.

As for the OP question, yeah I would like something way better if I got it for 1/3 what everyone else has to pay.
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I'd also put speakers into a class by themselves. I wish we could base speaker purchases on reviews at least in part, but due to the nature of what they are and the way we hear, it's just not seemingly possible. Personally, I'd never base the purchase of a speaker based on any review. No speaker will sound the same to anyone's ears. For speakers, one must hear for themselves only, if one can in any way, in my opinion. It's just the nature of the beast.

I would not necessarily like something better just because of a huge price reduction. Granted, I wouldn't refuse that, but if the item doesn't do what I need or hoped for, then it's still wasted money and if I were a reviewer, I wouldn't give a product that doesn't live up to the claims a glowing review just because I got it for a fire sale price.
 
Mike said:
Aren't sales numbers the ultimate reviewer?

I've always said, ignore the reviews and just watch what people BUY. When it comes time to put down all their hard earned cash, what are people BUYING? I read lots of brouhaha about Rockport for example....but I sure don't see lots of folks BUYING them. Just saying....
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I'm not so sure on this. It could simply be good marketing otherwise us audiophiles would all be buying B&W speakers. On a lesser higher end scale, if we went by sales we'd all own Bose, Beats etc....
 
veindoc said:
Heard a tidbit that intrigued me today when a bonafide quest on the Howard Stern show admitted to being a true Audiophile and audio writer/reviewer. He unabashedly admitted he had a $150,000 Continuum Turntable. Howard quickly asked did you pay that and he said as he is "in the business" as a reviewer he did not pay that price. Quickly Howard quipped 75 k but less than a minute later he admitted it was more like 50k. My point of this discussion is that this type of relationship oozes of profound pressure to write a very favorably biased review. I think all of us know reviews should be taken with a kilogram of
Salt but a 2/3rd price reduction on equipment is reprehensible and violates all integrity of the magazine. I know my ears , AS members and not pro reviewers will serve me better in the future. BTW it was Michael Fremer but I am sure the vast majority of his cohorts have similar deals.

Nick
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I've read your post very late last night, and it was a 'refreshing' read.
Who doesn't know Howard Stern, or Michael Fremer? ...The former a celebrity, the later another type of celebrity.

I'm good with both of them, and also with a whole lot more people.

Money is a religion, and that's a fact. :)
 
MusicDirector said:
I'd also put speakers into a class by themselves. I wish we could base speaker purchases on reviews at least in part, but due to the nature of what they are and the way we hear, it's just not seemingly possible. Personally, I'd never base the purchase of a speaker based on any review. No speaker will sound the same to anyone's ears. For speakers, one must hear for themselves only, if one can in any way, in my opinion. It's just the nature of the beast.

I would not necessarily like something better just because of a huge price reduction. Granted, I wouldn't refuse that, but if the item doesn't do what I need or hoped for, then it's still wasted money and if I were a reviewer, I wouldn't give a product that doesn't live up to the claims a glowing review just because I got it for a fire sale price.
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LOL, if a $150K Turntable doesn't do what one would expect it to do, we are all in trouble. But getting one for $50k knowing it does must be a real steal.
 
Penthouse-D said:
I can't remember reading a bad review. Ever....
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I have been reading Michael Fremer's reviews right from the very beginning when he first became an audio writer/reviewer.
Michael is very uniquely articulate in his prose and humor. He's mostly direct, and not a shy guy; a very good attribute.
...And very often the last component reviewed is the best one he has never heard before.

Michael is one among many many more audio writers/reviewers, and he's himself.
...And a good fit for Howard Stern's show.
 
NorthStar said:
Money is a religion, and that's a fact. :)
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Money is a tool, and a physical manifestation of your life energy. We always trade some of our precious time here on earth for things we value, and things we need. Money facilitates that, because it would be hard for me to travel to Dave Wilson and provide him with an equivalent time trade for his speakers. He might not want or value water filters, which is what I make. Thankfully enough people do value what I make, and reward me with their hard earned dollars, enough so that I eek out a little profit, which I can share with Mr. Wilson and his crew. Money just greases the skids, you go through life without $$, there is a lot more friction, screeching and scratching. If you are lucky enough to find a way to provide value, you can go through life with a little more $$, and then there's less friction. Having a little extra $$ can help you slide through some otherwise sticky situations.

As to Mr. Fremer, I value his reviews, but he seems to prefer a more analytical and (dare I say) dry sound than I prefer. He loves his vinyl, and continues to be one of the biggest vinyl evangelists, but I personally prefer a little of the bloom I usually only hear from tubes.

Tubes and vinyl forever!!! (best enjoyed in the company of beautiful women and a great Cabernet!)
 
Shadowfax said:
LOL, if a $150K Turntable doesn't do what one would expect it to do, we are all in trouble. But getting one for $50k knowing it does must be a real steal.
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Well, like I said, how many of us wouldn't appreciate a good deal? We are also talking about a table that cost as much as a Ferrari, it's still just a sports car. A car does nothing but get you from point A to point B and the most important thing is reliability and cost does not always equate with reliability. On top of that there is cost of ownership to consider.
It's the same thing with audio gear in my opinion. So it's a $150k Turntable, it still does nothing different from any other turntable at a much lower cost. It's no more reliable, just because it cost more. It's just as vulnerable to mishaps as any other table, but cost much more to replace. Also, just try including it in your homeowner's insurance, good luck.
How many of us here could even get that table at $50k? How many of us would really want to? $50K far exceeds my yearly gross salary to put it in perspective. I have reference speakers I got a good deal on and enjoy beyond the limits of my abilities, but I also worry about them even with insurance. I had to save long and hard, but they were a fraction of my yearly salary still. Personally, I don't think I could handle owning anything with market worth that exceeded 50% of my yearly gross, but that's just me.
Many of us here have gotten deals on gear one way or the other, let Mr. Fremer have his. I know I have, but discretion is the better part of valor as well. If he wants to spend that amount of scratch on a turntable, I'm just glad it isn't my money. If he loves the table, then let him enjoy.
 
Yes the ML 53's are very good and have never had anyone say they were bad. Also what reviewer said Constellation doesn't have bass . That is completely wrong and have proved that to several members. Now because of this one reviewer constellation has a reputation for not having bass. These reviewers need to be careful about what they talk about and how they interpret their product that they're reviewing.
 
Penthouse-D said:
I can't remember reading a bad review. Ever....
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Sad to say, I'm old enough to remember - and maybe some of you as well - J. Gordon Holt writing a very negative review of ARC's SP9 when it first came out. He took quite the shellacking for it if I recall.

If you read some of the archived/old reviews on the Stereophile website, and compare them with some of today, you'll find that current reviews tend to have a much more positive slant about them than say ones from 20+ years ago.
 
While i like Fremer's humour and enjoy his reviews, i'm sure i wouldn't want a caliburn table if i had $50k to drop. Agree with several posters above that it's his business if he likes it and if he got a great deal on it. We all know reviews are subjective and we really need to experience the impact of gear in our own systems in our own rooms/spaces. When demos are not possible, reviews by friends, dealers forums and mags are helpful in narrowing down the options.
High sales may be effective marketing rather than superior product or value. What i recognize is how passion drives alot of our actions in this hobby. Hearing something new, different, or in a new way, is exciting and we often have a hard time keeping this to ourselves :)
I'm sure that reviewers are no different, they just get paid to play with the new toys.
 
veindoc said:
+1
I know very well how to read thru underlying review intent. And certainly a scarcity of negative reviews makes all this gushing positive commentary hard to sort out. I love when objective data like you presented on the Polymer bass humps really adds credibility to a review. I do agree with Myles that a 3 month review does take a lot of time and effort. And certainly them getting a great price is also not an issue just simply state this in your review. What equipment a reviewer lists does not inform any reader what was a gift or greatly reduced. To keep it simple just state it once if it relates to the product being mainly reviewed

Nick
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I think you would be shocked by what consumers think is a great or even rave review and what a manufacturer thinks is a great review! :)
 
MusicDirector said:
It's the same thing with audio gear in my opinion. So it's a $150k Turntable, it still does nothing different from any other turntable at a much lower cost. It's no more reliable, just because it cost more. It's just as vulnerable to mishaps as any other table, but cost much more to replace. Also, just try including it in your homeowner's insurance, good luck.
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Sorry but I don't agree that the Coliburn doesn't do anything different than a cheaper table. Sure at the surface level they both roate a record at 33 or 45 rpm - or even 78 rpm. But that's where all similarities begin and end. That's like looking at the gentle curves of all Burgandy bottles and saying all Burgandy wines contained inside are the same. There are vast sonic, and build differences between expensive and inexpensive tables. And that can be measured as the late Dick Heyser did in Audio many years ago.

Speaking though of measurements and data, I am curious where you get your facts regarding turntable reliability. I am not aware of any studies on the topic. Nor did I have any issues insuring my table as long as I have a sales receipt. Mishaps? Well tomorrow you can step off a curb and get run over. Or you could spill a drink on your amp. I doubt any member here ever bought a table worrying about mishaps nor is it an argument to buy cheaper equipment.

And actually, equipment doesn't cost anything to repair as most gear comes with a three year warranty. I've also found the industry most accommodating on repair of equipment that's seven or more years old. In fact, the biggest cost is often shipping the equipment back for repair. I've seen companies like Krell replace a blown transistor in a seven year old amp for free. Ditto for conrad-johnson when a resistor went in an eight year old amp. Customer service stories like this abound in the industry and one reason I'm proud to be a part of it (and there's lot more where those came from too!)

All things being equal, better tables and arms use better part, better arm and spindle bearing build, tighter tolerances, better drive systems and power supplies with less macro and micro speed fluctuations, better isolation, less resonant platters, etc. Even look at Fremer's review/comparison of the speed stability of two dd tables that are both an order of magnitude or better than belt drive. And even the the two SOTA dd table's speed stability vary (and mind you they both use the same military, non-cogging (now did you ever investigate that aspect of motor design that has major implications in speed stability?).
 
Penthouse-D said:
I can't remember reading a bad review. Ever....
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You obviously don't read that many reviews. I couldn't count all of the bad reviews I have read over the years. Do you think JA is pulling many punches when he does his measurements and describes problems with the gear?
 
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