ARC REF 5SE - New Review

The review's comparison of the REF 5SE to a SET amp leaves me bewildered. There is no comparison imagined or real.
 
The best preamp I have ever owned, by far. I miss it and think about it from time to time….gets me all choked up.
 
mep said:
The review's comparison of the REF 5SE to a SET amp leaves me bewildered. There is no comparison imagined or real.
Click to expand...

The guy is an idiot. Plus all the amps he used had input impedances that are just on the edge of what ARC recommends pairing with any of their preamps (minimum suggested load is 20Kohms) and he did say that the MC501 monos with a 10Kohm input impedance on RCA connection and 20Kohm input impedance on the XLR input were a bit too wooly in the bass region. Well his other 2 amps were like 30Kohm impedance. If you look at all of ARC's amps (SS or tube) their input impedance is 100Kohms or higher so there would be no impedance mismatch with their preamps. So right off the bat, he is not using well matched amps to get an optimal read on the Ref 5SE. And I totally agree with you that the comparison with SET amps is completely inappropriate and inaccurate and just a poor analogy to make (apples and oranges type comparison). Let's just say, this reviewer did not impress me with his reviewing acumen.
 
cmalak said:
The guy is an idiot. Plus all the amps he used had input impedances that are just on the edge of what ARC recommends pairing with any of their preamps (minimum suggested load is 20Kohms) and he did say that the MC501 monos with a 10Kohm input impedance on RCA connection and 20Kohm input impedance on the XLR input were a bit too wooly in the bass region. Well his other 2 amps were like 30Kohm impedance. If you look at all of ARC's amps (SS or tube) their input impedance is 100Kohms or higher so there would be no impedance mismatch with their preamps. So right off the bat, he is not using well matched amps to get an optimal read on the Ref 5SE. And I totally agree with you that the comparison with SET amps is completely inappropriate and inaccurate and just a poor analogy to make (apples and oranges type comparison). Let's just say, this reviewer did not impress me with his reviewing acumen.
Click to expand...

+1
 
cmalak said:
The guy is an idiot. Plus all the amps he used had input impedances that are just on the edge of what ARC recommends pairing with any of their preamps (minimum suggested load is 20Kohms) and he did say that the MC501 monos with a 10Kohm input impedance on RCA connection and 20Kohm input impedance on the XLR input were a bit too wooly in the bass region. Well his other 2 amps were like 30Kohm impedance. If you look at all of ARC's amps (SS or tube) their input impedance is 100Kohms or higher so there would be no impedance mismatch with their preamps. So right off the bat, he is not using well matched amps to get an optimal read on the Ref 5SE. And I totally agree with you that the comparison with SET amps is completely inappropriate and inaccurate and just a poor analogy to make (apples and oranges type comparison). Let's just say, this reviewer did not impress me with his reviewing acumen.
Click to expand...

Well said cmalak!
You vocalized exactly what I thought while reading the review.
+1
 
Love this preamp...anyone know how long the tubes needs replacement?
 
cmalak said:
The guy is an idiot. Plus all the amps he used had input impedances that are just on the edge of what ARC recommends pairing with any of their preamps (minimum suggested load is 20Kohms) and he did say that the MC501 monos with a 10Kohm input impedance on RCA connection and 20Kohm input impedance on the XLR input were a bit too wooly in the bass region. Well his other 2 amps were like 30Kohm impedance. If you look at all of ARC's amps (SS or tube) their input impedance is 100Kohms or higher so there would be no impedance mismatch with their preamps. So right off the bat, he is not using well matched amps to get an optimal read on the Ref 5SE. And I totally agree with you that the comparison with SET amps is completely inappropriate and inaccurate and just a poor analogy to make (apples and oranges type comparison). Let's just say, this reviewer did not impress me with his reviewing acumen.
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm wrong, but I read it as his way to verify indeed that input impedance matters with the 5SE. He didn't say he had any issues with his Edge or Boulder amps. I actually found that a refreshing comment as so many folks think you can pair anything together and make it work (aka measurements don't matter). ARC's amps are irrelevant to the review.

Hard to compare any balanced design to a SET amp though lol.
 
larevoj said:
Love this preamp...anyone know how long the tubes needs replacement?
Click to expand...

Late post. I own the Ref 5 SE too and am very pleased with its performance.

Didn't read the review mentioned above, but if true that the Ref 5 SE was hooked up to an amp with 20K ohms or less input impedance, the review was a waste of time and reading it will be a waste of my time.

Been there and done it with "asymmetric overloading" of my old Ref 3. I use the term "asymmetric overloading" to describe hooking up old Ref 3 to my ARC VS 115 (300K input impedance) (old amp) via XLR I/Cs and my subwoofer (10K ohms) via RCA I/Cs. ARC told me to fix the loading format. If anyone is interested in better understanding the problem and my fix, check out my Audiogon posts on the subject. Do a search of Tom Tutay and you will find the relevant posts. Bottom line: problem is fixed today.

As to Larevoj's question, ARC advised me to replace the 6550 WE power supply regulator at 2000 hours and the 6H30 tubes should be replaced between 3500 and 4000 hours. At least that's ARC's official recommendation.
 
This question may not fit here but it's regarding the Ref5SE anyhow. Namely I'm thinking about swapping my ModWright LS36.5DM with Ref5SE. Did anybody have experience with both of these line stages so that he could make a comparison? Is it worth to swap? I don't have a chance to demo so that's the reason for asking. Anyhow it should drive my Ref75. Thanks in advance!
 
Probably not. The 36.5 has a separate power supply and while I've never owned one, I've heard it on several occasions since the local dealer is friend. Both are excellent, but I don't think the 5se will give you a substantial performance gain.
 
Golum, to throw a cat amongst the pidgeons...I would recommend considering a 2nd hand ARC Ref 40th Anniversary pre. I've received 1st hand feedback from a Dealer who compared the Reference 10 to the Ref 40th Anniversary & preferred the Anniversary model. Both are better than than the Ref 5SE. There is one FS on Audiogon right now in mint condition asking $17k. That pre will have excellent synergy with your Ref 75 & obviously not introduce any impedance issues. Mixing and matching tubed power and preamps can be a mixed bag. Anyway, that's the way i'd go in your shoes, no question.
 
Guys thanks for the answer and the suggestions! To be fully honest my wallet is not that thick so unfortunately the option with the funds I can play with is 5SE.
 
Hi Golum,

I think the Ref 5SE is a wonderful sounding preamp and should go well with your system. There are still many available at a reasonable price due to all the folks who upgraded to the Ref 6. The Ref 6 has a more transparent and dynamic presentation but I find the Ref 5SE to be a little more laid back, which is to my liking. I personally own a Ref 10, which is essentially one Ref 5SE per channel, and I love it.

Best,
Ken
 
Hi Ken;

Thanks for this information. Well I just missed the one I was aiming to buy so I'm kind of depressed and mad at myself as I was re-thinking it to much :(:mad:. Problem I have here in Europe is that they are not that often available as second hand so I need to re-open the hunting season.
Or maybe I should first upgrade my speakers, or preamp, or speakers, or preamp, or speakers,.......pls. wake me up from this nightmare :)


By the way - you have a fantastic system!!!!

All the best Ken!

Goran
 
Golum said:
This question may not fit here but it's regarding the Ref5SE anyhow. Namely I'm thinking about swapping my ModWright LS36.5DM with Ref5SE. Did anybody have experience with both of these line stages so that he could make a comparison? Is it worth to swap? I don't have a chance to demo so that's the reason for asking. Anyhow it should drive my Ref75. Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...

Let me answer my own question as somebody might find it useful in the same situation. Initially I was looking into 5SE but my luck changed towards positive direction and I could get myself Ref 6 so the comparison is done with the Ref 6.

First of all I need to mention that both preamps are great sounding and the end result will of course depend on the matching equipment.
Anyhow Ref 6 replaced ModWright LS36.5 DM and my conclusion is as follows - I find Ref 6 more dynamic, transparent with more pronounced bottom end. It's definitely less tubby sounding than MW but also much much less forgiving on the badly produced music. If you have the amp which is brutally transparent maybe MW would be a good/better match but with my Ref 75 this combo is just the winner solution. Also from the ergonomics, look and user experience I prefer ARC over MW but this is of course very much subjective.

Overall I'm more than happy with the upgrade :D:celebrate008_2::heart:
 
The Ref 10 is my favorite preamp because we found it much better than the Ypsilon PST1 and the older Dartzeel model, comparing it on Constellation Inspiration with Wilson Alexias using Lampi as input. We also compared the Ypsilon to the Dartzeel on the Dartzeel 108 power amp where they sounded equal but Ypsilon edged ahead of the Dart on the Constellation. The Ref 10 was just tremendous in terms of wider, deepr soundstage, muscle, slam, drive, excitement, and decay. And I am not a fan of AR products till the 5 SE as I find they only do midrange and air, congest on orchestral, but the separate power supply on the Ref 10 (and I guess the Ref 40) has changed that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top