NekoAudio
New member
Just a comment that reverse engineering is different than IP theft which is also different than unauthorized activity/communication.
Another Roon Heavy Handed Policy
- Thread starter Projectman
- Start date
Randy Myers
Well-known member
To legally reverse engineer you need virgin engineers (have never seen nor heard about the product). They are given a list of features that are required and told to create this. This is what Compaq did to create the IBM clone. The I/O chip set is the only thing IBM did not purchase off the shelf. Compaq had virgin engineers create an I/O chip that provided the same functions but certainly not the same chip or firmware construction, but it performed the same functions.
This is not what hackers are doing. The are stealing code which is highly illegal.
This is not what hackers are doing. The are stealing code which is highly illegal.
for those interested in this very topic, i can recommend the series halt and catch fire which i believe is now available on netfix -- a great dramatization of the software development and events surrounding the rise of silicon prairie. a very enjoyable binge!
Does not effect me since I don't need Roon to tell me what I have in my music library
Does not effect me since I don't need Roon to tell me what I have in my music library
Knowing what one has in their library is the easy part. What is difficult is finding the music one wants to listen to it promptly without wasting time looking for it! [emoji3]
I ripped my 500-600 CDs and saved them to a NAS drive. Using Qobuz, I added the digital version of my LP collection (several hundred LPs) to my library. I have also been adding hundreds of albums (from Qobuz) to my library.
My Roon library now consists of all my ripped albums plus the ones added from Qobuz. Nearly 1,500 albums altogether.
Roon combines all my music seamlessly in a single library. More importantly, I can find whatever I want in just a few seconds. Literally.
I see a similarity between what happened with different car manufacturers.
Initially, each car manufacturer developed their own software for their fleet only to discover that Apple (car play) and Google (Android Auto) could do it much better. (I have not used my car navigation in years; I use Waze or Google Maps).
Linn, Aurender, Sony, etc. they all have an app that they developed for their systems. And while those apps work, they are not as powerful or versatile as Roon. With Roon, you can mix and match products from many different brands (and price points) and they can all work together within the ecosystem. You can have an inexpensive Raspberry Pi Roon-Ready device (less than $100) and a pricey Trinnov 32 (over $35k) using the same GUI and all playing music simultaneously if one chooses to. Room also has two-way integration with Tidal and Qobuz (Sony, for example, does not connect to either of the two) and has library database management features that none of these apps can touch.
No offense to Sony and others that spent time and money to develop their systems. But none of those products offer what Roon offers. Maybe it is no wonder that they are willing to give their software away.
Initially, each car manufacturer developed their own software for their fleet only to discover that Apple (car play) and Google (Android Auto) could do it much better. (I have not used my car navigation in years; I use Waze or Google Maps).
Linn, Aurender, Sony, etc. they all have an app that they developed for their systems. And while those apps work, they are not as powerful or versatile as Roon. With Roon, you can mix and match products from many different brands (and price points) and they can all work together within the ecosystem. You can have an inexpensive Raspberry Pi Roon-Ready device (less than $100) and a pricey Trinnov 32 (over $35k) using the same GUI and all playing music simultaneously if one chooses to. Room also has two-way integration with Tidal and Qobuz (Sony, for example, does not connect to either of the two) and has library database management features that none of these apps can touch.
No offense to Sony and others that spent time and money to develop their systems. But none of those products offer what Roon offers. Maybe it is no wonder that they are willing to give their software away.
Jack
Active member
But several of them seem to offer better sound quality with less equipment hassle and expense. Many of us live quite happily with the software from Lumin, Aurender, Auralic and Innuous etc and see no need for the extra gear or software.
Jack
Active member
Auralic, Lumin and Aurender use their own proprietary in house software.
Puma Cat
Well-known member
Yes, but with all due respect, none of this software is Roon.
To me it's like saying GIMP is as good as Photoshop.
Roon is indeed excellent for the UI and library management and its second to none. Not so much on the sound quality side. I haven't heard Auralic, Lumin or Aurender, so can't compare but I can definitely say that the Innuous player will beat Roon in terms of sound quality any day.
Jack
Active member
And everybody has their own opinion. Mike uses all of it on a daily basis and even sells Roon and it's products and he might not agree with you. If I wanted all the complication I still have a full vinyl rig and 2000+ albums I can fuss over.
Jack
Active member
Dev
I don't know anything about the UI or the Library management features and have no reason to find out as I only use my streamers for Tidal and Qobuz and the Internet radio function. If I want to hear what's on my CD's or vinyl I just play them. I am not surprised that Mike and others have said that the sound quality of Roon which is a one size fits all solution falls short of the dedicated software in sound quality. I find nothing missing in the sound or UI of of either LDS or the Lumin app that would make me go through the hassle or expense of the Roon software or the extra hardware. My opinion and we all have our own and don't need to convince everybody else that our way is the best and only way.
I don't know anything about the UI or the Library management features and have no reason to find out as I only use my streamers for Tidal and Qobuz and the Internet radio function. If I want to hear what's on my CD's or vinyl I just play them. I am not surprised that Mike and others have said that the sound quality of Roon which is a one size fits all solution falls short of the dedicated software in sound quality. I find nothing missing in the sound or UI of of either LDS or the Lumin app that would make me go through the hassle or expense of the Roon software or the extra hardware. My opinion and we all have our own and don't need to convince everybody else that our way is the best and only way.
BlueFox
New member
I suppose if you listen to Internet radio, or other Internet music sources then Roon might be useful. However, I buy all my music as either CDs that I rip, or high-res downloads from HDTracks, so Roon is unnecessary. The Lumin app is just fine for my needs.
The UI/Lib management/AI features of Roon is slick. Once you are accustomed to it, there is no going back. Again I haven't used Lumin/Aurender/Auralic, so I don't know how they compare but I know some others like Innuous has and the UI feels pretty amateurish after you are used to Roon
I have bought the sound quality issue with Roon a while back on this forum when folks thought it otherwise....so I am very much aware of it.
Ok, but I am curious to know what OS are they using, Linux ? Don't think they run Windows though but I could be mistaken.
BlueFox
New member
Don't quote me, but I believe Lumin uses a stripped down version of Linux. However, the app that controls the files being played runs on the OS used by the iPhone.
Jack
Active member
As far as I know they are all Linux based. I was all set last year to try one of the Euphony PTS streamers but Arthur ran out of stock and Euphony was too busy building out their new top of the line unit to worry about the PTS. I wanted to try the Stylus software as I had heard good things about it. In the meantime I got caught up in the second house project and kind of put that aside. Arthur reached out to me last week to let me know that had stock again but since I am going back and forth between two places for now it is not convenient to learn a new OS. Maybe after the first of the year.
Puma Cat
Well-known member
Yes, but, respectfully, as I am the customer in this case, I get to decide what constitutes a value proposition for me. The dealers job, in this particular case, is to understand my specific needs, translate those into product requirements, and then help me make an informed decision about which product offerings constitute a value proposition for me.
Puma Cat
Well-known member
I’m not so sure, Dev. The Innuos might be better if the music server/streamer is in the music rack near the DAC, compared to Roon, but I’m not at all convinced that if the music server and Roon core is 40 feet away from the DAC, and there’s optical fiber, extremely clean linear power supplies, and an EtherReGEN, between the music server and DAC, that that would still be the case. I would love to do the experiment to find out, especially as I gave serious consideration to getting an Innuos. Hopefully, we can get together someday, and find out. Cheers.
Jack
Active member
And as I am also a customer in your scenario I also get to make the choice and it is not going to coincide with yours. You buy all the parts and pieces you think are necessary to run what you think is an "optimum" Roon system while I "make do" with my simple multiple linear power supply streamer with it's well thought out dedicated software. In the end we get to the same place with my solution being far less complicated and more than likely a whole lot less costly than your multi piece solution with high end ethernet cables, USB cables, switches and LPS's. Then we both get to decide for ourselves and not anybody else how it sounds to us. Your solution is not always right for anybody but yourself nor is mine and in the end that is all that counts. You don't try to sell me on yours being the only right way and I will do the same.