Active Speakers - good, bad or just different?

Mike

Mike

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I have been seeing an increase in the number of high end companies offering active speakers:

Bryston
KEF
Goldmund
Estelon
Avantgarde
...just to name a few.

The ones I've heard or owned, have been excellent and depending on the application (this is the key IMO), a good way to go. What I have encountered is a bit of limiting/handcuffing in terms of "options". Adding that turntable to your system is no longer easy. Want to run two subs, well, maybe only one is possible or none in an active system.

Thoughts?





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Great!!!

Only limiting factor tends to be less emotional connection with good vocals, like female and male Jazz and pop. Perhaps the DSP does indeed suck out some "life" in the mid/upper bass as a veteran local consultant pointed out.

They tend to be excellent and perhaps unbeatable on percussion pièces and sound very linear and balanced across the 20/20 Spectrum.
 
For multi-driver speakers, using an active powered set-up gives the speaker designer a lot more options. Now the parts for a passive cross-over are getting expensive and difficult to obtain.
 
Speedskater said:
For multi-driver speakers, using an active powered set-up gives the speaker designer a lot more options. Now the parts for a passive cross-over are getting expensive and difficult to obtain.
Click to expand...

Plus, ACTIVE has no parasitic robbing of power and inherent phase shifts. Powered means the amps can perfectly match the drivers and DSP means the limits of the drivers can be perfectly set and DRC means that electronic compensation for room nodes and réfections can be utilized to a VERY benefial degree.
 
Ugly :D

It gives designers the ultimate option, the "amp" is no longer a "piece" in the signal chain puzzle. A competent designer can do stuff not possible to do with "Amp X", like direct coupling, servo and even using transconductance with certain type of moving coil transducers (can't give away all the secrets now ;)). The amp/speaker becomes a singular circuit design, not a dart board/darts.
Although I understand some like darts! lol
It also makes for the kind of adaptability to speaker/room acoustics near impossible passively. Even some of the inexpensive active monitors down at Sam Ash have LF and HF adjustments and even high pass filters that can make significant improvements to both the sound and adapting to room/system requirements. Many of those do not use DSP.
However, anyone who has even been to a recording studio and seen the 1000 digital processes that go into their most cherished recordings, may not have such a phobia for 1001.:P
As always, YMMV.

cheers,

AJ
 
While the designer gains new options in optimizing an active speaker system via DSP, there are also some trade-offs and limitations in the flexibility of your resulting system as Mike detailed in the OP. If you're OK with those imposed configuration limitations you can definitely gain significant performance improvements and benefit from the exceptional value which active speakers can provide. The KEF LS50W is an example which is much better sounding than its passive version with most other amplification. Many audiophiles prefer to have more flexibility in configuring their system than is provided by an active speaker system, particularly those with an emphasis on analog source playback.
 
I think that you would still need a preamp to feed the active speaker system. So I think the flexibility would be the same. Or decide to go without a preamp - same as with a passive system
 
the professor said:
I think that you would still need a preamp to feed the active speaker system. So I think the flexibility would be the same. Or decide to go without a preamp - same as with a passive system
Click to expand...
Yep, some still need a preamp, so many options abound, ss, tubes, analog ins, etc, etc. Lots of "rolling" can still take place. Heck, with active speakers, there's even 2 extra power cords to fiddle with! :D
I actually recommend a nice tube pre or pre/dac combo to go with my class D actives. I find this the best balance, but again, YMMV

cheers,

AJ
 
the issue with active speakers is audiophilia nervosa. also, they don't typically make sense for people with analog rigs.

How many people know an audiophile with Meridian speakers? They've been out since the late 80s and always seem to be a niche product despite the high $$.

I've had the Barefoot Audio MM2s on loan for several weeks - they are very good speakers, I just felt better in near field.
 
Mike.......Don't overlook two great British companies offering excellent active speakers, ATC and PMC.


ATC SCM40A
ATC-SCM40-speaker_no-grill-475x1024.png




PMC MB2-A SE
web-MB2SE_pair-rf_0.jpg
 
to me on the 'uber level'.........the promise of 'active speakers' is analogous to the promise of multi-channel music.

they are both teases with their theoretical upsides.....but fall short on the execution side.

active speakers do have a real world market in the upper mid-fi/modest hifi/pro audio performance category based on performance value. however; no one has done one with ultimate performance in mind......there is always a 'but' involved. therefore they do not get taken seriously. and it's not because anyone thinks it can't be done, only that it has not been done.

ask a speaker manufacturer who does build 'uber' speakers why they have not done one active? you would get some interesting answers. likely that 'our dealers' want to sell electronics, or something like that.....or maybe that the amps we prefer do not fit in a speaker chassis....or the right amps added to our price would be too much money......or ????

then you look at multi-channel music, and you get stuck that it's all digital. which means it's never going to be an ultimate. easily the best multichannel I've heard is 4 track tape. killed any multi-channel digital. so the thought of how great it could be is just a tease. since no one is doing analog multi-channel. not that it's not possible.

so to answer the question; active speakers are 'ok'......they are the answer to some system questions. but have upper limits of performance due to their market targets.
 
Mike Lavigne said:
to me on the 'uber level'.........the promise of 'active speakers' is analogous to the promise of multi-channel music.

they are both teases with their theoretical upsides.....but fall short on the execution side.

active speakers do have a real world market in the upper mid-fi/modest hifi/pro audio performance category based on performance value. however; no one has done one with ultimate performance in mind......there is always a 'but' involved. therefore they do not get taken seriously. and it's not because anyone thinks it can't be done, only that it has not been done.

ask a speaker manufacturer who does build 'uber' speakers why they have not done one active? you would get some interesting answers. likely that 'our dealers' want to sell electronics, or something like that.....or maybe that the amps we prefer do not fit in a speaker chassis....or the right amps added to our price would be too much money......or ????

then you look at multi-channel music, and you get stuck that it's all digital. which means it's never going to be an ultimate. easily the best multichannel I've heard is 4 track tape. killed any multi-channel digital. so the thought of how great it could be is just a tease. since no one is doing analog multi-channel. not that it's not possible.

so to answer the question; active speakers are 'ok'......they are the answer to some system questions. but have upper limits of performance due to their market targets.
Click to expand...


Agree ,

IMO, quasi -active is the best compromise with full passive beating full active ...



regards
 
Would love to hear the Kii Three which has gotten some great reviews, from both audiophiles and pros.

As attached as I am to my Vivid speakers, I would not be opposed to considering an active system. Actually, I did hear a rumor a while back that Vivid was pondering an active design, which could be great, but ... never heard more about it.
 
Have you guys heard the Apologue and Anatta? Very little if any compromise there and these are cetainly Uber implementations. Heck the software is 9 years in development by an egghead Phd.
 
wisnon said:
Have you guys heard the Apologue and Anatta? Very little if any compromise there and these are cetainly Uber implementations. Heck the software is 9 years in development by an egghead Phd.
Click to expand...

Norman,

you are right, even though I've not heard them from what I've read they are definitely the exception and are 'uber' active speaker efforts and likely succeed on a high level.

they are not candidates for me for a serious system since they digitize everything and your digital source is inbred in the closed system so it can be a dead end in terms of being kept current. for instance, how would you integrate my new MSB Select II dac......you could not get it's full value.....as it's analog result would be re-digitized at the speaker......dumbed down, so to speak. I'm not saying it's digital performance is not excellent.

I would expect buyers of those Goldmund active systems are not 'fiddlers' of their systems. not that don't demand top level performance.

I'd love someone to do an analog active at the level of the Goldmund products. now that would be an interesting proposition.
 
Yes...not for fiddlers but not dead end either. The mark 2 software upgrade is what took it from very good to excellent. Much the same what happened to MSB Select 1 to 2. From meh to eye popping. LoL.

Do not underestimate the Alize 7 dac built into their active speakers nor their Telos amp tech. The Anatta may be the most impresdive demo I have heard to date.
 
Besides...the parametrically based DRC is a wonder in itself. Basically you model the room in 3D space and then apply digital correction with no corruption of the time domain.
 
wisnon said:
Yes...not for fiddlers but not dead end either. The mark 2 software upgrade is what took it from very good to excellent. Much the same what happened to MSB Select 1 to 2. From meh to eye popping. LoL.

Do not underestimate the Alize 7 dac built into their active speakers nor their Telos amp tech. The Anatta may be the most impresdive demo I have heard to date.
Click to expand...

I don't underestimate the quality of the 'uber' Goldmund gear, but closed systems are closed. I had a 'world beating' closed system with my Rockport, and the world passed it by. it's a huge investment where all your eggs are in one basket.

it's a product fit for specific people with particular needs. and it does that perfectly. but it's synergy has a down side in lack of agility to adjust to changes.
 
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