Has Aesthetix become a forgotten brand?

How much do cables play into the tube rush problem ?
 
Bobolaclune said:
Well Dan, all I can tell you is that I am an experienced audiophile and notwithstanding the willingness of people to believe that Aesthetix horror stories of tube rush are made up by a small group of fanatic conspirators ; a glance at the comments in this post will highlight that there are common tube noise issues & that the solution for many people is to seek out low-microphony NOS tubes at additional expense .

The issue of background noise levels and the sonic degradation that can cause has become more important in audio in recent years - note all the reviews talking about "black backgrounds" and "sound emerging from silent backgrounds" . I too subscribe to the view that it doesn't matter how rich the soundstage and detail emanating from a system is .... if the backdrop is noisy , it's not worth it.

Therein may lie the answer to the question posted : "Has Aesthetix become a forgotten brand?" . They have ...because their tolerance for noise and rush issues exceeds that of many audiophiles.
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I can attest that I auditioned for over a year many different phono stages to find one that suited my taste and which had which is low noise (along with a low output MC cartridge). I cannot stand listening to anything with tube noise at any level. I had read that Aesthetix had tube rush, but really looked at the sources of the information online as well as listened with my own discerning ears. In the end (2 months ago), I voted with my wallet and purchased the IO Eclipse (dual power supplies). It is dead quiet (using ATT 4 `62db gain) at any volume level. I urge anyone to looking at Aesthetix gear to audition it and decide for yourself. I went into this looking for issues due to web based feedback and was surprised by how incorrect some of the feedback I read was.

B
 
briweed said:
I can attest that I auditioned for over a year many different phono stages to find one that suited my taste and which had which is low noise (along with a low output MC cartridge). I cannot stand listening to anything with tube noise at any level. I had read that Aesthetix had tube rush, but really looked at the sources of the information online as well as listened with my own discerning ears. In the end (2 months ago), I voted with my wallet and purchased the IO Eclipse (dual power supplies). It is dead quiet (using ATT 4 `62db gain) at any volume level. I urge anyone to looking at Aesthetix gear to audition it and decide for yourself. I went into this looking for issues due to web based feedback and was surprised by how incorrect some of the feedback I read was.

B
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Same for me, I've had my IO Signature dual power supply for 7 years and had no noise issues other than bad tubes. Will hear a faint hiss when I'm 6 inch away from the speaker, that's it. Recently retubed after about 7,000 hours.

Would I buy it again, hell yes :)
 
So just to get this straight Gentlemen, you went for a $23,000 phono stage and are happy to report that tube noise is low ? Congratulations :P.

Although I think for the sake of rest of us mere mortals , the thrust of this Post is around the Saturn series components . Let's just hope that the Eclipse series is not how far up the Aesthetix ladder you have to go to get a quiet unit from Jim White.And as far as web-based Feedback was concerned, in my case with the Calypso & Rhea Signatures...I wish I had listened to the chatter , it was spot on. As always YMMV...........
 
Bobolaclune said:
So just to get this straight Gentlemen, you went for a $23,000 phono stage and are happy to report that tube noise is low ? Congratulations :P.
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First Briweed has an Eclipse at "$23,000" and he did say it was "dead quiet". I was the one mentioning a faint hiss at 6 inch but don't have the $23,000 Eclipse, then again I'm happy with what I have so all is good. I guess if you consider nearfield 6 inch then yes you will hear tube rush, otherwise can't hear it. :rolleyes: And it should be mentioned that there are other virtues to a phono pre other than how noisy it is.

Only thing I guess we will agree on is YMMV ;)

Over and out!
 
To answer the OP, no, I don't think Aesthetix is a forgotten brand.

Regarding the tube rush issue: I don't hear any with my Calypso Signature running 94db efficient loudspeakers with either the stock factory supplied tubes or NOS choices.

I'm currently running a matched pair of NOS Sylvania Triple Mica Black Plate 5751 in lieu of the stock 12ax7 Tung Sol reissues. Also running Sylvania 6dj8 National Cash Register instead of the EH 6922 supplied from Aesthetix. Later this week I might roll in a pair of NOS Tung Sol 12ax7 to compare against the Sylvania 5751.

The 5751's were purchased from a fellow I trust with quality tubes and the remainder of the NOS choices I have here came from Andy Bowman at VTS.

Perhaps the folks with tube rush issues either had/have an older Saturn series model without the gain-jumper adjustment or maybe they never played with that option if they did?
 
MikeCh said:
To answer the OP, no, I don't think Aesthetix is a forgotten brand.

Regarding the tube rush issue: I don't hear any with my Calypso Signature running 94db efficient loudspeakers with either the stock factory supplied tubes or NOS choices.

I'm currently running a matched pair of NOS Sylvania Triple Mica Black Plate 5751 in lieu of the stock 12ax7 Tung Sol reissues. Also running Sylvania 6dj8 National Cash Register instead of the EH 6922 supplied from Aesthetix. Later this week I might roll in a pair of NOS Tung Sol 12ax7 to compare against the Sylvania 5751.

The 5751's were purchased from a fellow I trust with quality tubes and the remainder of the NOS choices I have here came from Andy Bowman at VTS.

Perhaps the folks with tube rush issues either had/have an older Saturn series model without the gain-jumper adjustment or maybe they never played with that option if they did?
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Everybody's experiences vary and this series of posts is proof positive of that. However.... what is also clear is the extent to which people are having to go to accommodate their Aesthetix units . The Saturn series has been in production a long time . It is somewhat disconcerting to hear about mods and adjustments that are still having to be made by the factory to accommodate or ameliorate a known issue. The Calypso is moderately manageable but the Rhea much less so. Multiple tubed gain stages to boost what is already a delicate low voltage signal , have over-whelmed many audiophiles. In the interests of so-called system synergy, I tried using Signature versions of the Calypso and Rhea together . The result was horrible despite multiple tube sets from Aesthetix. At these price points , no-one should have to go to the NOS/outside tube supplier to try and get the issue under control. My units were 2012 production.
 
Bobolaclune said:
Everybody's experiences vary and this series of posts is proof positive of that. However.... what is also clear is the extent to which people are having to go to accommodate their Aesthetix units . The Saturn series has been in production a long time . It is somewhat disconcerting to hear about mods and adjustments that are still having to be made by the factory to accommodate or ameliorate a known issue. The Calypso is moderately manageable but the Rhea much less so. Multiple tubed gain stages to boost what is already a delicate low voltage signal , have over-whelmed many audiophiles. In the interests of so-called system synergy, I tried using Signature versions of the Calypso and Rhea together . The result was horrible despite multiple tube sets from Aesthetix. At these price points , no-one should have to go to the NOS/outside tube supplier to try and get the issue under control. My units were 2012 production.
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Question....if the amps had such ill-performance issues while in your possession did you ever send them back for factory inspection/examination to determine if there were underlying issues other than tube selection before booting them? Did you purchase them new?
 
MikeCh said:
Question....if the amps had such ill-performance issues while in your possession did you ever send them back for factory inspection/examination to determine if there were underlying issues other than tube selection before booting them? Did you purchase them new?
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Mike, the units (Calypso & Rhea - both Sig versions) went back to Aesthetix ...which promptly pronounced them to be in fine working condition. Two additional "carefully noise matched" sets of tubes were also sent by them. All to no avail. And yes - they were purchased new from an Authorized dealer. Yes, I am very familiar with noise levels & tube rush out of tubed phono stages - I own the Manley Steelhead , Thoeress Phono Enhancer and an Abingdon Music Research PH77 , as well as an excellent tubed stage in my VAC Phi Beta integrated and the VAC Sig2a preamp. Bottom line - 10 tubes & three gain stages inside a phono preamp is too many, owners should not have to pony out this kind of cash and then some more to find NOS tubes from outside vendors. There is a design fault inside the Rhea , nothing will convince me otherwise since I have heard too many others complain about the exact same thing.
 
Bob, I'm not familiar with the Rhea but the Calypso has no tube rush with either factory reissue tubes or NOS variants in my setup feeding 94db efficient loudspeakers.

You seem pretty wrapped around the axle regarding the Rhea for it's design and performance so I'll not attempt to unravel you since as you state, "nothing will convince me otherwise".
 
Mike, a cursory glance at a simple Google search would clearly determine that there appear to be a lot of people "wrapped around the axle". If you're not an experienced analog-based audiophile and if you're not familiar with the Rhea , I wonder what the point of chiming in really is? The Calypso has 4 tubes, the Rhea has 10. The Calypso deals with the amplification of input volumes measured in volts , the Rhea with those measured in millivolts . Apply three gain stage amplification through 10 tubes to a signal that small (one that is inherently "noisy" to begin with) & you have the makings of what this series of posts is all about. So please ...don't unravel me , I have plenty of experience to wrap myself up in.
 
Bobolaclune said:
Mike, a cursory glance at a simple Google search would clearly determine that there appear to be a lot of people "wrapped around the axle". If you're not an experienced analog-based audiophile and if you're not familiar with the Rhea , I wonder what the point of chiming in really is? The Calypso has 4 tubes, the Rhea has 10. The Calypso deals with the amplification of input volumes measured in volts , the Rhea with those measured in millivolts . Apply three gain stage amplification through 10 tubes to a signal that small (one that is inherently "noisy" to begin with) & you have the makings of what this series of posts is all about. So please ...don't unravel me , I have plenty of experience to wrap myself up in.
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Bobolaclune, you win. However, this thread isn't only about the Rhea.

Nice condescending attitude you've expressed: "If you're not an experienced analog-based audiophile and if you're not familiar with the Rhea , I wonder what the point of chiming in really is?"
 
jperry said:
I have the Aesthetix Calypso and Rhea. ... I am now very happy with the results from the Aesthetix equipment.
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Well everyone is not as happy as I am with their Aesthetix units. This thread is a little derailed and I do not think Aesthetix is a forgotten brand.

Nobody gets 62 - 70 db of gain in an all tube phono stage without some noise. It is all a matter of trade offs. You can have the noise from tubes, or you can have the sound of a SS active stage, or you can have the sound of a SUT. It is a choice of what works best for each person in their system.
 
jperry said:
Well everyone is not as happy as I am with their Aesthetix units. This thread is a little derailed and I do not think Aesthetix is a forgotten brand.

Nobody gets 62 - 70 db of gain in an all tube phono stage without some noise. It is all a matter of trade offs. You can have the noise from tubes, or you can have the sound of a SS active stage, or you can have the sound of a SUT. It is a choice of what works best for each person in their system.
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Try the Thoress, TW-Acustics and ARC. I don't know anyone who's complained about tube noise with these units or heard noise (remember the first two were used with ultra sensitive Horning speakers.)

Phono

Parametric Phono Equalizer - Thöress

Reference Phono 10
 
Myles B. Astor said:
Try the Thoress, TW-Acustics and ARC. I don't know anyone who's complained about tube noise with these units or heard noise (remember the first two were used with ultra sensitive Horning speakers.)

Phono

Parametric Phono Equalizer - Thöress

Reference Phono 10
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Well said Myles - exactly right - I own the Thoeress Phono Enhancer (which TW Acustic used to market under their own name) so I can speak to the quietness of that unit. As I can for the Manley Steelhead and Abbbingdon Music Research PH-77

Manley Steelhead RC Phono Stage w/ Remora Remote Control

Abbingdon Music Research - Products - PH - 77 Reference Class Phono Equalisier

The Manley plays into my 95db Tannoy Churchill Widebands set up in a near field configuration - I sit 7 feet away.... no sign of tube rush
 
You shouldn't hear tube rush from a phono preamp that uses JFETs as the input to the tube stage. I don't know that anyone is getting no tube rush from a pure tube phono stage with over 60dB of gain. The Steelhead uses SUTs for the input and I know that ARC uses JFETs. Somewhere in another thread I commented on the VTL 2.5 MKII preamp that has over 60dB of pure tube gain and it's quite noisy.
 
You guys are funny with your comparisons. On one hand the conversation is realigned to focus on the Aesthetix Saturn series in post #44, then you throw out your own comparisons of gear of which four of the five offerings are almost double if not 4x the price even with dissimilar topologies. LOL.
 
Hmmm....not getting that. The Rhea Signature is $7500, the Manley Steelhead is $8000 , the AMR PH-77 is $12,000 & the Thoeress Phono Enhancer is $9000 . Features vary wildly - the Thoeress can accommodate 6 inputs , the AMR has multiple equalization curves and remote control everything , the Steelhead can double as a preamp and has na outboard power supply. So double to 4X ? Not grasping that .....must be the New Math. LOL
 
MikeCh said:
You guys are funny with your comparisons. On one hand the conversation is realigned to focus on the Aesthetix Saturn series in post #44, then you throw out your own comparisons of gear of which four of the five offerings are almost double if not 4x the price even with dissimilar topologies. LOL.
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Mike-In all fairness, I think the thread has drifted into noise levels of tube preamps in general and not just the Aesthetix. If you buy a high-gain pure tube phono stage, you better expect some noise because it will be there. If you use SUTs or JFets as the first gain stage, you should have a quiet phono stage. If you buy a pure tube line stage, you shouldn't expect to have high levels of tube noise, but you shouldn't expect it to be as quiet as a tube line stage that uses JFETs as the first stage of gain. The ARC LS17 is a very quiet line stage for instance and it's not as expensive as some of the other gear being talked about here. I don't care for the way the LS17 sounds, but at least it was quiet while it was getting on my nerves.
 
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