Since we are talking about it-I am interested in that REW thing and need a little help getting started

MusicDirector

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I’ve been looking at that REW thing a bit and it has me intrigued.I wanted to make it a separate thread for focus and maybe others will benefit too. I did not even know of REW's existence until a few days ago. I had no idea therewas a sophisticated room analyzing program available for free! I guesssometimes there are pleasant surprises around a corner or two in audioland.
I’m no acoustical engineer (amateur live sound engineer inmy past, but that’s a whole different animal), but I think I want to learn howto use this REW thing. I hope it’s easy to learn and understand. I’m doingfurther reading, but I’m a little lost for getting started. I think it would beneat as a check for Audyssey if nothing else. I think it does a lot more thanthat. If I read correctly, I could use it as an EQ or spectrum display and suchhooked to my system. That would be cool! I may even try to get a cheap smalllaptop to have it permanently connected to my system. (Can’t use my custom dailydriver/uber-powerful/beastly XoticPC laptop for that ya know).:D
I’d like to know what I need to use this program. I know Ineed a microphone and a tripod. What other gear would I need?
I did see that a USB soundcard has been mentioned. I have aSoundblaster X-Fi USB soundcard, but I don’t think it has the rightconnections. I’m pretty sure it would not have an XLR connection if needed. Arethere any other soundcards that would be easier to use with REW?
For Microphones I see a vast selection on Amazon alone, butI read someplace that whatever microphone I choose will need to be calibrated. Howdo I do that and how much does it cost? I don’t think one can get an alreadycalibrated mic, can one? (The Audyssey mic that came with my Onkyo can not beused). Anyone have any specific recommends?
I can just get any $30 boom type tripod, so that should beeasy. (I have a very nice photo tripod, but I read that it’s not the rightthing to use for this type of work). Thank you ~Eric
 
Oh, I got it, sign up for the forum there. I get confused easy sometimes. I'll do that, but I hope they don't pounce on me telling me I need to invest thousands of dollars in equipment to use this thing or something. Although I would appreciate it if they told me not to bother with it for my room if it would be a waste of time. Yes, my room is that bad. I'll find out, won't I.
 
That site (The Shack), that's the only good thing going on for them: REW.

The owner; Sonny, best is to stay away (far away) from him. ...Life is much better I guarantee. :)
Eric, you don't have to register, so you're not taking the risk of getting banned like most people. ...Just read what you need from REW and the threads that are related to it.

Over the years, and even not long ago again, I learned that it is better to not be a member from some sites than being one.
We have more access, and respect, when we are only lurking (visiting) around. :) ...But I know that you already know that.
 
That site (The Shack), that's the only good thing going on for them: REW.

The owner; Sonny, best is to stay away (far away) from him. ...Life is much better I guarantee. :)
Eric, you don't have to register, so you're not taking the risk of getting banned like most people. ...Just read what you need from REW and the threads that are related to it.

Over the years, and even not long ago again, I learned that it is better to not be a member from some sites than being one.
We have more access, and respect, when we are only lurking (visiting) around. :) ...But I know that you already know that.

Thanks for the heads-up on that. I'll try to just invisibly go in and glean as much info as I can. Some guy named John is the inventor of REW. I would not mind talking to him, but I have found tons of info on it and even both written and video tutorials.
I think I have the Mic thing worked out, not sure. I'll put a list together of my choices, but who do I ask to tell me where I am going wrong or where I am correct? Who do I ask to see if this is worth the time and expense in my case? Even the engineer that saw my room walked away with a headache. Maybe I can ask him? If I recall,GIK also has a tutorial on REW. If I get this kit together and am successful at learning how to use it, I'll no doubt need someone to tell me what the data I get means. That is to say someone who can clear the foggy bits.
~Eric
 
Thanks for the heads-up on that. I'll try to just invisibly go in and glean as much info as I can. Some guy named John is the inventor of REW. I would not mind talking to him, but I have found tons of info on it and even both written and video tutorials.
I think I have the Mic thing worked out, not sure. I'll put a list together of my choices, but who do I ask to tell me where I am going wrong or where I am correct? Who do I ask to see if this is worth the time and expense in my case? Even the engineer that saw my room walked away with a headache. Maybe I can ask him? If I recall,GIK also has a tutorial on REW. If I get this kit together and am successful at learning how to use it, I'll no doubt need someone to tell me what the data I get means. That is to say someone who can clear the foggy bits.


~Eric

Ok, do register then, and ask your questions. :) ...There are other experts too from other audio sites who can help as well.
A guy like Kal Rubinson (Music in the Round - Stereophile) is all over the places; easy to spot. ...He's even at the Shack. ...AVS Forum. ...WBF. ...Etc. ===> Music in the Round | Stereophile.com
 
You can also pick up the Omnimic, it's a simple to use all in one Mic, software and driver package. The only items you may need in addition are a tripod and the multi-channel DVD.
 
A tripod; microphone stand with boom; they start at $9.99 at amazon.com and for twenty bucks you get a good one.
The multi-channel DVD; five bucks perhaps, or free from your PC (or Mac)?

I'd bet that if you google Omnimic it'll bring you right there. :) ...To a very affordable quality calibrated mic.
 
Ok, do register then, and ask your questions. :) ...There are other experts too from other audio sites who can help as well.
A guy like Kal Rubinson (Music in the Round - Stereophile) is all over the places; easy to spot. ...He's even at the Shack. ...AVS Forum. ...WBF. ...Etc. ===> Music in the Round | Stereophile.com

I said that I'm not going to register. I know my English is not that good according to modern slang and what not.
 
UPDATE: I may be wasting my time with it?

Spoke with the engineer that evaluated my room about doing the REW thing and he told me: "You can certainly play with it if you like as long as you have most of what you need already on hand. I would not spend the money if you don't, here's why. Once you figure it out and find out what is needed exactly, you have no way of correcting the room". You are extremely limited in what you can do. As I told you, about the only thing you can do is panels on the wall behind the sofa, a huge rug and if needed and if you can a bass trap behind one speaker in the one corner and one in front of the CD cabinet across from it, but you would have to move it all the time. The problem is that the room will need more than that and you can't do it due design.
I can't afford a huge rug and they don't make them the size I would need anyway. (20 feet x 11 feet)
So, in light of that, I'm not sure about continuing.
 
Re: UPDATE: I may be wasting my time with it?

Thanks for the heads-up on that. I'll try to just invisibly go in and glean as much info as I can. Some guy named John is the inventor of REW. I would not mind talking to him, but I have found tons of info on it and even both written and video tutorials.
I think I have the Mic thing worked out, not sure. I'll put a list together of my choices, but who do I ask to tell me where I am going wrong or where I am correct? Who do I ask to see if this is worth the time and expense in my case? Even the engineer that saw my room walked away with a headache. Maybe I can ask him? If I recall,GIK also has a tutorial on REW. If I get this kit together and am successful at learning how to use it, I'll no doubt need someone to tell me what the data I get means. That is to say someone who can clear the foggy bits.
~Eric

Spoke with the engineer that evaluated my room about doing the REW thing and he told me: "You can certainly play with it if you like as long as you have most of what you need already on hand. I would not spend the money if you don't, here's why. Once you figure it out and find out what is needed exactly, you have no way of correcting the room". You are extremely limited in what you can do. As I told you, about the only thing you can do is panels on the wall behind the sofa, a huge rug and if needed and if you can a bass trap behind one speaker in the one corner and one in front of the CD cabinet across from it, but you would have to move it all the time. The problem is that the room will need more than that and you can't do it due design.
I can't afford a huge rug and they don't make them the size I would need anyway. (20 feet x 11 feet)
So, in light of that, I'm not sure about continuing.

Another solution (involving money; unfortunately) is to purchase the Onkyo TX-NR818 AV receiver ($599), which is equipped with Audyssey MultEQ XT32.

...Or the Sherwood Newcastle R-972 AV receiver ($599), which is equipped with Trinnov Optimizer.

* It is simply amazing that you can get those two great solutions (hi-class Room EQ & Calibration/Correction systems) for so little money!
And on top of that they are two very capable power receivers with seven channels of amplification! ...Plus 40+ pounds, each one of them. ...Not like 18 pounds.
 
Re: UPDATE: I may be wasting my time with it?

Another solution (involving money; unfortunately) is to purchase the Onkyo TX-NR818 AV receiver ($599), which is equipped with Audyssey MultEQ XT32.

...Or the Sherwood Newcastle R-972 AV receiver ($599), which is equipped with Trinnov Optimizer.

* It is simply amazing that you can get those two great solutions (hi-class Room EQ & Calibration/correction systems) for so little money!
And in top of that they are very capable power receivers with seven channels of amplification! ...Plus 40+ pounds, each one of them.

I am in process of saving up for a new receiver,but no more mid-fi for me. I'm going a notch above that and the new receiver (whatever it turns out to be) will have Audyssey MultiEQ XT32 (and hopefully a good mic with that). That said, Audyssey and the like can only do so much. It's not like real room correction of course,but given my current flat, it's all I can do.:)
 
Re: UPDATE: I may be wasting my time with it?

I am in process of saving up for a new receiver,but no more mid-fi for me. I'm going a notch above that and the new receiver (whatever it turns out to be) will have Audyssey MultiEQ XT32 (and hopefully a good mic with that). That said, Audyssey and the like can only do so much. It's not like real room correction of course,but given my current flat, it's all I can do.:)

The next one is the Onkyo TX-NR3010 ($2,299 MSRP). ...I know a professional Hollywood movie mixer/engineer who had all the top receivers over the years (he tried them all, all the flagships!), and now he has* that one (3010). ...And he's quite happy with it. :)

And he knows a thing or two about Room Correction and EQ systems. ...And real power too, and a bunch of other things.
This guy ain't small; he mixed some major Hollywood blockbuster flicks.
{Mark aka FilmMixer: Re-recording mixer.}

* Had; he seems to now have the new Yamaha RX-A3030 Aventage AV receiver ($2,199 MSRP), with fully advanced Parametric EQ for it's new Control and Advanced YPAO (Auto Room EQ & Calibration system), and with ESS Hyperstream DAC (ES9006), and ESS Sabre Ultra 32 DAC (ES9016). ...Oh well, so much for Audyssey MultEQ XT32. :)
 
Re: UPDATE: I may be wasting my time with it?

The next one is the Onkyo TX-NR3010 ($2,299 MSRP). ...I know a professional Hollywood movie mixer/engineer who had all the top receivers over the years (he tried them all, all the flagships!), and now he has* that one (3010). ...And he's quite happy with it. :)

And he knows a thing or two about Room Correction and EQ systems. ...And real power too, and a bunch of other things.
This guy ain't small; he mixed some major Hollywood blockbuster flicks.
{Mark aka FilmMixer: Re-recording mixer.}

* Had; he seems to now have the new Yamaha RX-A3030 Aventage AV receiver ($2,199 MSRP), with fully advanced Parametric EQ for it's new Control and Advanced YPAO (Auto Room EQ & Calibration system), and with ESS Hyperstream DAC (ES9006), and ESS Sabre Ultra 32 DAC (ES9016). ...Oh well, so much for Audyssey MultEQ XT32. :)

In looking at the Yamaha YPAO and the like, it does exactly the same and works exactly the same way as Audyssey MultiEQ 32 it's just renamed by Yamaha as far as I can tell so far. Further study is required.
 
Eric, I doubt it; Audyssey proceeds in not only the entire Frequency Response (from 2Hz to 24kHz) but also in the Time Domain. It uses FIR (Finite Impulse Response) filters. ...And over 10,000 of them!

YPAO is more restricted in the Frequency Response (Parametric EQ) from 32Hz to 20kHz, and uses a more rudimentary Phase application.
It uses only few PEQ filters (about 10, or less), per each channel, manually adjustable with separate 'Q'.

* I've been into this since the very beginning; at the start of the first Automatic Room EQ and Correction system in a consumer product. ...Meaning years.
...Or unless Yamaha did something new recently. ...But I'm not aware of that.

FIR and IIR (Infinite Impulse Response) filters are much more sophisticated than plain digital PEQ filters.
But some people demand manual adjustability, no matter what kind of filters, even GEQ filters (Graphic).

Some people love Yamaha's YPAO and Pioneer's ASR (Air Studios, from London) advanced MCACC (with Phase control) systems of Calibration and EQuing; mainly for the access to their parameters (Parametric & Phase) that you can modify and adjust yourself.

And other people love Audyssey, TRINNOV, ARC, RoomPerfect, TacT, Dirac, and more, for their even more advanced sophistication, and also adjustability of their parameters (Pro).

Whatever one person loves is what that person knows from his own perspective, from his own experience, complete, or lacking. ...His own personal preference based on 'beaucoup' or not much experience.
 
Eric, I doubt it; Audyssey proceeds in not only the entire Frequency Response (from 2Hz to 24kHz) but also in the Time Domain.
It uses FIR (Finite Impulse Response) filters. ...And over 10,000 of them!

YPAO is more restricted in the Frequency Response (Parametric EQ), and uses a more rudimentary Phase application.
It uses only few filters (about 10, or less), per each channel.

* I've been into this since the very beginning; at the start of the first Automatic Room EQ and Correction system in a consumer product.
...Or unless Yamaha did something new recently.

Hmm, if that's the case and I'm not saying it isn't, it confirms to me my suspicion that everything we read from a manufacture is a lie. Now I have to figure out where to get the truth. I was reading the Yamaha website and the Onkyo website comparing them. They both went into the same detail and it seemed to be almost the same wording with some of the names being changed, but the same function. Perhaps, I should consider disconnecting that function somehow on whatever new receiver I get and just going with learning REW and try to adjust manually. More research required on this subject.
 
Eric, Yamaha uses Parametric EQ filters. ...And very few of them, and not low enough (around 32Hz).
Audyssey uses FIR EQ filters. ...And a multitude of them, and down to 2Hz (or it could be 10Hz; one or the other, still very low anyway).
ARC (and other systems) uses FIR and IIR EQ filters. ...And there are various flavors, just like with Audyssey.

There is a lot to read about them, and I cannot explain briefly here; you'll have to do your own research.
And then, after all you can read and learn, the next step is to experiment! Wow, it would be real nice if all of us we can do that, and do it properly too, but we are restricted, the most majority of us.
So, what to do? ...Read Music In The Round's column in Stereophile by Kal Rubinson. :) ...That's a start; then try few of them for yourself, among the best ones, and be happy all along the way and until you reach the ultimate absolution of your own Room Acoustic Treatments: RAT. :) ---> That is my own patent btw.
 
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