Pono

MusicDirector said:
As much as I totally respect Neil with the utmost respect and thanks, this does not move me at all. I mean $300+ for an MP3 player? Really? If one sends $100 one gets an autograph...no thanks, I'm not an autograph hound. I do see a few hundered folks did go that direction though....whatever.
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It's not an MP3 player....it's an anti-MP3 player. It plays 24/192 files. I don't care what it is or what it looks like or who supports it. To me, this is a relief from all the low res crap people have been listening to. If we can get the masses to say "holy sh!t, this sounds amazing! I want more!!" - then high res downloads could become the norm, Apple iPods could become high res capable, a whole network of high res products could pop up and people could actually become more interested in high quality reproduction of music and gasp(!) - become audiophiles perhaps.

Most people haven't got a clue of the quality of music that can be produced today.


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sharkmouth said:
Ok, I'll do something here & weigh in to something that I'm guessing later on I'm going to think, what was I thinking, this includes all the smart-asses too....
Here is something that we know nothing of for sure, a 1 & a 1/2 page thread is turning into politics instead of saying hey!, this is good, lets give it a go!!!
Why don't we wait & see what all the fuss is about. I really hope it unleashes a sound that is surreal to the effect of being absolutely want-able by the masses, jaysus, who's got hi-res on the go with inter-changeable SD cards? If this is something of the Steve Jobs brainchild, let it breath people, abortion is for the misinformed.....Where would we be now without competition for M/soft??????Let the machine be beat!
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Well said Kev!


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Norman is right. Neil and his team hired Ayre to build it. A smart move. A company from our industry behind it? I like it!


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wisnon said:
MP3???

Its supposed to be minimum redbook...and will be the highest quality master available as default.

This player will have the alledegly breakthru filter tech found in the Ayre QB9, which is minimum phase. Charles Hansen claims that the problem with PCM is poor filtration and he studied how SACD does it and used that as a template to develop a superior PCM filtration scheme. Trickle down tech. So $400 for a QB9 play-alike with storage and a playback engine can be seen as a bargain in that case! The icing on the cake would be if the HP amp is a quality thing, then game over...its the cheapest portable date in town....I I am not even excited about the Pono Music site!
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Ok, the Ayre QB9 means nothing to me, I don't even know what it is. I know what PCM is and I'm not concerned except to agree about the filtering. I've heard SACDs streamed and they sound no different than high rate MP3s, same with Hi-Rez files. Compression is compression and the more of it, the worse it is. I listen to CDs and vinyl (both still compressed by the way). I do not use streaming or files as a source, but I do use them as tools in which they serve me well.
I'm totally behind Neil's concern about music quality and such, but I just don't see this taking flight. He won't be able to market it to the masses unless he has something like Beats do it, but then that would go against everything he is trying to do.
I agree, I'm not excited about the Pono music site, but also not excited about purchasing an MP3 or proprietary file player even if it was $100.
 
Mike said:
It's not an MP3 player....it's an anti-MP3 player. It plays 24/192 files. I don't care what it is or what it looks like or who supports it. To me, this is a relief from all the low res crap people have been listening to. If we can get the masses to say "holy sh!t, this sounds amazing! I want more!!" - then high res downloads could become the norm, Apple iPods could become high res capable, a whole network of high res products could pop up and people could actually become more interested in high quality reproduction of music and gasp(!) - become audiophiles perhaps.

Most people haven't got a clue of the quality of music that can be produced today.


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I just don't see it. I agree that most people don't know what good quality sound reproduction sounds like, that's a given. I just don't see this taking flight. Most people sadly, don't care about sound reproduction, they just want to hear music on their phones and they are happy with that.
I've heard SACD (streamed though), Hi-Rez and the like and I find CD and vinyl still superior to my ears, but even CD and vinyl are compressed to a point.
This device plays proprietary files that may only be available for Neil's catalog and never embraced by the industry as a whole and it's a high price to pay for most folks including myself.
Not everyone wants to be an audiophile and I am the leading living example of that.:)
 
Music Director, the Sacd stream must be output in downsampled PCM. Pono player is not proprietary, it will play any rate PCM.

Pono store allegedly will be providing uncompressed music at different PCM rates.

I agree that Beats typs marketing will be indispensable.
 
wisnon said:
Music Director, the Sacd stream must be output in downsampled PCM. Pono player is not proprietary, it will play any rate PCM.

Pono store allegedly will be providing uncompressed music at different PCM rates.

I agree that Beats typs marketing will be indispensable.
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Upon further reading up on it, it is supposed to offer uncompressed music, but there is still the bump of PCM filtering to deal with, but that's for the propeller-heads to figure out.

Why is Neil Young trying to develop a new digital format for music? Answer - Because he's seen the needle and the damage done. Ok, enough bad jokes. Being a Neil fan and knowing what I know of him, he has always cared about sound quality. He is a good guy and means well, but sometimes........ If he is keeping with his usual MO, he is not doing this for money. He's a millionaire several times over, he doesn't need the money. Most likely the proceeds will go to charity as is his usual thing. The guy has been through a lot of tragedy and cares deeply about things. From what I have heard with those who have worked with him that he is a very nice guy, but he is also a very private person and does not want to be bothered. I think that's why he sounds somewhat vague to most of us at times. I've heard from folks who have run into him that you get no more than a friendly wave and one word "hello". I can't say that I blame him.
I see this project as a two-edged sword: On one hand, it doesn't have much appeal to the masses and on the other if he goes with a marketing plan like Beats or has Beats do the marketing it won't appeal to those who care about sound quality. Either way, you can count me out from climbing on-board the bandwagon.
 
NorthStar said:
The Pono uses an ESS Sabre DAC, the ESS 9018, the very best one up-to-date.

* I believe Meridian's audio designer Bob Stuart is behind the discrete output stage with zero feedback.
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It doesn't matter what brand of DAC is used, it's how it's executed that makes a difference. Pioneer receivers use that exact DAC, but I've heard that the sound is just ok in their receivers (I've not demoed myself yet though). Burr-Brown used to be top dog at one time and Onkyo uses it in both their receivers and CD players, but their CD players are lifeless sounding compared to the Marantz which uses a little heard of Cirrus DAC. So any DAC can be made to sound and perform with excellence or be lack-luster at best.
 
Ayre is VERY highly regarded and their PCM filter tech is apparantly top notch and deals with pre-ringing well!

I have an Onkyo SACD player and it uses WM8742 with 5 PCM filter choices and 4 DSD filter choices. Discrete output stage. Sounds great!
 
NorthStar said:
The Pono uses an ESS Sabre DAC, the ESS 9018, the very best one up-to-date.

* I believe Meridian's audio designer Bob Stuart is behind the discrete output stage with zero feedback.
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No, they scrapped Meridian for AYRE.

People need to check out the QB9. Viendoc here loves his. USB only though...
 
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