Most beneficial cable

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Newmill

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I currently have a Shunyata Alpha -HC power Cable powering my Audio Research REF75 SE amplifier. I also have a pair of Shunyata Black Mambas powering my 2 REL Subs. My REF6 preamp is connected using an older Cardas cable I had laying around (forget the name, but it was about a 400$ cable), and someone modded it to accommodate the C19 connector required for the ARC pre. My Lumin network player is connected with a Shunyata Analog power cable (I think its called Alpha as well, but can't see into the abyss to get a good look.) Frankly I'm not sure why I have a Shunyata analog cable. My question is; Should i replace the the Lumin cable (analogue) to a digital cable first, or, should I replace the Cardass cable to the preamp first. Which will give me better results. Thanks.
 
Shunyatta and Cardas are both good brands. Hard to say which replacement would yield your best result. I suppose I'd try the connection between pre and power first.
 
My process has been to focus on source equipment first and move downstream. Assuming all sources are directly connected to the preamp, that's where I start. Audition as many preamp power cords as you feel is necessary and then focus on the source devices connected to preamp. Once you get those figured out, move on the the REF75 SE. One can learn alot about one's system by being methodical and not adding more than one variable at a time. Just my 2 cents, YMMV.
 
Newmill said:
I currently have a Shunyata Alpha -HC power Cable powering my Audio Research REF75 SE amplifier. I also have a pair of Shunyata Black Mambas powering my 2 REL Subs. My REF6 preamp is connected using an older Cardas cable I had laying around (forget the name, but it was about a 400$ cable), and someone modded it to accommodate the C19 connector required for the ARC pre. My Lumin network player is connected with a Shunyata Analog power cable (I think its called Alpha as well, but can't see into the abyss to get a good look.) Frankly I'm not sure why I have a Shunyata analog cable. My question is; Should i replace the the Lumin cable (analogue) to a digital cable first, or, should I replace the Cardass cable to the preamp first. Which will give me better results. Thanks.
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Also, not familiar with a Shunyata "Analog" power cable – ? 🤔 Maybe it was an older power cable from some years back, e.g. when the Black Mamba line was out. I had some Black Mamba and Black Mamba HCs and they were very good back in their day, but the current line (no pun intended) is much better.

Their current model nomenclature, and I know these designations apply to an older model line are Venom, Delta, Alpha, Sigma, etc. Presently there are Venom v2 NR, Delta v2 NR, Alpha v2 NR Sigma v2 NR, all of which have a noise-reduction (NR) filter in the plug at the component end, and an "extra-current" line of PCs, e.g. Venom XC, Delta XC, Alpha XC that are primarily designed for use in powering power distributors, etc.

If you can give us a range of your budget for upgrading PCs for the Lumin and the preamp, we can provide some suggestions at various price points.


Mr Peabody said:
<snip> I suppose I'd try the connection between pre and power first.
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Yeah, I'd agree with upgrading the PC for the preamp, first.

Just occurred to me, for your Lumin: I use the Venom V14 NR PCs for the linear power supply for my EtherREGEN and another one for my Akasa NUC ROCK server, and they work very well for this application, so this might be a good choice as an upgrade for noise-reducing PC for your Lumin network player. They're also quite affordable.
 
Thanks for the great reply. I am shopping in the between 1k and 1.5k used market prices. Starting to lean to the preamp upgrade cable, but maybe it makes sense to go up the food chain for this and hold off on the other cable for a bit?
 
Newmill said:
Thanks for the great reply. I am shopping in the between 1k and 1.5k used market prices. Starting to lean to the preamp upgrade cable, but maybe it makes sense to go up the food chain for this and hold off on the other cable for a bit?
Click to expand...

Preamp for sure.. I have an alpha v2 on a 6SE and sigma v2 on a 75SE Shunyata recommended the beefier cable on the amp. Puma cat provided a great comprehensive response.

I use an alpha v2 on dac also.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Newmill said:
Thanks for the great reply. I am shopping in the between 1k and 1.5k used market prices. Starting to lean to the preamp upgrade cable, but maybe it makes sense to go up the food chain for this and hold off on the other cable for a bit?
Click to expand...

Not sure if your total budget is between 1K & 1.5K for both cables, or for each cable. For your Lumin, as it is a low-power, low-voltage device, but susceptible to noise, a Venom V14 NR is fully sufficient. The most important attribute of the cable here is noise-reduction over voltage (or current) delivery because the Lumin really does not need current to drive big power supplies such as those in preamps or amps (amps need the current to drive loudspeakers), it's simply sending a very small signal (approx +2V DC for "1" in the digital signal) to a DAC, so what is needed is noise-reduction, rather than current or voltage delivery. You can buy a Venom V14 NR new for $400.

Your preamp, though, will really benefit from better current delivery, so if you can find a used Alpha V2 NR (or even an Alpha V1 NR), that will pay dividends in making the preamp sound more dynamic, open and expresssive. You might also look for an older Zitron Alpha HC or Zitron Python, etc, but honestly, the newer PCs are so much better than the older models, it best to go with the latest "rev" that's in your budget. For example, the current Delta v2 NR outperforms the original Alpha V1 NR, so if you had the budget, I'd get a Delta v2 NR for your preamp. I've been using their PCs for what...12 years now, and I've found their newer models are always better than the older models, and generally the latest rev of the lower model (e.g. a Delta v2) outperforms the earlier rev the next higher model (e.g. Alpha v1).

Hope this helps....
 
AndrewR said:
Preamp for sure.. I have an alpha v2 on a 6SE and sigma v2 on a 75SE Shunyata recommended the beefier cable on the amp. Puma cat provided a great comprehensive response.

I use an alpha v2 on dac also.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's a great set-up, Andrew, that's exactly the set-up I used for my pre when I had my First Sound preamp. I use a Sigma NR v2 for the amp (which in my case, is actually an integrated).

For my Lumin P1, which is now my streamer, DAC, and preamp, I use the higher-spec Omega QR-s (which was specifically designed for sources e.g. DACs), but that is an Alpha v2 NR PC with the in-line QR/BB module. If I didn't have the budget for Omega QR-s for the Lumin P1 though, I'd be using the Alpha v2 NR PC.

The Alpha v2 NRs, on the whole, are an excellent "all-round" power cord and will also perform superbly on amps, as well. 👍
 
Seems that even though there may be gains to be made by changing to a used cable, it may be worth it to up the anti and get into the NR technology in a newer cable. Any opinions about this and the diminishing returns formula?
 
Newmill said:
Seems that even though there may be gains to be made by changing to a used cable, it may be worth it to up the anti and get into the NR technology in a newer cable. Any opinions about this and the diminishing returns formula?
Click to expand...

As mentioned, the new lines of NR and XC PCs outperform the older lines. The NR technology is impactful for reducing noise in the system overall, because the NR filter prevents noise from the component's internal power supplies from coming back out of the component to be distributed to the other (e.g. upstream source) components in the system. For example, a primary source of noise are the full-wave bridge rectifiers in the power supplies of preamps and amps themselves.

Remember, this is AC, alternating current. The current goes BOTH WAYS: INTO the component, and OUT of the component at 60X/sec, it does NOT "flow" only one direction from the wall receptacle to the components, like water from hose into a bucket. Moreover, the bridge rectifiers "snapping open and closed" during dynamic transients can spew all sorts of noise components out of the audio component's (e.g. preamp, amps, etc.) power supply back upstream to the source components.

Moreover, the AC wiring in your walls literally function as an antenna to pick up RF and EMI and input this into the amplification componentry unless the AC mains wiring in your home or room are run inside aluminum conduit for shielding. The NR filters on the power cords and inside the power distributor also filter EMI and RF that is on the AC mains.

You might find these vids I made back in 2019 or so helpful to provide some data...
Shunyata Research noise-reducing power cord demonstration - YouTube

V14D Demo Part 2 - YouTube

As mentioned, the newer model lines generally outperform the model higher from the previous generation. An example of this I provieded above is the newer Delta V2 NR PC will generally outperform an Alpha v1 NR PC, and at a lower cost.

For your DAC, pre or amp, in general, the better PC you can afford, the better performance you'll get, while remaining pragmatic and remembering you don't need to put a Sigma v2 NR on an NUC music server, router, or Ethernet swtich.
 
Puma; your posts, and video links are so informative. Very grateful for this little community here. The irony here is, now that I have decided that the best option is likely preamp first, during the learning process, all of the used Shunyata cables on Canuck Audio have disappeared. I could wait for some cables to get listed, but maybe V2 Delta would be a good match for my pre, and I'll buy new. Are you guys getting these cables on line or do you have a dealer?
 
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