I am insane...

MikeCh said:
Congrats Darin! Did the Pioneer S-2EX's (impress you enough, and) drive you toward wanting/needing to know how their cousin sounds?
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Yes!


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Thx everyone. The Maggies may be too much for my room - overloading it. Magicos are awesome. Hoping if the two had a love child it would be tad cr1. Will report back by Monday


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... NOICE! Get a bigger room & have the Maggies at one end & the TAD's at the other, seat must swivel!
 
I finally got the TADs up and running. First word that came to mind was "coherent" and then what struck me was the beautiful midrange and then how the CR1s were giving equal measure to bass midrange and treble.

I had just listened to my S5s. I started noticing details formerly passed over. Small guitar strums that decay quietly. The micro dynamics and natural transparency are the best I have heard and there is a smooth easy to listen to quality to the top end. All the detail and zero fatigue.

They are missing nothing down below compared to 20.7s and S5s and are a better fit for my room.

Maggies move more air and S5 are more like a "rock eq" (bass and treble slightly more predominate than midrange). TADs have just as big and a bit wider stage as S5s but there is something about how the music consistently and coherently hangs together that reminds me of the Maggie wall of sound - like live music. Easier to get lost in the music. Not analyzing what I am hearing. Magicos are "stunning" speakers - the TADs are check-all-the-boxes engaging and musical speakers.

I did something I have never done before. My wife came in and I told her these are the speakers I will take into retirement. It is as if the Maggies and Magicos had a love child. Perfect blend of transient speed and transparency and midrange magic. Could not be happier.

Anyone want to buy the 20.7s or the S5s? Wish I had picked these up a few years ago.

And I haven't even hooked up all four amps.

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Darrin - those look awesome. Glad you are enjoying them. How's the tweeter?


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Looks great, congrats!

The tweeter is the only driver the S-1EX shares with the TAD Ref series, it's the best I've ever heard. Better controlled vs the omnipresent SS Be tweeters, more similar to Von Schweikert's version with a damping layer applied to the face of a SS Be tweeter used on the VR55 and also Endeavor speakers.

Plasma tweeters used by Vaughn and Launche might be close, maybe better? The whole package of TAD's concentric Be midrange + Be tweeter makes for the best dynamic speakers out there imo. Horn speakers are the only thing I prefer, and then only really good ones. Mike's new AG Duo Mezzo vs the TAD Ref series would be interesting, although the TAD Evo towers would probably be the best candidate for a comparison in the range.

The one thing I've noticed with my Pioneers is the bass might be considered a bit overdamped and the amp has a pretty big effect on bass damping. I'm currently using an Odyssey amp with amazing results.

Dpod, I'm sure you'll keep them until a deal on a pair of Ref 1s come up you can't refuse. How can you turn down a 2nd woofer? ;) I'm keeping my Pioneers until I can afford Ref 1s. And building my own horn speakers.
 
DaveC said:
Looks great, congrats!

The tweeter is the only driver the S-1EX shares with the TAD Ref series, it's the best I've ever heard. Better controlled vs the omnipresent SS Be tweeters, more similar to Von Schweikert's version with a damping layer applied to the face of a SS Be tweeter used on the VR55 and also Endeavor speakers.

Plasma tweeters used by Vaughn and Launche might be close, maybe better? The whole package of TAD's concentric Be midrange + Be tweeter makes for the best dynamic speakers out there imo. Horn speakers are the only thing I prefer, and then only really good ones. Mike's new AG Duo Mezzo vs the TAD Ref series would be interesting, although the TAD Evo towers would probably be the best candidate for a comparison in the range.

The one thing I've noticed with my Pioneers is the bass might be considered a bit overdamped and the amp has a pretty big effect on bass damping. I'm currently using an Odyssey amp with amazing results.

Dpod, I'm sure you'll keep them until a deal on a pair of Ref 1s come up you can't refuse. How can you turn down a 2nd woofer? ;) I'm keeping my Pioneers until I can afford Ref 1s. And building my own horn speakers.
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I learned too much bass takes away from the midrange. My marantz monks woke up the woofers on my Magicos and they are bringing the same tight dynamic thunderous bass to the CR1s. Another woofer would likely overload my room and take away from the balance I am hearing in these CR1s which strike me as a "book stander" (hybrid between a floor stander and a bookshelf).

I have the Pioneer S2ex speakers. Same genetic coding but not in same league as TADs. My Magicos are better than the S1EX and I believe after some more critical listening my initial take will hold that the TADs are better (to my ears and room) than the S5s. The Pioneers and TADs are very musical at an organically resolving level
 
The TAD Reference series concentric driver is the best mid/high driver combination I've heard, it's probably not possible to do better. One day I'll get pair :) In the meantime I'm looking at moving the Pioneer crossover outboard and upgrading caps, resistors, binding posts and wiring. I think they are worth it... I have the service manual for the Pioneers which includes photos and schematics of the crossover.

I talked to Andrew about the Pioneers, he said he conceived them as 2nd tier down from the Reference series, the S-3EX being 3rd tier, but they ended up as Pioneer's flagship speakers instead of TADs. It's very strange they never sold well. The S1s and S2s have been appreciating on the used market since they were discontinued.
 
Yes the Pioneers compete in the 15-20k range I believe. All the same traits as the TADs. I think you are smart to get the Pioneers upgraded. I had Jena labs upgrade my marantz monos - some second rate wiring and parts in specific locations. The upgrade took the amps to a new level. Big houses like pioneer and marantz have different engineers handle some of the minor parts selection that don't keep up with the chief designers standards but it hits a cost or reliability standard. Small upgrades can make a huge difference. Would love to hear more about your upgrade path :-)
 
Dpod4 said:
Yes the Pioneers compete in the 15-20k range I believe. All the same traits as the TADs. I think you are smart to get the Pioneers upgraded. I had Jena labs upgrade my marantz monos - some second rate wiring and parts in specific locations. The upgrade took the amps to a new level. Big houses like pioneer and marantz have different engineers handle some of the minor parts selection that don't keep up with the chief designers standards but it hits a cost or reliability standard. Small upgrades can make a huge difference. Would love to hear more about your upgrade path :-)
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Agreed. I'm not changing the design, just using better caps, resistors, wire and binding posts, plus moving the xos outboard in their own box. I'm not going to spend a fortune, otherwise I'd get too close to the price of the Evolution towers (used or wholesale) but I'll spend $1-2K. I'll probably go with Clarity ESA caps, Mills resistors keep the stock inductors, although maybe replace ones in the mid/high xo circuit with foil inductors. I'd go with Furutech FT-865(R) binding posts on the xos and maybe Neutrik Speakons from the xo to the speaker.

Anyway, Congrats on the CR-1s, they are amazing speakers! :congrats:
 
Darrin, I just wanted to say "Congrats"! I hope you have found the speaker that you love, and keep into retirement. I'm keeping my Salons for at least a few more years and maybe longer.
 
Dpod4 said:
I learned too much bass takes away from the midrange......

resolving level
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i often read comments on bass & it makes me wonder if some have heard a properly tuned system with the bass tuned for the room. It is such an important fundamental that I always tune my room first for & only then the listening position. Then again I am a bit spoilt having the 2 infrasonics.
 
Things got interesting yesterday. My dealer called me and said he thought we may have put the tweeter panels on upside down which would impact phase among other things. I checked. Sure enough they were. So I put them on the right way and voila the Maggie spacious enveloping wall of sound hit me. Much more balanced across the frequency spectrum now!!
 
Dpod4 said:
Things got interesting yesterday. My dealer called me and said he thought we may have put the tweeter panels on upside down which would impact phase among other things. I checked. Sure enough they were. So I put them on the right way and voila the Maggie spacious enveloping wall of sound hit me. Much more balanced across the frequency spectrum now!!
Click to expand...

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