High-End Audio Faces a Reckoning

J Gordon Holt a leader in promoting subjective reviews and the founder of Stereophile was not opposed to objective testing (and blind tests). He actually saw that opposition as an industry failure.

45 Years of Stereophile | Stereophile.com

It was 45 years ago this month that the first issue of Stereophile, just 20 pages in length, went in the mail. It had been founded by one J. Gordon Holt. Gordon had been technical editor of High Fidelity magazine in the 1950s, and was tired of being asked to pander to the demands of advertisers.
www.stereophile.com www.stereophile.com
 
nicoff said:
J Gordon Holt a leader in promoting subjective reviews and the founder of Stereophile was not opposed to objective testing (and blind tests). He actually saw that opposition as an industry failure.

45 Years of Stereophile | Stereophile.com

It was 45 years ago this month that the first issue of Stereophile, just 20 pages in length, went in the mail. It had been founded by one J. Gordon Holt. Gordon had been technical editor of High Fidelity magazine in the 1950s, and was tired of being asked to pander to the demands of advertisers.
www.stereophile.com www.stereophile.com
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I have several friends who are engineers who test things to the extreme. The three of us were out once and I posed the question to them: "what do they think of measurements done on audio gear (they are not audiophiles) in which people make judgments on how good gear is or how it will sound".

They all agreed it's a fool's errand for anyone to actually take any measurements seriously: there are so many different ways to test the same thing, so many different variables in gear used, so many ways you can manipulate the data (intentionally or accidentally) that unless it's the same person, using the same gear, and never moving the equipment at all to minimize variables, that it's basically completely manginess to rely on measurements from different people on gear.

I found it an interesting take and certainly one that I as a non-engineer had ever thought of. Basically even the measurements have such variable between people doing the measuring they are meaningless to apply any weight to.

I don't think most people have issues with measurements per se. I think the issue is with how the value of measurements and how much weight they put on them by many is not balanced.
 
I wonder why the "measurebator" forums bring so many fans? I understand basic measurements can show major flaws but not a tool for measuring subjective sound quality. What type of content attracts all audio interested people to specific forums? Seems a very high schoolish "click" enviroment.
 
nc42acc said:
I wonder why the "measurebator" forums bring so many fans? I understand basic measurements can show major flaws but not a tool for measuring subjective sound quality. What type of content attracts all audio interested people to specific forums? Seems a very high schoolish "click" enviroment.
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Because they don’t know how to listen and want someone else to tell them what measures best so they don’t have to think.
 
mep said:
Amir has had his ass handed to him by numerous manufacturers who disagree with how Amir takes his measurements. I've never seen that happen to John Atkinson from Stereophile. Choose your gurus wisely.
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Very true. JA is the gold standard when it comes to both measuring and listening when doing a review, as far as I am aware.
 
Mike said:
Because they don’t know how to listen and want someone else to tell them what measures best so they don’t have to think.
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Bingo.

I also think there is an angle among many of them who are just jealous we have a nicer system then they do. These people are easy to spot as they keep throwing out the word "greed" for any hifi item that costs more than their simple self-assumed sum of its parts (they aren't smart enough to understand labor, shipping, rent, taxes, holding costs, duties, marketing costs, and company salaries).

They claim this "greed" while typing it on their shiny new $2,000 iPhone they bought while drinking a $12 Starbucks uber-coffer-something-or-other. They don't see the irony of their regurgitated talking points.

To be clear, I have no issue with people who believe cheap systems are just as good as higher end ones. If that brings them happiness then that's all that matters. The issue becomes when they focus their brainwashed-rants by going after those with nicer systems. The amount of stupid comments on a simple video or Facebook posts on DAC's or cables or even vibration control makes you realize the bitterness and animosity many of these people live by towards others.

In many instances their anger is their daily driving force in life.
 
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