HiFi Critic DAC shootout

Which DAC did the "second opinion" favor?

You could say that the Audio Note DAC had an advantage since it was paired with it's matching transport.

You could say the most expensive DAC had an advantage too.

You *could* say a lot of things about the review, but if the reviewer is respected and has built a highly resolving reference system than what else could you ask for really - it's his review and his opinion at the end of the day - no more no less.

What were the relative prices of the DACs reviewed, and in the case of "stacked" DACs what components (e.g. clocks) were used?
 
He liked the BADA Ref 2 best. His system was voiced around BADA Series 2 DAC so the similar sounding Ref 2 could have had an advantage.

I wish Martin Colloms offered something more than his perspective on the BADA Ref 2, which BTW didn't score as high as some other top tier DACs he had revieved. Something to consider.

The whole review looks to me more like a 'reader's letter' that ended up beeing published. I don't recall any reviews written by this guy.
 
a.wayne said:
The subscription rate is reasonable considering ...



The Audio Critic was always expensive , back in the late 70's when i saw my first copy , it was nothing more than what one would see from a typical high school type news letter and cost was significantly higher than other mags of the time . I was later told , it was because there were no ads and PA had to purchase the equipment under review as no manufacture would let him have their product.

His reviews back then and forever were Brutal and he pulled no punches.....


Peter , much later thru TAC , introduced the power cube test and to my knowledge he was the only US mag to do so , this test would subject amplifiers to real world speaker type loads , toobs would fail miserably and only the best SS built amps could pass. Because of toobs poor performance on this test, Peter hated them and thought them nothing more than effects Boxes creating their own sound ..


SP and others never adopted the test for obvious reasons why even the normal daily dose of testing bass response with a 25hz square wave were eventually dropped ( SP only uses 1K/10K today) to protect the innocent .... :)


If you have to know , subscribe .....
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I think you mistake HiFi Critic with Audio Critic. Two different mags.
 
Does anyone, other than guys who already like BADA DACs and Magico speakers, trust this guy's conclusion?
 
cmarin said:
It appears that the author used an Audio Note (UK) CDT Five Transport, Dartzeel preamp and power amp, and Magico Q5 speakers.

The review covered the following DACs: Berkeley Audio Alpha 2, Audio Note (UK) DAC 5 Signature, Trinity DAC, dCS Vivaldi DAC v2.0, Metronome C8 Plus, CH Precision C1, and Berkeley Audio Alpha Reference Series 2.
Click to expand...

Sorry they didn't include the Chord DAVE.
 
I'm looking forward to hearing the Berkeley Audio Alpha Reference Series 2 fully implemented with MQA at some point. I don't plan on doing anything right now because the Musical Paradise is just wonderful.
 
jdandy said:
Jim.......According to The Absolute Sound review found here: http://www.theabsolutesound.com/art...ey-audio-design-alpha-reference-dac-series-2/ , the original price of the Berkeley Alpha Reference DAC was $16,000; the Series 2 is $19,500. Owners of the original can upgrade for the $3,500 difference.
Click to expand...

True, kinda.

Several months ago, when I spoke with one of the two Michaels who started Berkeley, he said that $3.5K price for the upgrade is only for original owners.

But if you bought your Berkeley Ref used, in the secondary market, the price for the upgrade is $5,000.

When I asked him why the kinda large cost discrepancy, he responded with something about wanting to discourage the used market.

Really.
 
Holy cow!

Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. I don't like that kind of "marketing" at all. That's insane to me. Ayre never does anything like that and all products that are upgraded along the way are offered to whoever sends one in. Maybe another reason to stay away, in my opinion.



Cycleman said:
True, kinda.

Several months ago, when I spoke with one of the two Michaels who started Berkeley, he said that $3.5K price for the upgrade is only for original owners.

But if you bought your Berkeley Ref used, in the secondary market, the price for the upgrade is $5,000.

When I asked him why the kinda large cost discrepancy, he responded with something about wanting to discourage the used market.

Really.
Click to expand...
 
Cycleman said:
True, kinda.

Several months ago, when I spoke with one of the two Michaels who started Berkeley, he said that $3.5K price for the upgrade is only for original owners.

But if you bought your Berkeley Ref used, in the secondary market, the price for the upgrade is $5,000.

When I asked him why the kinda large cost discrepancy, he responded with something about wanting to discourage the used market.

Really.
Click to expand...

That is really short sighted thinking. The used market is a big factor driving new purchases. Without it the ability to upgrade and purchase expensive new products would be greatly reduced. In essence this manufacturer is only interested in servicing original owners. In my opinion not a smart strategy in a product category with often short product cycles or frequent upgrade options.
 
Cycleman said:
True, kinda.

Several months ago, when I spoke with one of the two Michaels who started Berkeley, he said that $3.5K price for the upgrade is only for original owners.

But if you bought your Berkeley Ref used, in the secondary market, the price for the upgrade is $5,000.

When I asked him why the kinda large cost discrepancy, he responded with something about wanting to discourage the used market.

Really.
Click to expand...

That doesn't strike me as a good business plan. It's a turn off in my mind. Second or third owners aren't asking for free warranty support. Burdening those who wish to upgrade the Berkeley Alpha Reference DAC to the Reference 2 DAC with an additional $1500 penalty because they aren't the original owner is a slap in the face. The used market supports their business to a degree even if they wish to ignore it. Honestly, how many $16,000 Alpha REF DAC's did they sell? Rather short sighted if you ask me.
 
I have to share my story of a high end DAC shootout. As Mike knows, I got to know him through Audioshark Forum. Elsewhere in this forum you can learn that Mike (Suncoast Audio) has finally put down brick and mortar. My wife and I happened to be traveling in Mid-Feb and made arrangements on a Friday to have a blindfolded shootout of 5 top DACs. first, I can't say enough about the Suncoast facility - it has to be one of the top spots in U.S. - absolutely fantastic. Mike replicated a version of my equipment (Ayre pre/amp, Aurender and Vandersteen Quatros - vs my Ayre ref Kx-R/VX-R and Carbon 5As. My wife and I were blindfolded through all but the final two selection. Going in, my wife was fully locked like Harry Potter "..Not Slytherin, not Slytherin..." but rather "....not Lampizator, not Lampizator..." due to the WAF factor.

Key results:
- Used my Dana USB cable on all DACs
- Tunes varied from Annie Lennox - Into the West, Brad Mehldau - Waltz for J.B., Stevie Ray Vaughn - Tin Pan Alley, Symphony #2 in E Minor Op. 27 - Budapest Festival Orchestra, Moondance - Van Morrison
- So here is how they sorted - first the eliminations:
- Ayre Qx-5 - was immediately eliminated as too bright for both of us. Sound was good and soundstage was clear but the hair raised on the back of our necks during the Annie Lennox crescendo ( note after the shootout, Mike mentioned he likes the QX5 with another USB
- Berkeley Ref 2 - this was my initial favorite but my wife felt it was mushy in the soundstage background. We did listen again after the shootout and enjoyed it more and the sound was excellent just not the top one
- Dave Chord - this one had amazing depth to the sound stage, excellent separation and clarity BUT it was also too bright. Mike tried another USB cable but alas, was still a bit too shrill for our tastes
- You guessed it - when we took off the masks - left standing were the B7 and Atlantic Lampizators - The music was warmer and more organic. For us, it sounded more analog and natural.
...And the winner is: after 6 1/2 hours with Mike and swapping tubes in the B7 and the Atlantic rectifier, the B7 clearly was the winner. The clincher was the Symphony #2 which was mesmerizing - truly one of the most emotional connections ever with the music. My wife is thrilled with the sound (and will live with the aesthetics) and swears there must be some type of gypsy magic sprinkled onto the B7.

We essentially ordered the B7 with the set up we loved ( tubes and wires) and included a Denali 6000T per Mike's recommendation.

As a couple who has shopped most Hi-Fi shops -on the East Coast we enjoyed our experience with Mike in his new shop. Mike is passionate and spends less time selling and more trying to find the right sound for us. He guided us in the process and adjusted as we reflected on each DAC. It's nice to have a guide on the trail. Truth of the matter, I think he enjoyed the shootout too.

What fun! Can't wait for the equipment to ship to our house.
 
Moneypenny said:
I have to share my story of a high end DAC shootout. As Mike knows, I got to know him through Audioshark Forum. Elsewhere in this forum you can learn that Mike (Suncoast Audio) has finally put down brick and mortar. My wife and I happened to be traveling in Mid-Feb and made arrangements on a Friday to have a blindfolded shootout of 5 top DACs. first, I can't say enough about the Suncoast facility - it has to be one of the top spots in U.S. - absolutely fantastic. Mike replicated a version of my equipment (Ayre pre/amp, Aurender and Vandersteen Quatros - vs my Ayre ref Kx-R/VX-R and Carbon 5As. My wife and I were blindfolded through all but the final two selection. Going in, my wife was fully locked like Harry Potter "..Not Slytherin, not Slytherin..." but rather "....not Lampizator, not Lampizator..." due to the WAF factor.

Key results:
- Used my Dana USB cable on all DACs
- Tunes varied from Annie Lennox - Into the West, Brad Mehldau - Waltz for J.B., Stevie Ray Vaughn - Tin Pan Alley, Symphony #2 in E Minor Op. 27 - Budapest Festival Orchestra, Moondance - Van Morrison
- So here is how they sorted - first the eliminations:
- Ayre Qx-5 - was immediately eliminated as too bright for both of us. Sound was good and soundstage was clear but the hair raised on the back of our necks during the Annie Lennox crescendo ( note after the shootout, Mike mentioned he likes the QX5 with another USB
- Berkeley Ref 2 - this was my initial favorite but my wife felt it was mushy in the soundstage background. We did listen again after the shootout and enjoyed it more and the sound was excellent just not the top one
- Dave Chord - this one had amazing depth to the sound stage, excellent separation and clarity BUT it was also too bright. Mike tried another USB cable but alas, was still a bit too shrill for our tastes
- You guessed it - when we took off the masks - left standing were the B7 and Atlantic Lampizators - The music was warmer and more organic. For us, it sounded more analog and natural.
...And the winner is: after 6 1/2 hours with Mike and swapping tubes in the B7 and the Atlantic rectifier, the B7 clearly was the winner. The clincher was the Symphony #2 which was mesmerizing - truly one of the most emotional connections ever with the music. My wife is thrilled with the sound (and will live with the aesthetics) and swears there must be some type of gypsy magic sprinkled onto the B7.

We essentially ordered the B7 with the set up we loved ( tubes and wires) and included a Denali 6000T per Mike's recommendation.

As a couple who has shopped most Hi-Fi shops -on the East Coast we enjoyed our experience with Mike in his new shop. Mike is passionate and spends less time selling and more trying to find the right sound for us. He guided us in the process and adjusted as we reflected on each DAC. It's nice to have a guide on the trail. Truth of the matter, I think he enjoyed the shootout too.

What fun! Can't wait for the equipment to ship to our house.
Click to expand...

Thanks Jim. It was great visiting with you and your lovely wife. I had a blast doing the blind shootout myself.
 
Thank you Jim for the detailed write-up.

I have to say that I was rooting for the Ayre. Even the Berkeley wasn't there, wow! I do love Lampizator, maybe it's time for a second or third look. :)




Moneypenny said:
I have to share my story of a high end DAC shootout. As Mike knows, I got to know him through Audioshark Forum. Elsewhere in this forum you can learn that Mike (Suncoast Audio) has finally put down brick and mortar. My wife and I happened to be traveling in Mid-Feb and made arrangements on a Friday to have a blindfolded shootout of 5 top DACs. first, I can't say enough about the Suncoast facility - it has to be one of the top spots in U.S. - absolutely fantastic. Mike replicated a version of my equipment (Ayre pre/amp, Aurender and Vandersteen Quatros - vs my Ayre ref Kx-R/VX-R and Carbon 5As. My wife and I were blindfolded through all but the final two selection. Going in, my wife was fully locked like Harry Potter "..Not Slytherin, not Slytherin..." but rather "....not Lampizator, not Lampizator..." due to the WAF factor.

Key results:
- Used my Dana USB cable on all DACs
- Tunes varied from Annie Lennox - Into the West, Brad Mehldau - Waltz for J.B., Stevie Ray Vaughn - Tin Pan Alley, Symphony #2 in E Minor Op. 27 - Budapest Festival Orchestra, Moondance - Van Morrison
- So here is how they sorted - first the eliminations:
- Ayre Qx-5 - was immediately eliminated as too bright for both of us. Sound was good and soundstage was clear but the hair raised on the back of our necks during the Annie Lennox crescendo ( note after the shootout, Mike mentioned he likes the QX5 with another USB
- Berkeley Ref 2 - this was my initial favorite but my wife felt it was mushy in the soundstage background. We did listen again after the shootout and enjoyed it more and the sound was excellent just not the top one
- Dave Chord - this one had amazing depth to the sound stage, excellent separation and clarity BUT it was also too bright. Mike tried another USB cable but alas, was still a bit too shrill for our tastes
- You guessed it - when we took off the masks - left standing were the B7 and Atlantic Lampizators - The music was warmer and more organic. For us, it sounded more analog and natural.
...And the winner is: after 6 1/2 hours with Mike and swapping tubes in the B7 and the Atlantic rectifier, the B7 clearly was the winner. The clincher was the Symphony #2 which was mesmerizing - truly one of the most emotional connections ever with the music. My wife is thrilled with the sound (and will live with the aesthetics) and swears there must be some type of gypsy magic sprinkled onto the B7.

We essentially ordered the B7 with the set up we loved ( tubes and wires) and included a Denali 6000T per Mike's recommendation.

As a couple who has shopped most Hi-Fi shops -on the East Coast we enjoyed our experience with Mike in his new shop. Mike is passionate and spends less time selling and more trying to find the right sound for us. He guided us in the process and adjusted as we reflected on each DAC. It's nice to have a guide on the trail. Truth of the matter, I think he enjoyed the shootout too.

What fun! Can't wait for the equipment to ship to our house.
Click to expand...
 
Mike, like Bob V. is an audiophile first. Living the dream...

Moneypenny, please consider getting an upowered USB cable. It makes a difference.
 
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