D'Agostino Helius Monoblock Amplifiers

Mike said:
I'm going to order 10 for my home theater. Maybe twelve and get a pair of passive subs.


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Mike, lucky you have time to remodel you room so you can fit them in :roflmao:
 
I'm sorry, but sometimes the lunacy of these prices wear me down.

Not that I can't understand anyones passion, but there is a lot of great gear for a lot less.
 
Mark

It seems like this is the same path Dan went down one time before. It appears the son might be following the same path. Your right, there is plenty of great sounding gear for sane money. You just have to put your preconceptions and the magazine and on-line reviews aside and listen for yourself. Most all of the SS amp makers are buying their parts from the same sources so the fancy case work and advertising doesn't make one worth 10 times more than the other when it comes to sound.
 
Jack said:
Mark

It seems like this is the same path Dan went down one time before. It appears the son might be following the same path. Your right, there is plenty of great sounding gear for sane money. You just have to put your preconceptions and the magazine and on-line reviews aside and listen for yourself. Most all of the SS amp makers are buying their parts from the same sources so the fancy case work and advertising doesn't make one worth 10 times more than the other when it comes to sound.
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I would never consider a piece of gear at prices approaching anywhere near these for many reasons. Yet I disagree with you that the insides of many high priced units do not warrant significantly higher prices than others.
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Jim

I didn't say that superior built gear didn't warrant higher prices, but the current trend is to put the same off the shelf parts in an fancy CNC case with colored accents and charge 20 to 50 times the parts cost and buy advertising in the mags to justify it. Plus I don't think the gear you are showing is what we are talking about and you are a vested owner of Dan's gear. Same thing with six figure speakers.
 
There's no denying the engineering build quality. I suppose if it also oozes precision on the outside, it attracts a certain market demand where they can pay stratospheric prices. With 30 already spoken for, those profit margins must be looking $sweet$.

Saudis?

I think CNC aluminium block cutting for a single chassis/heatsink design is set to become commonplace as the manufacturing technique becomes more accessible/cheaper.
 
Jack said:
Jim

I didn't say that superior built gear didn't warrant higher prices, but the current trend is to put the same off the shelf parts in an fancy CNC case with colored accents and charge 20 to 50 times the parts cost and buy advertising in the mags to justify it. Plus I don't think the gear you are showing is what we are talking about and you are a vested owner of Dan's gear. Same thing with six figure speakers.
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And what brands are you talking about?
 
U
Jack said:
Jim

I didn't say that superior built gear didn't warrant higher prices, but the current trend is to put the same off the shelf parts in an fancy CNC case with colored accents and charge 20 to 50 times the parts cost and buy advertising in the mags to justify it. Plus I don't think the gear you are showing is what we are talking about and you are a vested owner of Dan's gear. Same thing with six figure speakers.
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You do realize buying parts and using parts are two different things?

MOST amplifier and speaker markups are 4x cost, not 50x with the manufacturer lucky to realize 2x. And a best selling product is 1500 units. Do you think Dan will approach even 200 pieces? No these are like buying expensive watches with runs of ten to fifty.

Could you also give a breakdown of manufacturing costs? Please include a profit margin, rent, employees salaries, medical care, warranty, expansion, cost of developing new products, overhead on storing parts, shipping, shows, advertising, etc. Unfortunately looking at the surface does not tell all. after the dealer price, most manufacturers are lucky to realize half the cost of the product. (At least when made in the US)

It's ok to question but at least provide some numbers.
 
MDP said:
I'm sorry, but sometimes the lunacy of these prices wear me down.

Not that I can't understand anyones passion, but there is a lot of great gear for a lot less.
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+1 No matter how good it is this is out of reach for me , For those who can good for you. I am sticking with Ayre mono blocks and upgrading them to 20s the poor mans soultion . When did 10, 20 and 30 grand gear become a bargain anyway.
I remember when I was 19 to 20 I could and did buy the best gear in any audio store I knew about. Now I do not even ask about the highest price gear. Even store owners have to take out a mortgage to stock this gear. Someone must have this kind of money and good for them. The RMAF should change to the following floors first floor 10 grand, second 30 grand, third 50 grand, forth 100 grand, fifth 250 grand, sixth 500 grand, seventh floor 1 million, floor 8 for those who are serious about good sound . Kind of fun to watch thou, I buy lotto ticket now and then and say if it wins I am getting on a plane and going shopping all over the world. 30 amps pre sold not to be made fun of that is real Statement in this day and age. Best of luck to buyers and sellers I will just watch from the cheap seats.
 
Garth said:
+1 No matter how good it is this is out of reach for me , For those who can good for you. I am sticking with Ayre mono blocks and upgrading them to 20s the poor mans soultion . When did 10, 20 and 30 grand gear become a bargain anyway.
I remember when I was 19 to 20 I could and did buy the best gear in any audio store I knew about. Now I do not even ask about the highest price gear. Even store owners have to take out a mortgage to stock this gear. Someone must have this kind of money and good for them. The RMAF should change to the following floors first floor 10 grand, second 30 grand, third 50 grand, forth 100 grand, fifth 250 grand, sixth 500 grand, seventh floor 1 million, floor 8 for those who are serious about good sound . Kind of fun to watch thou, I buy lotto ticket now and then and say if it wins I am getting on a plane and going shopping all over the world. 30 amps pre sold not to be made fun of that is real Statement in this day and age. Best of luck to buyers and sellers I will just watch from the cheap seats.
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Thing is this is still a capitalistic market and sales dictate the market. If these products didn't sell, manufacturers wouldn't make and sell them. I think the crux of the matter is you have a market that can't survive making products that sell a 1000 units or less. (Unlike companies like Sony, etc. that sell millions of units.) So instead manufacturers have tiurned to a niche that allows them to survive as well in many cases make less expensive products eg. The technology and R&D costs are written off against their statement products. Otherwise manufacturers couldn't sell their middle and entry level products for what they do.

The real problem is that audiophiles clamor for inexpensive audio products but don't support the market. Same as audio magazines. Audiophiles clamor for magazines that review affordable products but don't subscribe with Listener being the most recent example in a trail of failed affordable magazines. Thing is those who want affordable gear don't necessarily have the income to support the industry while that segment with six figure and higher incomes have the disposable income to buy the gear.
 
It's hard to argue against success whether that be the success of a manufacturer designing, manufacturing, and selling mega-expensive gear and those who are successful enough in life financially to afford mega-expensive gear. If people are selling it and people are buying it, it's all good. In the long run, I don't know how beneficial it is to make value judgements from the sidelines because the reflection of the judgement in the mirror isn't always so pretty. I have personally tried to quit doing this.

Just because you can't afford something doesn't mean it shouldn't be made and put on the market for others to enjoy who can afford it. If this attitude prevailed, we would all be listening to mid-fi gear.
 
I agree with Myles and Meb if their are buyer and sellers it is all good. Just a case of sticker shock is all for me anyway .

What you said about Listener I never even heard of a gear mag by that name. I hope you did not mean the mag Listen I would hate to see it fail.

Lower prices are always nice but a thing to remember in a race to the bottom of the barrel no one wins. Same is true in the other direction their is a balance to all things. Their has to be a value in what you build or sell real or perceived is always a matter of opinion . Same with Mags low, mid ,high and Holy Crap priced gear it is a balance that no one can get right because their is no right just opinions of right.

Who knows a 250,000 amp may seem cheap some day I remember when 2 grand was talked about the same way.
 
If my memory serves me correct, Dan came out with Statement amps (Master Reference I believe they were called) while at Krell. These amps, at the time, were monstrous, expensive ($120,000 increasing to $150,000) and whatever else. As time went on, people who heard them couldn't believe their ears. These amps gave way to other monstrous, cost no object amps (Boulder, etc.).

Although I will never (ever) be able to afford them, I'm certain, with Dan behind them, they will be another great masterpiece.

And let's not forget guys, the trickle down affect. I'm certain even Dan learned a few things while building the Helius Monos and hopefully this knowledge will trickle down into other new and exciting products from Dan D'Agostino Master Audio Systems.

IMHO - without the greats like Dan D'Agostino, Nelson Pass, John Curl and others, Solid State amps would have have progressed to the level they are at today.
 
Myles B. Astor said:
Listener was Art Dudley's magazine.
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Thanks not listen then.

I just had a thought on how much is too high in pricing for a piece of gear and here it is "when it costs more than a ex wife" the price is too high. Any other comparisons many say more than my first house a mark I passed years ago. I have also heard it is more than a car another item that is not priced in reality IMO. few musical instruments that cost as much as audio gear Violins are a exception and pianos . The people who play the music often have less invested than the people listening to it.
 
Garth said:
Thanks not listen then.

I just had a thought on how much is too high in pricing for a piece of gear and here it is "when it costs more than a ex wife" the price is too high. Any other comparisons many say more than my first house a mark I passed years ago. I have also heard it is more than a car another item that is not priced in reality IMO. few musical instruments that cost as much as audio gear Violins are a exception and pianos . The people who play the music often have less invested than the people listening to it.
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It's simple:Too high is when no one will purchase it at the price offered and you sell zero units. Too high is not when you or I or countless other people can't afford it or are simply not willing to part with the cash to buy it. Sitting on the sidelines and throwing rocks at the wealthy does make some people feel better, but it doesn't change the reality of the situation. Affordability is a relative term after all.
 
Myles B. Astor said:
Listener was Art Dudley's magazine.
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i loved that magazine, but tedium set in quickly with too many reviews of cookie cutter british integrated amps and monitor speakers. they did embrace low power SET and Horns before the mainstream publications did, just before their demise.

as they say, perception is everything. how many quarter million dollars amps wil Dan sell and at anywhere near list price? I'm the curious type and almost always ask rep at shows how many of X have they sold. the numbers would disappoint you. that said i still think the prices are accelerating much faster than inflation or the cost of living, you can spin the numbers anyway you want but that's my perception.
 
I think the watch comparison is pretty accurate. I know I guy in Singapore that collects watches and he doesn't think twice on spending half a million on a watch.


All the power to him.

If I had that kind of money - I'd be tempted if it sounded great. But I dont. So looking is all I can do. But it's fun to look. :)
 
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