Can different blank discs sound different?

Mike

Mike

Audioshark
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Can different quality of blank CD’s sound different when the same music is copied to it?

YES!

I wouldn’t have believed it myself, but in comparing the exact same bit perfect error free copy of the same music files to different blank CD’s, I was surprised by the results.

The winner (almost unattainable today):

6d27f9a44fc32a59493ec4c5073fb7b4.jpg


Runner Up:

57a6114554fbe6f836eaea334ce04816.jpg


There were no others worthy of mention.


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Mike,

I know you hear a difference - but it must be due to the induced RF noise produced by the decoding chip in the CD transport affecting the downstream (or internal) analog processing. Both CD's contain the same music bits but each CD has different number of read errors (typically thousands, the literature says) that are corrected by the decoding chip during playback (and this is normal). The transport produces the same output bits from each CD ...but in doing so, the accompanying electromagnetic noise spewing from the decoding section in the transport is different between the Kodak and the UltraDisc. In decoding the Kodak CD, the chip must do less work (due to the better physical substrate and less errors?) and so less electromagnetic noise can affect downstream DACs.

Of course, this only makes sense if your tests had your transport and DAC connected by a metal-based interface..like AES or SPDIF Coax. With an optical connection, you will hear no difference.

There is an industry research paper (which I am looking for) that describes all this.

Dan
 
I suspect it has to do with how well/accurate the ‘pits’ are burnt into the blank disc. CD players have read jitter, and a sloppy disc would probably exacerbate that. That’s enough thinking for a Friday. :)
 
I have heard of it, but I must say I have never actually heard it.

It has been a few years since I have burned a disc. In the past I would burn a compilation disc of various types of music when I was going to audition gear in a shop.
 
I agree with Bud. The digital data stored on the CD is exactly the same. The superior quality of the CD reduces jitter when it’s read by the laser in the transport.

Ken
 
rrwmd said:
I remember this issue being discussed by Gary Koh of Genesis years back:

http://www.genesisloudspeakers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/Black_CD_Paper_v2.pdf
Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing. I’ll give it a read later.

I must admit, when my friend first told me of his exhaustive research and results, I thought he was totally full of crap. Then he played the Kodak (his winner) Vs Mofi Gold vs generic silver CD, assured me it was the exact same rip, using the same software and Plextor burner. The MOFI Gold CD is the Kodak Gold, but simply a Black MOFI label added and that affected sound!

The regular silver cd sounded lifeless and veiled by comparison to the Kodak and MOFI. Amazing.
 
Mike, please try this: download the MSB Technology bit perfect test file at the CD standard 16/44.1 format. Burn the file to both the Kodak and a generic silver CD. Play the CDs thru the transport (bypass all processing) The DAC will report that the files are exactly the same ...yet they sound different.

You are a respected and successful audio expert so making the statement 'The regular silver CD sounded lifeless and veiled by comparison to the Kodak and MOFI.' makes it sound like you are representing that the audible benefit is inherent and captured in the CD. Yet the CD's hold the same data, the jitter is not an issue and the DAC sees the bits correctly.

You have to adjust your 'belief' and face the facts. RF noise is present at short range in open air but mostly insidious thru metal-to-metal contact in cables and circuit boards...despite the efforts of design engineers. It contaminates small signal processing in the DAC so the bits-to-volts gets subtlety affected and exhibits the 'veiled and lifeless' artifacts you hear. This is the inconvenient truth.

Again, if you use an optical link from transport to DAC you will eliminate this problem.
 
dmance said:
Mike, please try this: download the MSB Technology bit perfect test file at the CD standard 16/44.1 format. Burn the file to both the Kodak and a generic silver CD. Play the CDs thru the transport (bypass all processing) The DAC will report that the files are exactly the same ...yet they sound different.

You are a respected and successful audio expert so making the statement 'The regular silver CD sounded lifeless and veiled by comparison to the Kodak and MOFI.' makes it sound like you are representing that the audible benefit is inherent and captured in the CD. Yet the CD's hold the same data, the jitter is not an issue and the DAC sees the bits correctly.

You have to adjust your 'belief' and face the facts. RF noise is present at short range in open air but mostly insidious thru metal-to-metal contact in cables and circuit boards...despite the efforts of design engineers. It contaminates small signal processing in the DAC so the bits-to-volts gets subtlety affected and exhibits the 'veiled and lifeless' artifacts you hear. This is the inconvenient truth.

Again, if you use an optical link from transport to DAC you will eliminate this problem.
Click to expand...

It is not about whether or not there is a difference in data, so performing a bit perfect test is beside the point. It is about whether or not there are physical differences in the discs themselves.
 
asindc said:
It is not about whether or not there is a difference in data, so performing a bit perfect test is beside the point. It is about whether or not there are physical differences in the discs themselves.
Click to expand...

Bingo.


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There was a lot of discussion years ago that the black CD-R's that came in the Memorex containers sounded better than the other colors mixed in the package.
 
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