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  1. #1
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    Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Ok nobody responded to my last thread requesting input on Home Theater bypass operation for the MSB DAC but thankfully this form has many contributors that speak highly of the Preamp module on their Select and Reference DACs. With that information and as well as guidance from my dealer and MSB I now have a new Reference DAC on the way. Although I know many dealers, distributors and manufacturers personally and most of them are cream of the crop I would like , with the permission of the moderator, to post the email I had sent to MSB. It summaries my experience which fortunately I have received from many others in the HiFi business as well.

    Vince,
    After several years and now several purchases I have to say your professionalism, knowledge and speedy response always exceed expectations. I state this from a qualified position of employing hundreds of people over a period of three decades .
    From a consumer standpoint I cannot overstate how much more pleasurable these expensive purchases are made by your input and the invaluable support of my local dealer.

    As a result of Fidelis Music Systems demonstrations and your extremely valuable input I am once again a returning customer and have placed my order for a Black MSB Reference DAC to mate with my S202 amp.

    Sincerely,

    B XXXXXXXXXX
    System #1................................................ System #2

    ROON Nucleus + server ...............................SME 20/3A
    MSB Reference DAC / V2 Renderer ...............SME V arm
    VAC Signature MkII SE Preamp .....................Dynavector TE Kaitora Rua
    MSB S202 Stereo Amp.................. ..... Sutherland current gain phono stage, Phono loco
    Wilson Audio Sasha II................................ Stenheim Alumime Three
    REL G1 Mk II (pair) Subs............................ Bricasti M1 SE DAC
    Transparent Audio Gen 5 Reference........... T+A PA3000HV Integrated

    [

  2. #2
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    I have dealt with Vince 7 plus years ago in my MSB days and his customer support back then was A1.
    Gryphon Essence stereo amp and preamp/dac Hurricane power cords
    Fyne Audio F1-10, Lumin T2, Moon 260 Transport
    Shunyata Research Everest, Sigma V2 XC,
    Shunyata Research Sigma USB and Ethernet
    Argento Audio speaker cables and interconnects

  3. #3
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Couldnít agree more on both accounts!

  4. #4
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Congratulations
    Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.

    Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE

    NAD C 658 streamer.

    First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)

    Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.

    Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.

  5. #5
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    I have always received nothing but great service from Vince.

    I remember once a friend of mine sent a transport which needed a laser replacement. Not only it came back working as new, but MSB had replaced the whole front panel that had a huge scratch on it. After sending it to MSB, he wished he asked for the quote for the new front panel as well. Imagine his surprise when not only he got his transport working again, but it was also looking like new and MSB didn't charge him a single dollar ! That was beyond outstanding service.
    Adam

    Speakers: Magico M3
    Amp: Dagostino Momentum Stereo
    Digital: Lampi Pacific + Lampi DSD Komputer
    Cables: AQ WEL Signature IC / Synergistic Research Foundation / AQ Hurricane PCs

  6. #6

    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Vince is one of the few in this business who knows how to take care of his customers

    One other owns this website
    "We all know real when we hear it"

  7. #7
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingsrule View Post
    Vince is one of the few in this business who knows how to take care of his customers

    One other owns this website
    My experience also.

    Cincy
    Wadax Reference DAC and Server
    Block Audio Line Stage and PreAmp
    Woo Audio WA33 Elite Headphone Amp
    Viva Egoista STX Headphone Amp
    Transparent Opus Gen6 XLR interconnects
    Shunyata Sigma QR-s power cords
    Shunyata Everest power conditioner
    Audeze, Abyss, HiFiman and Stax headphones

  8. #8
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Bill - Have you received your Reference?
    _______________

    Mike

    Amplification: MBL 6010D, MBL 9008A Monos
    Analog: Kuzma R, Kuzma 4Point (11Ē), MSL Ultra Eminent EX
    Phono Pre: Pass XP-27
    Digital: Esoteric N01XD Esoteric K05
    Speakers: MBL 101E MKII
    Subwoofers: REL Carbon Specials
    Conditioner: Shunyata Triton 3
    Power Cables: Shunyata Sigma 1 & 2, Alpha 2, Delta and Venom
    ICs and SCs: Wireworld Platinum 8
    Rack: Artesania Exoteryc

  9. #9
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritmo View Post
    Bill - Have you received your Reference?
    Yes after waiting nearly 6 weeks on a 3 week delivery commitment I finally received it yesterday. During my wait I had some members private message me asking about performance/ Home Theater Bypass and such . I am going to wait for 7 days of continuous running for at least some break-in before responding publicly or privately. Thanks for asking
    System #1................................................ System #2

    ROON Nucleus + server ...............................SME 20/3A
    MSB Reference DAC / V2 Renderer ...............SME V arm
    VAC Signature MkII SE Preamp .....................Dynavector TE Kaitora Rua
    MSB S202 Stereo Amp.................. ..... Sutherland current gain phono stage, Phono loco
    Wilson Audio Sasha II................................ Stenheim Alumime Three
    REL G1 Mk II (pair) Subs............................ Bricasti M1 SE DAC
    Transparent Audio Gen 5 Reference........... T+A PA3000HV Integrated

    [

  10. #10
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Congrats Bill on the new Reference DAC! I bet it sounds wonderful with the S202 amplifier. Are you still using the Roon Nucleus + with the Renderer V2 digital input module and are you planning on continuing to do so?

    I think of switching to the Pro USB module every so often but my current setup sounds so good, works so well and allows me to control the volume from my IPad, that I donít really want to change it.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  11. #11
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    Congrats Bill on the new Reference DAC! I bet it sounds wonderful with the S202 amplifier. Are you still using the Roon Nucleus + with the Renderer V2 digital input module and are you planning on continuing to do so?

    I think of switching to the Pro USB module every so often but my current setup sounds so good, works so well and allows me to control the volume from my IPad, that I donít really want to change it.

    Ken
    Ken,
    Yes still using with Roon Nucleus + with the Renderer V2 digital input module. Like you I am finding nothing wanting. The ROON Nucleus + to my understanding was designed to sit on the network and its USB not optimal. I'm letting the Reference DAC play 24/7 and taking notes to later provide a Mini review of my experience. Some of what I read here on Audio Shark helped drive my decision to acquire the new DAC so perhaps I can add additional insight as well.
    System #1................................................ System #2

    ROON Nucleus + server ...............................SME 20/3A
    MSB Reference DAC / V2 Renderer ...............SME V arm
    VAC Signature MkII SE Preamp .....................Dynavector TE Kaitora Rua
    MSB S202 Stereo Amp.................. ..... Sutherland current gain phono stage, Phono loco
    Wilson Audio Sasha II................................ Stenheim Alumime Three
    REL G1 Mk II (pair) Subs............................ Bricasti M1 SE DAC
    Transparent Audio Gen 5 Reference........... T+A PA3000HV Integrated

    [

  12. #12
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Billt1 View Post
    Ken,
    Yes still using with Roon Nucleus + with the Renderer V2 digital input module. Like you I am finding nothing wanting. The ROON Nucleus + to my understanding was designed to sit on the network and its USB not optimal. I'm letting the Reference DAC play 24/7 and taking notes to later provide a Mini review of my experience. Some of what I read here on Audio Shark helped drive my decision to acquire the new DAC so perhaps I can add additional insight as well.
    Hello Bill,
    Can you please give some updates on your MSB Reference DAC and Roon Nucleus+ combo with the MSB S202? Are you still using the Nucleus+ with the Renderer V2 input?
    I am having the MSB Reference DAC with Roon Core server running on a NUC11 to a Pro USB-ISL input.
    Would appreciate very much to hear from your experience.

    MK

  13. #13
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    How do you run Roon on NUC 11-gen ? Did you instal Linux or Windows ?
    Adam

    Speakers: Magico M3
    Amp: Dagostino Momentum Stereo
    Digital: Lampi Pacific + Lampi DSD Komputer
    Cables: AQ WEL Signature IC / Synergistic Research Foundation / AQ Hurricane PCs

  14. #14
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    ...works so well and allows me to control the volume from my IPad..
    What happens if by accident you sit on the iPad, do you get a Vol+ runaway and blow up a speaker?

    I'm paranoid about that happening after previous misadventure. The only way I control volume is to rotate the volume knob on the pre-amp by hand.
    Speakers: Magico M3,ACC, S-SUB | Electronics: Esoteric Grandioso | Amplification: Halcro |
    Analog cables: Crystal Cable | Digital cables: Shunyata Sigma | Rack: YG Acoustics Rack 1.4
    and Rack 1.1 amp stands (pair) | Source: Kaleidescape Premiere

    On order: Esoteric Grandioso D1X.
    On wish list: Shunyata Research Everest.
    On sale: Everything!

  15. #15
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Elberoth View Post
    How do you run Roon on NUC 11-gen ? Did you instal Linux or Windows ?
    I installed Linux Ubuntu on NUC11 i5 with 16GB RAM and 500 GB SSD to run Roon Core server. Can't install Roon ROCK on a NUC11.

  16. #16
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Do you run it headless ? Can it even be run headless ? Does the install require periodic maintenance, which would require connecting a monitor and mouse/keyboard ?
    Adam

    Speakers: Magico M3
    Amp: Dagostino Momentum Stereo
    Digital: Lampi Pacific + Lampi DSD Komputer
    Cables: AQ WEL Signature IC / Synergistic Research Foundation / AQ Hurricane PCs

  17. #17
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    I run an MSB Reference DAC (inspired by this thread) off an Antipodes K50- Roon as Server, Squeeze or HQPlayer as Player.
    Sounds f a b

  18. #18
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Elberoth View Post
    Do you run it headless ? Can it even be run headless ? Does the install require periodic maintenance, which would require connecting a monitor and mouse/keyboard ?
    Yes, it is headless. No maintenance required, but you have to set the Roon apps to auto update so that when there is an update released by Roon it will automatically be updated.
    I just left the NUC11 connected to the ProUSB in a closet, and run a 25m fiber cable to the Reference DAC in the listening room. The NUC is connected by an ethernet cable directly to the Modem/Router provided by the Internet Fiber broadband service provider in order to achieve an Ethernet connection which is as short as possible!

  19. #19
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by ICUToo View Post
    I run an MSB Reference DAC (inspired by this thread) off an Antipodes K50- Roon as Server, Squeeze or HQPlayer as Player.
    Sounds f a b
    The Antipodes K50 is a great server/player and I have been looking at it, but unfortunately it is an expensive server! Have you used any other server before the K50? Are you using the Pro USB-ISL interface only or you have other digital inputs?
    The Roon server with Squeezelite player will be a perfect combination according to many users.

  20. #20
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by ICUToo View Post
    I run an MSB Reference DAC (inspired by this thread)..
    Much inspiration can be found within here. I thought about MSB, I heard a fully optioned MSB Select 2, but in the end I decided to stay with Esoteric. You can't go wrong with either.
    Speakers: Magico M3,ACC, S-SUB | Electronics: Esoteric Grandioso | Amplification: Halcro |
    Analog cables: Crystal Cable | Digital cables: Shunyata Sigma | Rack: YG Acoustics Rack 1.4
    and Rack 1.1 amp stands (pair) | Source: Kaleidescape Premiere

    On order: Esoteric Grandioso D1X.
    On wish list: Shunyata Research Everest.
    On sale: Everything!

  21. #21
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by brodricj View Post
    What happens if by accident you sit on the iPad, do you get a Vol+ runaway and blow up a speaker?

    I'm paranoid about that happening after previous misadventure. The only way I control volume is to rotate the volume knob on the pre-amp by hand.
    There is a maximum volume setting in the Roon Interface that prevents just this sort of catastrophe. I set mine at a very safe level.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  22. #22

    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    RTFM.......
    "We all know real when we hear it"

  23. #23
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    Congrats Bill on the new Reference DAC! I bet it sounds wonderful with the S202 amplifier. Are you still using the Roon Nucleus + with the Renderer V2 digital input module and are you planning on continuing to do so?

    I think of switching to the Pro USB module every so often but my current setup sounds so good, works so well and allows me to control the volume from my IPad, that I donít really want to change it.

    Ken
    Hello Ken,
    Have you tried the Pro USB-ISL to your Select II with your Nucleus+? Your MSB Transport is already using the Pro ISL already?
    Thanks.
    MK

  24. #24
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Hi MK,

    No, I have not tried the Pro USB digital input module with my Select II DAC, as I am quite satisfied with the Roon Nucleus Plus/Renderer V2 network solution. My transport uses the previous Pro I2S connection, not the Pro ISL utilized with the Select and Reference transports.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  25. #25
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    Hi MK,

    No, I have not tried the Pro USB digital input module with my Select II DAC, as I am quite satisfied with the Roon Nucleus Plus/Renderer V2 network solution. My transport uses the previous Pro I2S connection, not the Pro ISL utilized with the Select and Reference transports.

    Ken
    Thanks Ken,
    I am using a dedicated NUC11 with Roon Core server to MSB Reference DAC's Pro USB-ISL modules input. I am wondering how much performance improvement can be had with an expensive Server/Player with USB output to the Pro USB-ISL interface? The USB data stream from a server will anyway be processed by the Pro USB module and converted to optical signal which will be clocked and Synchronised with the Femto 33 clock in the DAC for transmission to the ProISL input.
    I will soon try to audition an Antipodes K21 or K50 server and compare the sound quality improvements.

    MK

  26. #26
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by MusangKing View Post
    Thanks Ken,
    I am using a dedicated NUC11 with Roon Core server to MSB Reference DAC's Pro USB-ISL modules input. I am wondering how much performance improvement can be had with an expensive Server/Player with USB output to the Pro USB-ISL interface? The USB data stream from a server will anyway be processed by the Pro USB module and converted to optical signal which will be clocked and Synchronised with the Femto 33 clock in the DAC for transmission to the ProISL input.
    I will soon try to audition an Antipodes K21 or K50 server and compare the sound quality improvements.

    MK
    Some of the USB output audiophile servers are most impressive (e.g. Aurender N20, N30SA and Taiko Extreme). However, they are exponentially more expensive than my Roon Nucleus Plus.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  27. #27
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Yes, the Taiko Extreme, Aurender N20, Antipodes Oladra or K50, Wadax Reference Streamers/Servers are expensive and may not justify the incremental improvements over a Roon Nucleus Plus or dedicated NUC with Roon Core when used with a MSB Pro USB-ISL interface. With the other digital inputs like AES, it may prove more significant improvements.

  28. #28
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by MusangKing View Post
    Yes, the Taiko Extreme, Aurender N20, Antipodes Oladra or K50, Wadax Reference Streamers/Servers are expensive and may not justify the incremental improvements over a Roon Nucleus Plus or dedicated NUC with Roon Core when used with a MSB Pro USB-ISL interface. With the other digital inputs like AES, it may prove more significant improvements.
    Hi MK,

    The preferred connection between Aurender N20, N30SA, W20SE and Taiko Extreme, and MSB Select II and Reference is Pro USB/Pro ISL. However, MSBís new Digital Director significantly levels the playing field between the various connections. Dual AES is the preferred connection between these audiophile servers and DCS DACs.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  29. #29
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Hi Ken,
    Are you considering the Digital Director or an expensive Server upgrade?

  30. #30
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by MusangKing View Post
    Hi Ken,
    Are you considering the Digital Director or an expensive Server upgrade?
    No, Iím quite satisfied with the sound quality of my current setup.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  31. #31

    Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    No, Iím quite satisfied with the sound quality of my current setup.

    Ken
    Hi Ken,
    Glad to hear that. Thatís what really matters. Not how much money you spend or if you have the flavor of the month. Itís a very personal hobby and as long as you get full satisfaction out of your system every time you turn it on, one needs not answer to anybody.

    I must say though that your system is endgame system for most audiophiles.

  32. #32

    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpinist View Post
    Hi MK,

    The preferred connection between Aurender N20, N30SA, W20SE and Taiko Extreme, and MSB Select II and Reference is Pro USB/Pro ISL. However, MSBís new Digital Director significantly levels the playing field between the various connections. Dual AES is the preferred connection between these audiophile servers and DCS DACs.

    Ken
    Ken

    How do u know the DD levels the playing field between various connections?

    Have u heard the DD? As far as I can ascertain no one outside of MSB has heard it......
    "We all know real when we hear it"

  33. #33
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    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingsrule View Post
    Ken

    How do u know the DD levels the playing field between various connections?

    Have u heard the DD? As far as I can ascertain no one outside of MSB has heard it......
    I should have wrote according to MSB. Good catch.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000ís with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  34. #34

    Re: Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

    Gotta keep you on your toes my friend!!!!
    "We all know real when we hear it"

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Reference DAC ordered / MSB Service

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