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  1. #1
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    Software Shootout!

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  2. #2
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Mike could you list what three software options are in each video please?
    Marty

  3. #3
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    Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by nc42acc View Post
    Mike could you list what three software options are in each video please?
    Marty, it’s in the description in each video. Full details.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

    "We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."

    Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Avantgarde Acoustics, Avid HiFi, Berkeley Audio Design, Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Chord, Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, FirstWatt, Focal Headphones, Franco Serblin Loudspeakers, Furutech, Fyne Audio Loudspeakers, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Koetsu Cartridges, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Naim Audio, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, SimAudio, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, Vivid Audio Loudspeakers, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.

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  4. #4
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Sorry about that. I see now. What option did you think sounded best?
    Marty

  5. #5
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    the naim stack looks cool. very tidy, no messing around.
    2x phoenixNET--linn klimax dsm---humboldt--heisenberg--sabrinaX
    everest, odin, delta2nr, omega, wilson pedestal, bfly rose, smt wings

  6. #6
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    IMHO:
    Part 1: balanced, warm side of neutral tonal, engaging sound.
    Part 2: neutral tonal, a little bit more detailed, less engaging
    Part 3: sounds big an bold, voice is emphasised and attacking.

    My choice is part 1, then 2 and 3.
    In term of sq, roon is not on par with some other softwares, but maybe the Taiko server is too good and customized for roon which makes the sound best of the shootout.

  7. #7
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    My take:

    1. Has glare and digital sounds
    2. Smooth, organic and natural
    3. Pretty damn good and close to 2, but not as smooth, natural.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

    "We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."

    Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Avantgarde Acoustics, Avid HiFi, Berkeley Audio Design, Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Chord, Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, FirstWatt, Focal Headphones, Franco Serblin Loudspeakers, Furutech, Fyne Audio Loudspeakers, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Koetsu Cartridges, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Naim Audio, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, SimAudio, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, Vivid Audio Loudspeakers, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.

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  8. #8
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Mike..agree completely your 'take'..would choose to listen to # 2. Sounds very tube like..like from a great SET.
    Listening Room: 25' L x 18' W x 23' H..system on the long wall
    Speakers: Tidal 'Contriva Diacera-SE
    Amps: Chalice Audio 'Grail' SET mono blocks with Psvane WE 845 / 300b tubes
    Source: Lumin X-1 Network Music Player
    HighFidelity MC-1 Pro Helix conditioner
    Cables:
    LessLoss C-MARC RCA interconnect
    SilverSmith 'Fidelium' speaker cables
    Silent Source 'Music Reference' Power Cords x 3
    Innuos 'PhoenixNet' Switch

    Sablon Ethernet cable
    Audioquest 'FogLifters' under the Fidelium cables
    Arya Audio-RevOpods under my Tidal Speakers
    REL 212 SE Subwoofer x 2
    EtherREGEN/ Keces PSU / WireWorld 'Starlight'
    Ethernet cable
    EVP Isolation footers- subs-speakers- Lumin


    Tweaks:
    Stillpoints Ultra SS under amps
    EVP HDR isolators 2" x 8...under my Lumin A1 and PSU
    EVP HDR isolators 4" x 16..under my Tidal speakers and my REL 212 SE subs

  9. #9
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by nc42acc View Post
    Sorry about that. I see now. What option did you think sounded best?
    #2, but #3 was good.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

    "We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."

    Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Avantgarde Acoustics, Avid HiFi, Berkeley Audio Design, Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Chord, Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, FirstWatt, Focal Headphones, Franco Serblin Loudspeakers, Furutech, Fyne Audio Loudspeakers, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Koetsu Cartridges, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Naim Audio, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, SimAudio, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, Vivid Audio Loudspeakers, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.

    https://suncoastaudio.com/
    Phone: 941-932-0282
    Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/

  10. #10
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Listened several times. My comments similar to Mike's. Hard for me to choose between 2 & 3. I thought 2 slightly more natural, 3 more dynamic (regardless of settings, 3 seemed a tad louder to me). I'd want to hear these with my preferred music (classical).

  11. #11
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    I look forward to hearing the ROON v Naim software comparo tomorrow.
    Sonus Faber Stradivari, Bricasti M21 & M28 Monos, Silenzio by E - Silent PC Media Server w/JCat NET Card XE & HD Plex 300 LPSU, GigaFoil v4, Keces P3, Supra Cat 8+ and Revelation Audio Ethernet cables, JL Audio CR-1 crossover, 2 X F-113v2 subwoofer, Shunyata Denali 6000/S v2, Sigma XC V2, 2 X Alpha v2 NR PCs,ADDPowr Wizard and 2 X ElektraClear EAU, PS Audio Power Ports and Noise Harvesters, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 8 Speaker cables, Silver 7 Eclipse 7 ICs, Vicoustic, GIK & Stillpoint Room treatment, Stillpoint Minis and Ultra SS, Three dedicated 20 Amp lines, Adona 5 Shelf rack

  12. #12
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Replacing ROON with the TAS beta player was eye opening! It was clearly better than ROON and as if someone had removed a large sheet of fabric and glare from the sound stage. Taiko are clearly onto something.

    I almost wish I hadn’t heard that!
    Sonus Faber Stradivari, Bricasti M21 & M28 Monos, Silenzio by E - Silent PC Media Server w/JCat NET Card XE & HD Plex 300 LPSU, GigaFoil v4, Keces P3, Supra Cat 8+ and Revelation Audio Ethernet cables, JL Audio CR-1 crossover, 2 X F-113v2 subwoofer, Shunyata Denali 6000/S v2, Sigma XC V2, 2 X Alpha v2 NR PCs,ADDPowr Wizard and 2 X ElektraClear EAU, PS Audio Power Ports and Noise Harvesters, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 8 Speaker cables, Silver 7 Eclipse 7 ICs, Vicoustic, GIK & Stillpoint Room treatment, Stillpoint Minis and Ultra SS, Three dedicated 20 Amp lines, Adona 5 Shelf rack

  13. #13

    Re: Software Shootout!

    Check out HQPlayer if possible, upsampled / filtered or not and stand - alone is excellent. ROON smears the sound and yields a bit less detail. ROON with HQplayer back end is in the middle (better than ROON stand - alone but worse than HQPlayer stand - alone). Install HQPlayer in memory and playing songs from memory is the best IMO. It makes ROON stand - alone sound like MP3s in comparison. TAS beta started with HQplayer I believe and may still implement it, or at least offer it as an option.
    4x20A circuits | Audioquest Niagara 3000 | Music Server with HDplex HD500 and Paul Hynes SR4T LPSUs, Roon, Tidal, Qobuz | Aqua Acoustic Quality LinQ Network Interface | Aqua Acoustic Quality Formula xHD Rev. 2 DAC | Purity Audio Silver Statement preamp | Audionet Max monoblock amps | Vivid Audio Giya G2 Series 2 | 4 JL Audio Fathoms | Echole ICs and SCs, Shunyata PCs | Stillpoints -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers, subs | Custom Baltic birch rack + amp stands| Fully treated + dedicated 2 channel room

  14. #14

    Re: Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by sb6 View Post
    Check out HQPlayer if possible, upsampled / filtered or not and stand - alone is excellent. ROON smears the sound and yields a bit less detail. ROON with HQplayer back end is in the middle (better than ROON stand - alone but worse than HQPlayer stand - alone). Install HQPlayer in memory and playing songs from memory is the best IMO. It makes ROON stand - alone sound like MP3s in comparison. TAS beta started with HQplayer I believe and may still implement it, or at least offer it as an option.
    Interesting. I have been using HQPlayer (with FIR and room correction filters) almost since the time that I subscribed to Roon ( I don't recall using Roon by itself). I really like what HQPlayer can do.

  15. #15
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    I have tried to get HQ Player to work but have figured out I must have my Win7 PC connected via USB to my DAC for it to work. Since I sold all my USB cables and only use a Network connection from my ROOn core that is 40’ away, I don’t have an easy way to get HQ Player to work.
    Sonus Faber Stradivari, Bricasti M21 & M28 Monos, Silenzio by E - Silent PC Media Server w/JCat NET Card XE & HD Plex 300 LPSU, GigaFoil v4, Keces P3, Supra Cat 8+ and Revelation Audio Ethernet cables, JL Audio CR-1 crossover, 2 X F-113v2 subwoofer, Shunyata Denali 6000/S v2, Sigma XC V2, 2 X Alpha v2 NR PCs,ADDPowr Wizard and 2 X ElektraClear EAU, PS Audio Power Ports and Noise Harvesters, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 8 Speaker cables, Silver 7 Eclipse 7 ICs, Vicoustic, GIK & Stillpoint Room treatment, Stillpoint Minis and Ultra SS, Three dedicated 20 Amp lines, Adona 5 Shelf rack

  16. #16

    Re: Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by crwilli View Post
    I have tried to get HQ Player to work but have figured out I must have my Win7 PC connected via USB to my DAC for it to work. Since I sold all my USB cables and only use a Network connection from my ROOn core that is 40’ away, I don’t have an easy way to get HQ Player to work.
    If all that you are missing is a USB cable, check out BJC or Monoprice. They have well-built, inexpensive USB cables for you to try out.
    I am now in the process of figuring out my hardware needs so that I can run ALL of my music through HQ Player (that includes Spotify, plus all my analog music by using an ADC converter).

    Once Spotify goes CD-quality, if I can play Spotify through HQPlayer and upsample everything to whatever I want, it would be awesome.

  17. #17
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    I need an 10 meter usb. Not happening.
    Sonus Faber Stradivari, Bricasti M21 & M28 Monos, Silenzio by E - Silent PC Media Server w/JCat NET Card XE & HD Plex 300 LPSU, GigaFoil v4, Keces P3, Supra Cat 8+ and Revelation Audio Ethernet cables, JL Audio CR-1 crossover, 2 X F-113v2 subwoofer, Shunyata Denali 6000/S v2, Sigma XC V2, 2 X Alpha v2 NR PCs,ADDPowr Wizard and 2 X ElektraClear EAU, PS Audio Power Ports and Noise Harvesters, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 8 Speaker cables, Silver 7 Eclipse 7 ICs, Vicoustic, GIK & Stillpoint Room treatment, Stillpoint Minis and Ultra SS, Three dedicated 20 Amp lines, Adona 5 Shelf rack

  18. #18
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by crwilli View Post
    I need an 10 meter usb. Not happening.
    This is one of the things I really like about the MSB DACs. With their Pro USB Digital Input Module, only a short USB cable is required. The rest of the run to the DAC is accomplished with an optical cable. This run can be as long as you want with minimal cost and no sonic degradation.

    Ken
    "No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
    --------------------------------------------
    Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
    Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
    Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
    Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000’s with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords

  19. #19
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    I need an 10 meter usb. Not happening.
    Sonus Faber Stradivari, Bricasti M21 & M28 Monos, Silenzio by E - Silent PC Media Server w/JCat NET Card XE & HD Plex 300 LPSU, GigaFoil v4, Keces P3, Supra Cat 8+ and Revelation Audio Ethernet cables, JL Audio CR-1 crossover, 2 X F-113v2 subwoofer, Shunyata Denali 6000/S v2, Sigma XC V2, 2 X Alpha v2 NR PCs,ADDPowr Wizard and 2 X ElektraClear EAU, PS Audio Power Ports and Noise Harvesters, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 8 Speaker cables, Silver 7 Eclipse 7 ICs, Vicoustic, GIK & Stillpoint Room treatment, Stillpoint Minis and Ultra SS, Three dedicated 20 Amp lines, Adona 5 Shelf rack

  20. #20

    Re: Software Shootout!

    Quote Originally Posted by crwilli View Post
    I need an 10 meter usb. Not happening.
    That’s long. Of course the best solution is to get the devices closer together but I presume that this is not possible. But you could use an active USB extension cable for that length.

  21. #21
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    Re: Software Shootout!

    I appreciate this post Mike. It has challenged my belief and past tests that seemed to indicate I would notice little if any difference in fidelity between the Naim streaming app and Roon. I am a huge fan of Roon, with the ease of use, the meta data, the DSP/EQ ability as well as the ability to group multiple RAAT devices. This allows me to group my BSN2i along with my NDX 2 to have multi room playback both in my home theater (BSN2i connected to Anthem AVM60 + 5.4.4 Atmos) and my main 2 channel system as well as the rest of the home (couple of Muso QB2s and a Muso 2).

    All that being said I have not done a listening comparison on my main 2 channel rig with just Roon vs Naim app since upgrading my PrimaLuna separates.

    With the PrimaLuna Evo 300 preamp and mono blocks paired with the Rivals and NDX2, this is probably the most resolving system I have had in my home, which includes Luxman gear and Chord HMS+HTT2. I have KT 150s in all the amps as well as Brimar CV4003s in all gain positions and a pair of Phillips rectifier tubes in the preamp. All gear is on Symposium Ultra platforms and my streaming gear is on a Naim Fraim. Very supple and yet very sensitive and revealing pairing with the Volti Rivals.

    Anyway since doing this experiment a few days ago I have been listening to only the Naim app (which limits me to my Qobuz streaming titles as all my digital files are on the Roon Core on my Innuos Zen III). I definitely can tell that there is an increase in detail, resolution, and separation when listening through the Naim app. As I said, I never noticed this before with doing shootouts when I was running the Supernait 3 but it is definitely noticeable with the PrimaLuna tube gear.

    I guess the question is if I want to sacrifice the utility of Roon and the EQ settings I am using (which gives a little warmer bump around 52Hz) in order for that boost in resolution and space. I am not going down the HQPlayer road, etc… because all my files are on the Innuos server… and I am not sure if I want to convert my Innuos to a UPnP server rather than a Roon Core, but if I want to hear my hundreds of other albums in the Naim app I guess I would have to do that.

    The only drawback for me besides the DSP of Roon is the familiarity I have with the playlists/queuing functions etc. I have yet to find a streaming app that is as simple to use for queuing on the fly playlists as Roon. If you are the type to listen only to entire albums that is not a problem, but I definitely build playlists for every listening session and it is not as intuitive on the Naim app as the Roon app.
    PRIMARY 2 CH SYSTEM: PrimaLuna Evo 300 Preamp; PrimaLuna Evo 300 Monoblocks (2); Naim NDX 2; XPS DR; Innuos Zen MK III (Roon Core); EtherRegen; Volti Audio Rivals; JL Audio d110 (2); Transparent Super Speaker Cables; Transparent Super interconnects; Transparent Premium & High Performance power cables; Naim Fraim; Stillpoints Ultra Minis; IsoTek EVO3 Sigmas conditioner; GIK Acoustics absorption and diffusion panels

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