Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE preamp !

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 02:24 PM

With the prodding of a few members here and great reviews, I was able to locate a gently used STP-SE. It arrived today and I had a few minutes to hook it up before I left for work.

Wow! What a great preamp. I need the amps to warm up and it to settle down from being tossed around by UPS, but so far it's outstanding. I am a little embarrassed to say, but it feels way more substantial and heavier than I expected. Fit and finish is superb. I guess the photos do not do it justice.

I am so looking forward to listening when I get home tonight.

Well done Wyred!

More to come.......

**Mrppv** · September 2, 2016, 02:37 PM

Looking forward to more impressions, and also how it compares to others you've had, such as the Ayre KX-5 twenty.

Does it have either stage 1 or 2 upgrades?

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 02:56 PM

It's a standard STP-SE. I was thinking about doing the upgrades but not sure how much better it gets. Just thinking about diminishing returns but we'll see.

An easy sale for the KX-5 twenty came along and I sold it in anticipation of getting the KX-R twenty. I am kicking myself now because I realize just how good it sounded. While I am sure the KX-R twenty is stunning, it will take a lot more money to acquire and I think the KX-5 twenty was more than good enough for me.

So far the STP-SE is impressive.

Originally Posted by Mrppv

Looking forward to more impressions, and also how it compares to others you've had, such as the Ayre KX-5 twenty.

Does it have either stage 1 or 2 upgrades?

**mep** · September 2, 2016, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

It's a standard STP-SE. I was thinking about doing the upgrades but not sure how much better it gets. Just thinking about diminishing returns but we'll see.

An easy sale for the KX-5 twenty came along and I sold it in anticipation of getting the KX-R twenty. I am kicking myself now because I realize just how good it sounded. While I am sure the KX-R twenty is stunning, it will take a lot more money to acquire and I think the KX-5 twenty was more than good enough for me.

So far the STP-SE is impressive.

Joe-You must be permanently bruised from all of the ass-kickings you have given yourself for selling gear that you didn't realize how good it was until it was gone.

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 05:01 PM

I am, wanna see?

**CPP** · September 2, 2016, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

With the prodding of a few members here and great reviews, I was able to locate a gently used STP-SE. It arrived today and I had a few minutes to hook it up before I left for work.

Wow! What a great preamp. I need the amps to warm up and it to settle down from being tossed around by UPS, but so far it's outstanding. I am a little embarrassed to say, but it feels way more substantial and heavier than I expected. Fit and finish is superb. I guess the photos do not do it justice.

I am so looking forward to listening when I get home tonight.

Well done Wyred!

More to come.......

Enjoy Joe,

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 05:57 PM

Thank you Chris. I'm glad I listened to you guys.

Originally Posted by CPP

Enjoy Joe,

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 06:34 PM

All I have to say is the guy who gave up this STP-SE must have had a screw loose

**the professor** · September 2, 2016, 06:40 PM

Nope

Originally Posted by joeinid

I am, wanna see?

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 06:42 PM

Hahahahahaha!

**mep** · September 2, 2016, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

All I have to say is the guy who gave up this STP-SE must have had a screw loose

Ha! Now that's funny and ironic at the same time.

**mep** · September 2, 2016, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

I am, wanna see?

Uh, no.

**joeinid** · September 2, 2016, 07:51 PM

It is, isn't it.

Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk

**joeinid** · September 4, 2016, 11:42 AM

I found a review of the Wyred STP-SE and posted a paragraph below. It's from David Abramson of Stereotimes. From my standpoint, it's accurate.

http://www.stereotimes.com/amp082912.shtml

"I suppose what struck me as especially ‘special’ about the STP-SE is that it seemed utterly transparent, while at the same time giving you a spacious, slightly warm and cavernous perspective on the musical proceedings at hand. As a matter of fact, it seemed as though the STP-SE was sort of a hybrid of another sort; kind of like a cross between a great tubed pre and well, a great passive. All the details were there—but there was none of the passive-like passivity; the dynamic lethargy or sterility. There was also that wonderful bass depth and cavernous, airy soundstage with a mid row perspective and a touch o’ warmth—like a great tube pre."

**CPP** · September 4, 2016, 12:06 PM

Joe you need to run your Lumin through STP via the xlr's, its really nice.

**joeinid** · September 4, 2016, 12:11 PM

Hi Chris,

That's what I am doing now. And, it's fabulous. Holy cow! I'm using Siltech and Kimber cables into the Ayre MXR-20's and it's utterly amazing. Love these amps, and the STP-SE does a superb job.

Originally Posted by CPP

Joe you need to run your Lumin through STP via the xlr's, its really nice.

**Jack** · September 4, 2016, 09:47 PM

Congrats Joe. Sorry I'm late to the party, but we just got internet service back about 8:00 pm. I listening to mine now with the Kismet amp and I agree it is just like David described it.

**joeinid** · September 4, 2016, 10:56 PM

Thanks Jack. I smile thinking about what it cost vs how good it sounds. You're right about there being bargain priced gear out there that performs well above its price. We just need to find it and enjoy it.

Originally Posted by Jack

Congrats Joe. Sorry I'm late to the party, but we just got internet service back about 8:00 pm. I listening to mine now with the Kismet amp and I agree it is just like David described it.

**Jack** · September 4, 2016, 11:15 PM

It will get better the longer it is powered up. There are plenty of the "little guys" out there you just have to look for them. Be interested to see what you think of the W4S with the Nords.

**Mrppv** · September 9, 2016, 04:45 PM

Joe- have you listened enough to draw any conclusions? Is it a keeper, or do you still miss the Ayre?

**joeinid** · September 9, 2016, 05:11 PM

It's outstanding. Maybe it's a little flat at 6 or below on the volume scale. At my normal listening levels which can be 7 or above (more likely 15-16) and typically 30 maximum on the read out, I absolutely LOVE, LOVE, LOVE it. Slightly sweet, more depth and width than I ever expected which is tremendous. An absolute keeper. This piece is such a home run that I just can not believe how good it sounds.

I only miss the Ayre because it cost more (I know, very shallow), but the Ayre felt a little more energetic at lower volumes and maybe a little more forward. At times, that's a good thing, but not always.

Overall, the STP-SE stands well on its own and is not embarrassed by the more expensive preamps out there. Mine is a keeper.

I am still trying to resist another preamp. I keep looking, don't know why. I am totally set in the amp department. I am a happy camper.

My ultimate goal was to match the Ayre KX-R Twenty with my MX-R Twenty amps. I am seriously now having a very difficult time justifying that kind of expenditure on a preamp.

Originally Posted by Mrppv

Joe- have you listened enough to draw any conclusions? Is it a keeper, or do you still miss the Ayre?

**Jack** · September 9, 2016, 05:43 PM

Joe

Did you try adjusting the output level on the Lumin like you did with the VAC to see if forcing you into a higher range on the volume control might resolve the flatness?

**joeinid** · September 9, 2016, 05:52 PM

I've left the volume on the Lumin set to its maximum. No, I have not lowered it on the Lumin, because actually 7 is pretty much the minimum I am using now and actually 10/11 for some of the background music, so I am fine that way. Once I hit 7, there's a noticeable difference and it just opens up and and becomes more present. I may experiment this weekend, but I know that Lumin does not really want you to decrease the output on the unit for better SQ. For now, the combo is wonderful.

Originally Posted by Jack

Joe

Did you try adjusting the output level on the Lumin like you did with the VAC to see if forcing you into a higher range on the volume control might resolve the flatness?

**Face** · September 9, 2016, 06:02 PM

I'm not sure if my stereo is even on at 7, lol.

**joeinid** · September 9, 2016, 06:14 PM

Ha!

I know, it's such a nit-picky thing but I don't mean it to be. At my real normal levels and above, it is absolutely amazing. I love it.

I am sort of thinking about the upgrades that Wyred offers for it and am very curious. I know about diminishing returns but it might be a fun and relatively painless experiment.

Originally Posted by Face

I'm not sure if my stereo is even on at 7, lol.

**Face** · September 9, 2016, 06:33 PM

I've really wanted to do those upgrades as well, but have too many other responsibilities at the moment.

**Mrppv** · September 9, 2016, 07:17 PM

I've been keeping an eye out for a used KX-5 twenty (they seem pretty rare), but man, maybe I should just order a STP-SE with one or both upgrades.

**joeinid** · September 9, 2016, 07:31 PM

No doubt that the KX-5 Twenty is outstanding but for less than half the price with level 2 upgrades, it's impossible to fault the STP-SE. My non upgraded STP-SE gives it, the Ayre, a run for the money. I am sure the choice of amp will make a difference, but for what I have, the STP-SE is a no brainer.

Originally Posted by Mrppv

I've been keeping an eye out for a used KX-5 twenty (they seem pretty rare), but man, maybe I should just order a STP-SE with one or both upgrades.

**Randy Myers** · September 10, 2016, 12:38 AM

I always set the outputs on the DAC and Spinner to -15 db. It gave the STP-SE much more flexibility and control over the volume.

**lowviz_mcc** · November 3, 2016, 12:17 PM

Hi Joe,

I'm thinking of upgrading my preamp & power amp. But having read your review on the STP-SE had boosted my confidence in keep my STP-SE and instead upgrading only my power amp.
With your extensive use of a vast array of power amps, would the STP-SE be a good match for the following amps:

Pass Labs X350.8, Accuphase A-70, P7300 & Hegel H30.

Thanks in advance.

Michael

**joeinid** · November 3, 2016, 03:58 PM

Hi Michael,

Welcome to the forum and thank you for joining.

Absolutely. The STP-SE is amazing. My only caveat would be that if you listen mainly to music at very low volumes, the STP-SE may sound a tiny bit hollow. Once I get above 7-8 on the volume scale and am normally at 15-25+ is sounds freaking awesome. I can easily use my STP-SE as my only preamp reference, it's that good.

**lowviz_mcc** · November 3, 2016, 11:39 PM

Hi Joe,

Thank you for your prompt reply.

I believe you owned the Hegel H30 for a while. Do you think H30 will have synergy with B&W 802 Diamond and STP-SE?

**joeinid** · November 4, 2016, 12:59 AM

Hi Michael,

I like a slightly softer/sweeter sound although the H30 balanced with the STP-SE could actually be a great combo. A friend who has and loves B&W speakers had a Classe amp with McIntosh preamp (?) and still talks fondly of that system. I am more of an Ayre/Pass Labs/PS Audio/Accuphase type of guy. If you can borrow an H30 to try with your STP-SE you might very well be surprised that the combo will actually be great. The STP-SE is smooth and slightly sweet as it is, so my gut tells me that it will be a great match. I don't know what your overall preference is but balance between them could be what you are looking for in your system.

**lowviz_mcc** · November 4, 2016, 01:17 AM

Hi Joe,

Like you, I also like softer/sweeter sound. Although I don't find my B&W 802D2 sounding bright at all with W4S ST-1000 mkII, I just find this pair to be lacking in the midrange and high band. However, I especially like the iron grip the ST-1000 mkII has on the bass response of B&W 802D2.

If I may ask, do you think if the new Pass Labs X350.8 is better matched? I also like the Accuphase A-70, but I worry that the 60W Class A may not be enough to drive the 802D2. What do you think?

Please enlighten.

Michael

**joeinid** · November 4, 2016, 01:29 AM

The Pass X350.8 is a SUPERB amp. Two friends own them and they are destination amps. Big 3D sound stage, depth and width with a wonderful tone. I'd pick the X350.8 in a heartbeat over the H30 to be honest. The Pass X350.8 is one of those amps that only come around once in a while. The funny thing is that they both came from H30's and now have the X350.8.

**lowviz_mcc** · November 4, 2016, 01:39 AM

Hi Joe,

Wow. Pass X350.8 will be high on my list. Thanks.

While on the subject of Pass, have you had any experiences comparing XP-30 or 20 to the STP--SE?

**joeinid** · November 4, 2016, 02:32 AM

I've owned the XP-10 once and the XP-30 twice. I personally am not a fan of the Pass preamps, but we have many here that love them. They were just too solid state sounding for my taste, if that makes any sense. There are many other preamps that I'd buy before them. Would you consider a tube preamp? I'd stay with the STP-SE for a while unless you've already narrowed down a choice or price range.

Originally Posted by lowviz_mcc

Hi Joe,

Wow. Pass X350.8 will be high on my list. Thanks.

While on the subject of Pass, have you had any experiences comparing XP-30 or 20 to the STP--SE?

**wklie** · November 4, 2016, 02:33 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

It's outstanding. Maybe it's a little flat at 6 or below on the volume scale. At my normal listening levels which can be 7 or above (more likely 15-16) and typically 30 maximum on the read out, I absolutely LOVE, LOVE, LOVE it.

I almost never drop below volume 10 (even for loud pop music) of STP-SE from Lumin XLR output. If you find that STP-SE is not as good at really low volume, perhaps lowering the Lumin volume a little, such that the STP-SE can be set at a moderate level may be better - this becomes a tradeoff of sound quality degradation at the source vs the pre-amp.

Since you're using Lumin S1, if you turn off the digital output, the Lumin volume will be using the 32-bit ESS volume that ESS is proud of and has a whitepaper to explain why it's so good:
http://www.esstech.com/files/3014/40...me-control.pdf

If you go with the STP-SE upgrades, be sure to check what volume levels they improve - I believe the low ranges of volumes are not upgraded by the better resistors that came with the Stage 1/2 upgrades.

In my region people don't know or don't care about the STP-SE - the guy I purchased my unit from had been trying to sell it for a year without success. My local W4S dealer also recently closed down its business...

**lowviz_mcc** · November 4, 2016, 02:43 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

I've owned the XP-10 once and the XP-30 twice. I personally am not a fan of the Pass preamps, but we have many here that love them. They were just too solid state sounding for my taste, if that makes any sense. There are many other preamps that I'd buy before them. Would you consider a tube preamp? I'd stay with the STP-SE for a while unless you've already narrowed down a choice or price range.

Hi Joe,

No, I don't prefer tube preamp. So I'll probably stick with my STP-SE.

Thank you so much for your knowledgeable advice. I'll let you know in due course.

Michael

**joeinid** · November 4, 2016, 02:50 AM

Hi Peter,

The STP-SE is outstanding and truly gets no respect. In my normal listening range, it's superb and a real window to the music. I may consider the upgrades next year just for the fun of it. I may be surprised but don't feel it will be a waste of money. I am glad you love yours and Lumin rocks. Looking forward to seeing more gear from you guys.

Hi Michael,

Are you in Hong Kong too? Wow! Very cool.

Once you hook up the STP-SE to a Pass X350.8, thoughts of other gear will go out the window. Concentrate on sources and other system upgrades and enjoy. Life is too short, enjoy the music.

**Randy Myers** · November 4, 2016, 09:06 AM

I loved the STP-SE when I owned one. But being that I am just starting out I am not able to keep multiple pieces, hence why I no longer have mine. From what I hear EJ's other line is very big in the far east. That line is the SST lineup. It appears as if W4S is bigger here in the states and SST (their step up line) is bigger in Asia, from what I have read...

**wklie** · November 7, 2016, 10:29 PM

With SST being the "step up line", it might mean Thoebe II is the step up from STP-SE, as reflected in the pricing. Although it gets a resistive ladder volume control, it is not a no-gain design. I'd argue that having no gain (for volume levels <=63 in usual setups) is the most distinctive feature of STP-SE, but Thoebe II is different in this respect.

**Randy Myers** · November 8, 2016, 12:31 AM

I was thinking about getting a Thoebe II, but just don't think I can afford one right now.

**Jack** · November 8, 2016, 12:38 AM

Randy

I think the Thoebe would have been a sideways step at best from the STP-SE and to get an all in one like you want in the Thoebe you would be looking at $4000. The STP and a different DAC would have been a better bet. Like Peter I think the Thoebe is different and not better.

**wklie** · November 8, 2016, 03:00 AM

Someone asked EJ Sarmento about the volume level sweet spot of STP-SE, and got this reply:

On every preamp, there are sweetspots and this is normally based on the signal integrity through the circuitry. On the STP, this sweetspot is quite large because of its’ design. You will notice that even at background levels, it will maintain proper image and staging. I can assure you that the majority of other preamps will not offer the same! Despite what I mention above, it is still natural to ‘prefer’ a certain level of any recording as certain instruments or vocals will achieve the desired prominence.

I would say that any setting from 13-63 would be beneficial and the higher the better because the signal would be more dominant with higher level. This doesn’t mean that lowering the level of the DAC would cause an improvement because the loss on the DAC side would be more significant to the gain on the preamp side (it would be a step backwards).

I interpret this as: from volume level 13 and up, it's not recommended to decrease the volume at the source digitally.

By the way, old forum posts said that the stage 2 upgrade improves volume (from?) above level 14.

**joeinid** · November 8, 2016, 08:49 AM

I'm still itching to send mine in for the upgrades. I'm sure that diminishing returns may apply because it's already outstanding. But, even taking it up a notch a little more could make it even more amazing.

**Randy Myers** · November 8, 2016, 09:48 AM

Originally Posted by Jack

Randy

I think the Thoebe would have been a sideways step at best from the STP-SE and to get an all in one like you want in the Thoebe you would be looking at $4000. The STP and a different DAC would have been a better bet. Like Peter I think the Thoebe is different and not better.

Hey Jack, This is also my dilemma...

For now I think the benchmark is outstanding, and honestly, with my other equipment and my old ears I doubt I could hear a difference anyway. All will probably be put on hold for now anyway, until after we make the move and get settled in. This will probably take some considerable time because we will have to wait for the house to be built...

**a.wayne** · November 8, 2016, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

I'm still itching to send mine in for the upgrades. I'm sure that diminishing returns may apply because it's already outstanding. But, even taking it up a notch a little more could make it even more amazing.

Send it in Joe , this way you can get another pre while its out ....

**joeinid** · November 8, 2016, 10:44 AM

Hahahahahahha, now that makes perfect sense. Thanks!

Originally Posted by a.wayne

Send it in Joe , this way you can get another pre while its out ....

**Randy Myers** · November 8, 2016, 11:23 AM

do it Joe.... do it....

Thread: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE preamp !

Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE preamp !

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