Thread: Just now purchased the ClearAudio Double Matrix Sonic

I Just now purchased the ClearAudio Double Matrix Sonic. It's on back order but I am told that one should arrive in the retailers inventory next week. I may get the unit in two weeks - I hope.

This now means I will own and regularly operate:

VPI HW27 Typhoon
Audio Desk Systeme
Klaudio
ClearAudio Double Matrix Sonic

I should be able to give some great cleaning machine reviews!

Originally Posted by MDP

Congrats David! I can't wait for your thoughts.

I'm still working on that review, BTW. I received a note [pointer] to run my experiment in reverse. That has taken a huge turn...and has made the writeup very long. Plus, I need to make sure that I am objective and state no biases. It's a lot of work!

Originally Posted by joeinid

... nice to finally see once and for all, the best cleaner.

lol.

Originally Posted by groovy

lol.

I'm looking at this and monks to add to my collection.

Originally Posted by Myles B. Astor

Don't take this the wrong way but don't you think you'd have better sound if instead the same money had been invested in a better table or cartridge?

Hi Myles.

I'm blessed and thankful to be in a place that I can afford to be a bit frivolous and you know, I'm just a plain-o'l dumb consumer. I'm nothing special and truth be told, I am rather unremarkable too. So, my views are coming from an average Joe...the consumer.

What I do have going for me is a passion for music and even more so, I am fixated on analog/vinyl. Above all things, I love records. Because I am just some average dude/nobody. I'd like to do something slightly interesting...at least once in my lifetime and that is to do this experiment. It's nothing more than pure pleasure and I get to share my experience here on the Shark.

...And just maybe...slight as it may be...maybe I will shed some light on something...or maybe not. But I am willing to take a risk and perhaps embarrass the heck out of myself but nevertheless, contribute something to this great community.

More importantly, through sharing, I will engage some conversation and I will learn from experts here...that is mutual sharing. Isn't that what its all about?

As for that better cartridge or turntable. I have a more than $4,000 Ortofon Windfeld and I am delighted with my ClearAudio/McIntosh MT10. I have no desire to upgrade.


- David

Originally Posted by Myles B. Astor

Yes there was a guy who did that too at G&A Records in NYC too. We used to joke what he spun his records on.

I remember at an early age my momma would say, "there's a bed for every butt". Myself, when on my own, a was ridiculously poor and I remember my first record player. Myles, I would have been one of those you laughed at, but it was all that I could afford...and I love records. Fast forward a few years, I have improved my system. But I have to say, being poor gave me a much richer experience because I cherished each and every note. I learned the gift of appreciation.

Today, when someone is experiencing joy, it's pandemic and I can't help but feel that great energy. It's awesome.

In my short lived life, I have realized that everyone has unique thresholds about what quality is and what their expectations are. This is what makes planet earth so amazing - the rich diversity and uniqueness of life. Wow, it's powerful. I love it!

Originally Posted by Myles B. Astor

In the very first review of IIRC Nitty Gritty machine in Audio magazine, they sprinkled the records with a fine dirt and then took pictures before and after.

Check out the pictures here before and after cleaning with the DAK brush.

DAK's Carbon Fiber Anti Static Record Cleaning System

Discwasher (Maeier and Risch) also did the same before and after pics and showed the micro-organisms growing in the record grooves.

Myles, my experiment takes an extreme. I coated one piece of vinyl with Cool Whip and dryer lint and scrubbed the substance deep into the grooves and processed through my machines. I have also been testing vinyl using other contaminants as well, such as: finger prints, oily finger prints, food, jam, jelly, snot, dirt, glue, glitter, peanut butter, lipstick, stickers and when pealed away left stick substance, grease, hair, sugar substance.

In the extreme case, I wanted to see if the machines can clean the most ridiculous. Clearly, they are all capable of cleaning already clean and slightly dirty records and yeah, fine dust too.

I doubt anyone has done what I am doing...but...I could be wrong too and that's totally ok with me.

I'm still writing my report

How did you get enough snot to cover an LP Good on you David, you go for it, just, if I'm ever at your place, you're putting the LP's on

Originally Posted by Golucid

Hi Myles.

I'm blessed and thankful to be in a place that I can afford to be a bit frivolous and you know, I'm just a plain-o'l dumb consumer. I'm nothing special and truth be told, I am rather unremarkable too. So, my views are coming from an average Joe...the consumer.

What I do have going for me is a passion for music and even more so, I am fixated on analog/vinyl. Above all things, I love records. Because I am just some average dude/nobody. I'd like to do something slightly interesting...at least once in my lifetime and that is to do this experiment. It's nothing more than pure pleasure and I get to share my experience here on the Shark.

...And just maybe...slight as it may be...maybe I will shed some light on something...or maybe not. But I am willing to take a risk and perhaps embarrass the heck out of myself but nevertheless, contribute something to this great community.

More importantly, through sharing, I will engage some conversation and I will learn from experts here...that is mutual sharing. Isn't that what its all about?

As for that better cartridge or turntable. I have a more than $4,000 Ortofon Windfeld and I am delighted with my ClearAudio/McIntosh MT10. I have no desire to upgrade.


- David

David, it's "the plain ol consumer" that has the valued real world opinion!

~Eric

Originally Posted by Golucid

I remember at an early age my momma would say, "there's a bed for every butt". Myself, when on my own, a was ridiculously poor and I remember my first record player. Myles, I would have been one of those you laughed at, but it was all that I could afford...and I love records. Fast forward a few years, I have improved my system. But I have to say, being poor gave me a much richer experience because I cherished each and every note. I learned the gift of appreciation.

Today, when someone is experiencing joy, it's pandemic and I can't help but feel that great energy. It's awesome.

In my short lived life, I have realized that everyone has unique thresholds about what quality is and what their expectations are. This is what makes planet earth so amazing - the rich diversity and uniqueness of life. Wow, it's powerful. I love it!

Beautiful!!! Right on!

+1 Mark, doesn't seem you are the one wanting the confrontation. While I, like most here, would never do what David is attempting I too applaud his efforts and look forward to his result.

Originally Posted by bzr

How did you get enough snot to cover an LP Good on you David, you go for it, just, if I'm ever at your place, you're putting the LP's on

Dude, I have caught the flu twice. I collected and saved it! LOL

Wait, what color lipstick, David?

Originally Posted by Double-D

I still remember the days back in the late 60's when me and my friends washed records in the kitchen sink using a new 3" paint brush as a scrubber. I put just enough warm water and mild detergent in the sink to have the water reach the lead-out groove. After brushing and rotating the album the process was followed with a warm rinse right from the tap, and air dry in a dish rack. It actually worked pretty darn good. The real trick was trying to keep the labels dry.

Dan, great memories are precious things, they are what makes us who we are. I read this & thought , 'man', if only... opportunity comes & goes, sometimes all you have to do is side-shift & you are on easy-street for life.
Steve, I'm backing KLAudio with white vinegar in the mix.... I've tried it & am prejudice!

Later, when I start experimenting with cleaning agents, I may try the vinegar through my VPI. It's not a substance I am willing to try on the Ultrasonics or Pulsing Sonic just yet.

But...the curious nature of me must try the vinegar at some point! A sacrifice LP, of course.

Originally Posted by Asamel

I was going to ask you if you had a tt!

You really didn't believe I had a turntable?

I want to thank everyone of their support. As you all know, I put my equipment at risk to process this crazy experiment. That said, I have no regrets. Not only have learned things about the units individually but also how they compliment each other. Interestingly, I also learned a bit about me and why I am doing this and more importantly, just how much this community means to me. I love it here... thanks everyone for being so darn kewl!

I can't wait to finish documenting phases 1-2...and as you know, this is an on going process. I should say more clearly, I have many more experiments I doing but if I don't start publishing what I have completed... I will never publish anything!

That said, I can't wait for lots of feedback about how I do things better. I say this because, I'm no expert. I am a novice and while that is true, there is certain value in ones beginning, yes?

Thanks again everyone for encouraging me to press on.

David

Originally Posted by mep

I'm going to admit that I'm still scratching my head and trying to figure out what you are hoping to learn from your experiments and what everyone else is hoping to learn from your experiments. First of all, I appreciate the fact that you have invested a bunch of money in buying a bunch of different RCMs. However, I know I personally would never buy a used LP that was in the shape of the LPs you are intentionally trashing with all of the different foods, chemicals, and body secretions you are applying to them. How does any of that equate to the real world of buying a used LP in reasonable condition and hoping to use an RCM in hopes of making the LP as quiet as possible?

For me, it would be much more interesting to see you clean a stack of LPs that came from thrift stores, flea markets, Ebay, etc., and have you tell us which machine routinely gave better results with real-world cleaning solutions designed for cleaning LPs. Some before and after pictures would be nice as well. I have no interest in cleaning LPs contaminated with boogers, flu snot, peanut butter and jelly, or lipstick.

You hit every note here that I have considered but for many that I have dialoged with, there were to many variables and I needed to create a baseline and then work my way down to those scenarios you point out.

So, in my cap, I have a crazy worst case scenario. Now, I can drill down to the scenarios that you reference. But, I will have a melting pot of examples to draw upon.

And I hope you continue to scratch your head and ask questions that make me have to hop around and figure things out. Because when that happens, I learn and share.

Originally Posted by mep

I'm going to admit that I'm still scratching my head and trying to figure out what you are hoping to learn from your experiments and what everyone else is hoping to learn from your experiments. First of all, I appreciate the fact that you have invested a bunch of money in buying a bunch of different RCMs. However, I know I personally would never buy a used LP that was in the shape of the LPs you are intentionally trashing with all of the different foods, chemicals, and body secretions you are applying to them. How does any of that equate to the real world of buying a used LP in reasonable condition and hoping to use an RCM in hopes of making the LP as quiet as possible?

For me, it would be much more interesting to see you clean a stack of LPs that came from thrift stores, flea markets, Ebay, etc., and have you tell us which machine routinely gave better results with real-world cleaning solutions designed for cleaning LPs. Some before and after pictures would be nice as well. I have no interest in cleaning LPs contaminated with boogers, flu snot, peanut butter and jelly, or lipstick.

Mark I get where you are coming from but on the other hand, David is keeping a fairly constant level of filth from sample to sample which would be impossible to do with flea market records. His filth may not be your filth or my filth but the purpose is to perform a relative analysis between the cleaning capability of each piece of equipment and a standardized filth is key in doing so. The other point i would make is that I sure like his style!

What I would love to learn from Myles is about his experiences since he too has: VPI, Audio Desk and Klaudio. I am not entirely unique. The differences I would guess is that he is a reviewer and has amazing relationships with many of the fellows in the industry. Myself, I know no one. What would be awesome is to collaborate with Myles with his decades of experience in the industry.

Folks, this is not about who is right. It's all about sharing information and Myles has a lot of insight to the corporate arena out there. He knows everyone in the industry and writes reviews.

This is a great opportunity. Myles, are you in?

Originally Posted by dlb2

I'm waiting for David to say that the Spin-Clean works the best.

You know, in my experience personally, its not a bad device at all. Given the right cleaning enzyme agent. It has worked very well for me!

Originally Posted by Loop4fun

David, This thread could become one of the all time analog greats. I appreciate your doggedness. I have the Audio Desk, but still can have some clicks and pops and never really know if it's the record, or if it can be cleaned further. The new Clear Audio machine looks like a killer... Good luck and thanks!

I think what might be a value is that I'm just an average Joe. I am not connected. I do not have friends in the corporate arena looking or reading my reviews. So, I have the freedom to convey a truth. Not long ago, I was approached by a manufacture that offered a gift...and I completely understood the motive. Write a favorable review about their product. I FLAT OUT REFUSED. Gosh. How could I? No one would ever believe me. I would be a bought off review liar!

I do not want friends in the industry because that smells of corruption. I believe all of use that are spending THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS have earned truth.

I think this little review/experiment, if done properly, would yield actual OBJECTIVE information. Something rarely seen in the audiophile world.

Originally Posted by Golucid

I think what might be a value is that I'm just an average Joe. I am not connected. I do not have friends in the corporate arena looking or reading my reviews. So, I have the freedom to convey a truth. Not long ago, I was approached by a manufacture that offered a gift...and I completely understood the motive. Write a favorable review about their product. I FLAT OUT REFUSED. Gosh. How could I? No one would ever believe me. I would be a bought off review liar!

I do not want friends in the industry because that smells of corruption. I believe all of use that are spending THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS have earned truth.

Ya "bought off review liars" are a problem.

Astor? Myles B. Astor?

Originally Posted by o0OBillO0o

Astor? Myles B. Astor?

????? I hope you are not referring to my last post. Myles is one of the truly good guys.