Thread: Turntable Shopping - Need some opinion.

Originally Posted by MDP

I love the Spiral Groove TT's !!

mark thank god you got rid of that awful piece of equipment in your avatar and got back to what makes all your posts so very interesting.lmao!!!
and theres a spiral groove sg2 for sale on agon for $10k with the triplanar on it. id buy it if i had the money.lol.

Originally Posted by socfan12

Paul, have you narrowed down your choices yet? Some great ideas being posted...

$$$ = Trouble....

Then talk to Rob Paul; he can rebuild one to your taste.

And Jack too can direct you towards more affordable pastures.

Bob, what kind of response did you get from Clearaudio? And, just curious, which turntable do you use in your system?

There are so many of us good hearted analogue lovers here. I know I just love "helping" a fellow audiophile spend their money on a beautiful analogue rig that I only wish I could own.

So many choices ... so little funds ... so much pressure to get something great ... so many conflicting enotions (do I really need a wife ... the kids can go to a community college ... how hard can it be to rob a bank anyway)

Originally Posted by VT Skier

Bob, what kind of response did you get from Clearaudio? And, just curious, which turntable do you use in your system?

this is Bobs turntable, after all cant run anything too extravagant in the igloo, it would get dripped on. im thinking he made it himself lmao!!!!

Originally Posted by NorthStar

Then talk to Rob Paul; he can rebuild one to your taste.

And Jack too can direct you towards more affordable pastures.

Yup. This is what I can afford I used to have one.




And this one is what I had when I was like 10 yrs old VW Bus. ~!!


http://cnettv.cnet.com/how-play-lp-w...-50076444.html

Soundwagon | The World's Smallest Portable Vinyl Record Player

Originally Posted by Mike

Soundwagon | The World's Smallest Portable Vinyl Record Player

$100???? Wow I'm not even sure I can afford it either. Lol

dont get you hopes up Paul i saw the original vw bus one from i guess the 60's or 70's in a local antique shop and they wanted like $350 for it.lol. $99 for a new one is a bargain.lol.

ok Paul all kidding aside why dont you get yourself a nice ,couple steps above entry level table .with a deal this would be under $2k. and a nice grado reference mm cart for like $1k and see if you like it first. if you dont , this table is an easy sale to get rid of. hell i might buy it from you as a second table.lol. if you do like it and want to stick with vinyl, then down the road you trade it for something you really want.
there is no better place to start than a basic vpi and a great value grado cartridge.

Originally Posted by Petro85

ok Paul all kidding aside why dont you get yourself a nice ,couple steps above entry level table .with a deal this would be under $2k. and a nice grado reference mm cart for like $1k and see if you like it first. if you dont , this table is an easy sale to get rid of. hell i might buy it from you as a second table.lol. if you do like it and want to stick with vinyl, then down the road you trade it for something you really want.
there is no better place to start than a basic vpi and a great value grado cartridge.

Steve, I couldn't agree more with everything you just said !!

Paul, this is good advice,see if you like spinning vinyl before you go all out.

Originally Posted by VT Skier

Bob, what kind of response did you get from Clearaudio? And, just curious, which turntable do you use in your system?

I did not call them yet Jon. ...Right now I don't have any turntable set up in any of my systems.

1. I intend to call them after this weekend; but I already have a very good idea on what they're going to say regarding acrylic.

2. Jon, I still have three very cheap TTs in my basement and tons of albums (LPs & 45s), but my pursuit of happiness @ this point in time in my life is on simplicity, peace (Classical music listening among it), new music discoveries (artists & all), and in a world (my world @ home with my surroundings) that is pretty much binary.

_____________

* Paul's mention about staying away from acrylic, and my own confirmation are correlated I guess.

What about you Jon, what is your take on a platine (platter) made of acrylic? ...And other parts of the TT too also made of acrylic. ...But the platter is what makes the biggest difference, in sound. ...Not from first hand experience (physical and personal material ownership), but virtual, from reviews, articles, forum's discussions.
{Lara Croft - Tomb Raider - has a Clearaudio Master Reference - Linear Drive TT (acrylic platine), and she listens to Classical music on it.}

What Lara wants ... Lara gets (or else)

Paul ain't Lara. ... & vice versa.

Originally Posted by NorthStar

What about you Jon, what is your take on a platine (platter) made of acrylic? ...And other parts of the TT too also made of acrylic. ...But the platter is what makes the biggest difference, in sound. ...Not from first hand experience (physical and personal material ownership), but virtual, from reviews, articles, forum's discussions.

I tend to start with a review, a recommendation from a dealer I trust, a show report, or a personal visit to a show, but I trust my own ears and preferences, and demo gear ad nauseam before purchasing. For me, most advice is worth what I paid for it.

I only have one table, so I'm probably not the best person to ask about acrylic vs. other material, and I don't want to sidetrack the OP's request for advice. But I will say that I've listened to a lot of tables, and as long as the manufacturer gets the two important things right (silence and speed), I'm agnostic as to belt, DD, suspension, mass loading, etc., for just a few of the many variations.

Same with speakers (I like Magico and Raidho, among others), electronics (Soulution and VAC are personal favorites), and lots of other products. The aforementioned companies have very different philosophies, but I think all execute their visions in exemplary fashion.

Understand that Delrin is the next best thing with Clearaudio, other than fashion what makes a Delrin a better platter than acrylic?

I currently have a Clearaudio Master Solution with an 70mm acrylic platter and I wonder what I'm missing. BTW the sound is great as it is.

Originally Posted by RedSectorA

Understand that Delrin is the next best thing with Clearaudio, other than fashion what makes a Delrin a better platter than acrylic?

I currently have a Clearaudio Master Solution with an 70mm acrylic platter and I wonder what I'm missing. BTW the sound is great as it is.

Dan...If you are happy as it is than leave as it is.... Don't start to wondering around

Steve. Thanks for advice. I might ended up with VPI. Who knows...

Anyway as I mentioned I got a great offer on Rossner & Sohn Chess KLM 15 and thinking very hard on these.

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Dan...If you are happy as it is than leave as it is.... Don't start to wondering around

Paul I have no intention of changing, just curious.

Originally Posted by RedSectorA

Paul I have no intention of changing, just curious.

Good and it was a great to talk to you Dan

Originally Posted by RedSectorA

Understand that Delrin is the next best thing with Clearaudio, other than fashion what makes a Delrin a better platter than acrylic?

I currently have a Clearaudio Master Solution with an 70mm acrylic platter and I wonder what I'm missing. BTW the sound is great as it is.

Hi Dan, nice to see you.

I tried to locate a scientific article on acrylic properties when used as a turntable's platter; but did not persevere long enough.
Anyway, no big deal, but there are better materials (sound's benefit - resonance) for a TT's platter. . ..And some high caliber TT's designers already know that.
- I will find that article eventually. It's only a question of time.

Meanwhile, a fun read: Turntable 101 | Confessions of a Part-Time Audiophile
{But you gotta read it all.}

__________________

Paul, there is this too: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...it-turntable-0

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Good and it was a great to talk to you Dan

Likewise Paul

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Paul, is she an affordable TT?

________________________
________________________

Just a quick Lara Croft's TT retrospective:

__________________
__________________

* I couldn't find the clip where they show the Clearaudio Master Reference TT, but it is exactly between these two clips just above.
And in the very first few seconds of that last video clip you can hear the Classical music playing on it.

It seems that Delrin/aluminum sandwiched platters are the preferred choice of most analog TT aficionados. ...People who have experimented with several materials including acrylic platters. ...And Delrin definitely over acrylic; golden ears have confirmed the sound benefit, in unison.
{Acrylic has perhaps a loss of inertia - inertial mass - at the outer edge of the platter.}

______________

Interesting read: The VPI Rim Drive & Classic Aluminum Platter Back to the future or forward to the past? Review By Wayne Donnelly

Bob, Yes it is affordable . However some one just put me off on this TT due to lack of 1 arm with 9",discontinued ....etc.

Also he recommend me to not purchase the TT with pressure so instead of doing the research over the web.

I will do some leg work following week

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Bob, Yes it is affordable . However some one just put me off on this TT due to lack of 1 arm with 9",discontinued ....etc.

Also he recommend me to not purchase the TT with pressure so instead of doing the research over the web.

I will do some leg work following week

LOL

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Bob, Yes it is affordable . However some one just put me off on this TT due to lack of 1 arm with 9",discontinued ....etc.

Also he recommend me to not purchase the TT with pressure so instead of doing the research over the web.

I will do some leg work following week

Good for you Paul. The most important thing is that you enjoy your vinyl!

Originally Posted by RedSectorA

LOL

Originally Posted by Mike

Good for you Paul. The most important thing is that you enjoy your vinyl!

Mike I think I listen to you and Steve's Advice. Thinking to spend less than $ 5K and see how I'm going to like the vinyl first

Originally Posted by Petro85

ok Paul all kidding aside why dont you get yourself a nice ,couple steps above entry level table .with a deal this would be under $2k. and a nice grado reference mm cart for like $1k and see if you like it first. if you dont , this table is an easy sale to get rid of. hell i might buy it from you as a second table.lol. if you do like it and want to stick with vinyl, then down the road you trade it for something you really want.
there is no better place to start than a basic vpi and a great value grado cartridge.

Steve , Which one is better the Scout or Classic I ?

Hi Paul,

If the Classic is on your radar, maybe look at the Classic 2 as well? The adjust on the fly VTA allows some additional tailoring of sound and is a nice feature.

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Mike I think I listen to you and Steve's Advice. Thinking to spend less than $ 5K and see how I'm going to like the vinyl first

That would be smart. I would say Classic 3 in piano black finish with Ortofon Cadenza Black (I'm trying the Ortofon cadenza bronze soon which has a hint of warmth. But since your gear is already one notch to the side of warmth, I would go with the Ortofon Cadenza black which is straight up neutral.). That combo will run you a smidge more than $5k - but you would be content for a very long time. The Classic 3 is no joke. It sounds great and I can barely lift it!

Paul - is your turntable going to be in a room that is on a concrete floor or a sub floor? I'm asking because of foot falls. If subfloor, you will want a table with mass over a spring bass table (like the AVID).

Have you talked to Jeff at AV Solutions? The guy knows tables, arms and carts.

Mike

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Steve , Which one is better the Scout or Classic I ?

paul i agree with the quote below. the classic 2 with the vta adjustment for just $600 more retail is a better thing to have than the classic1. im glad you asked me that question Paul cause you may not know but i owned a scout1 and had upgraded it with the mini tnt feet and the classic platter. making what they now call the scout 2. oh btw if the scout 2 doesnt have the big feet its well worth the extra $359 to get them. i dont like the pointy feet at all. very shaky i had them on my aries as well and got rid of them.
back to my point. i traded the scout with a clearaudio maestro cartridge for a classic1 with a ortofon cadenza blue cartridge. and although the classic is way cooler looking. the blue cartridge i thought killed the clearaudio cartridge, but the tables were a sideways move. i didnt think the classic1 was any better or worse than the upgraded scout. which btw i also upgraded the arm from a 9t to a 9s which has better wiring. im not sure which the scout 2 comes with. but if you add that all up, i spent $1800 on the table, $800 platter,$359 feet,$150 wiring and junction box. a scout 2 all set up is way cheaper and so was the classic1 lol . and when i traded it i sold my friend the platter, and had to eat the rest.
so i would say the scout2 is just as good as the classic1 for less money just not as cool looking. and the 10" arm on the classic is a mite bit better. but so close i would buy the scout2 as your first table. then if you like it trade up to the classic3 or even go off the vpi reservation at that point and get something awesome.lol.
i would say the cartridge choice mike gave you is great too. the cadenza bronze lists at $2100 and the cadenza black lists at $2600. i went all over for a long while and listened to every cartridge that i can afford and a bunch i couldnt. shelter,lyra,ortofon,clearaudio,dyna and a bunch of others. the best 2 in the 2000-3500 range to my ears were the cadenza black and the bronze. but for $1500 the grado reference mm cartridge is a sleeper in the bunch an performs with cartridges twice its price.
if i was getting a first table and i wanted the best value i would buy a vpi scout2 with a grado reference cartridge. upgraded feet on the scout and 300 rpm motor . whole thing would be about $4300 retail. and you could get it for way less than that. classic1 witha cadenza bronze is about $5900
then when you love it and want more sell me the cartridge and put the table on agon .it would be sold in a couple days. lmao!!!! good luck paul!!!
best part about vpi is they sell fast and hold their value pretty well. lol.

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Hi Paul,

If the Classic is on your radar, maybe look at the Classic 2 as well? The adjust on the fly VTA allows some additional tailoring of sound and is a nice feature.

Originally Posted by Mike

Paul - is your turntable going to be in a room that is on a concrete floor or a sub floor? I'm asking because of foot falls. If subfloor, you will want a table with mass over a spring bass table (like the AVID).

Have you talked to Jeff at AV Solutions? The guy knows tables, arms and carts.

Mike

I have a concrete floor and ceiling as well. So no problem there.

hmmm....I don't want to bother Jeff so much and I already did few times lol

Originally Posted by Petro85

paul i agree with the quote below. the classic 2 with the vta adjustment for just $600 more retail is a better thing to have than the classic1. im glad you asked me that question Paul cause you may not know but i owned a scout1 and had upgraded it with the mini tnt feet and the classic platter. making what they now call the scout 2. oh btw if the scout 2 doesnt have the big feet its well worth the extra $359 to get them. i dont like the pointy feet at all. very shaky i had them on my aries as well and got rid of them.
back to my point. i traded the scout with a clearaudio maestro cartridge for a classic1 with a ortofon cadenza blue cartridge. and although the classic is way cooler looking. the blue cartridge i thought killed the clearaudio cartridge, but the tables were a sideways move. i didnt think the classic1 was any better or worse than the upgraded scout. which btw i also upgraded the arm from a 9t to a 9s which has better wiring. im not sure which the scout 2 comes with. but if you add that all up, i spent $1800 on the table, $800 platter,$359 feet,$150 wiring and junction box. a scout 2 all set up is way cheaper and so was the classic1 lol . and when i traded it i sold my friend the platter, and had to eat the rest.
so i would say the scout2 is just as good as the classic1 for less money just not as cool looking. and the 10" arm on the classic is a mite bit better. but so close i would buy the scout2 as your first table. then if you like it trade up to the classic3 or even go off the vpi reservation at that point and get something awesome.lol.
i would say the cartridge choice mike gave you is great too. the cadenza bronze lists at $2100 and the cadenza black lists at $2600. i went all over for a long while and listened to every cartridge that i can afford and a bunch i couldnt. shelter,lyra,ortofon,clearaudio,dyna and a bunch of others. the best 2 in the 2000-3500 range to my ears were the cadenza black and the bronze. but for $1500 the grado reference mm cartridge is a sleeper in the bunch an performs with cartridges twice its price.
if i was getting a first table and i wanted the best value i would buy a vpi scout2 with a grado reference cartridge. upgraded feet on the scout and 300 rpm motor . whole thing would be about $4300 retail. and you could get it for way less than that. classic1 witha cadenza bronze is about $5900
then when you love it and want more sell me the cartridge and put the table on agon .it would be sold in a couple days. lmao!!!! good luck paul!!!
best part about vpi is they sell fast and hold their value pretty well. lol.

Great post Steve. I appreciated .....

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

I have a concrete floor and ceiling as well. So no problem there.

hmmm....I don't want to bother Jeff so much and I already did few times lol

Rock on Paul!! The sky's the limit.

Originally Posted by BlueMcIntosh

Great post Steve. I appreciated .....

+1
I had the scout 2 and I was a very
happy camper

Oracle, is Canadian?

Yep, born and raised in the Eastern Township south of Montreal

Here ya go Paul!

How they make a VPI Turntable.

20 pages Paul! Are you any closer to a decision?

He's checking some of them VPI turntables.

Originally Posted by NorthStar

He's checking some of them VPI turntables.

Thank you . Doug please talk with my lawyer from now on

Originally Posted by RedSectorA

Yep, born and raised in the Eastern Township south of Montreal

Dan, Going to see Chad this Friday to see some turntables . I didn't know he carries so many brands (SME, ClearAudio,VPI,,,etc ) .

Originally Posted by dlb2

20 pages Paul! Are you any closer to a decision?

Doug....Very close. The WTL is still on my list