DeVore Super 8's or Nine lean ?

[Jerome W]

I guess what "riled me up" as you put it was Jerome's conclusion that "Super 8's are not at all tube friendly". I too have tried about a half dozen different amps "SS and tube" in big and small rooms. My "observation" has been that they sound best with
the Leben. But would that lead me to say they are not at all SS friendly? No.
I'll leave the long winded rebuttal to others.

When a speaker is "tube friendly" or "easy to drive" as some people say, one should not have to try "about a half dozen different amps" to find a good match !

My guess is that either you like the Leben because you use the bass boost (which according to the owners is just wonderful), or second option, you use the Super 8's in a small closed room. If you are satisfied with the Leben, then that is just great. Do not move.

John certainly voiced them with a tube amplifier. We all know John loves tubes.
But a speaker sounding so much better with SS amps than with tubes ( yesterday I tried my Audiolab 8000PX, an amp with much more drive than a NAIM NAP 250 and tons of current, and the Super 8's sounded incredibly FULL and I remember that I tried once with my MC2205 and they were stunning too. The " problems " started with tube amps) is not what I would call "tube friendly". There must be a "bug" somewhere.

My observation is that the Super 8 CRAVES for current and this is given by SS amps with super beefy power supplies. Feed them with good SS power and you do get the "Meat on the Bone". The Leanness Kev313 mentioned so often about them just DISAPPEARS !

My Harbeth for example really DO NOT CARE. They sound great with my MC225, 2x30 W of tubes and they sound great with the SS 2205, 2x 200W. Those are what I really call "tube friendly".

And if you look at the recent demos John made of the Gibbon 88 and the new Gibbon X, he USED SS AMPS !!! A bit curious no for someone designing speakers with tube amps ????
I would love to hear John on this.

I felt in love with the finesse and musicality of the Super 8's when I received them. I wrote everywhere that DeVore was designing and manufacturing one of the best speakers of the world. I even ordered a pair of new Silverbacks and the dealer refused finally a method of payment that he initially accepted.
Reading now that my post is "slagging" DeVore was way too tough to accept.

If you find the Super 8's tube friendly, then good for you.
My thread is not for you. It is intended to help Super 8's users experiencing the same issues as me and Kev had, and provide them with the adequate solution, and to inform potential buyers of the Super 8's which may be low power tube amps owners.


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[Cucumber_jones]

Yup your right. The super 8's just don't work with low watt tubes, Your best to get some mc 601's to make them shine and sing. Jerome you are so right.

They work well for dale as his living room is just a small closed room. I would estimate that his small closed room is roughly 1000 sq feet when all is said and done. I doubt he will move though as his water front house is really quite nice.




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[Jerome W]

Yup your right. The super 8's just don't work with low watt tubes, Your best to get some mc 601's to make them shine and sing. Jerome you are so right.

They work well for dale as his living room is just a small closed room. I would estimate that his small closed room is roughly 1000 sq feet when all is said and done. I doubt he will move though as his water front house is really quite nice.




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No no !
The 601's are for the O96 ! :roflmao:


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[Dgolh]

I can't speak of 8's as I own 88's.

Amplifier and speaker matching is not always simple. I was using an ARC VSI60 when I bought the 88's, "Loads of power" but not what I was looking for. I changed the VSI60 for an Allnic T1500. It was fitted with regular EH valves and the match wasn't that good.

Since I have EML 300B XLS (probably around 15w) fitted in , the sound is better by far. So, no specific golden rule comes out of my own tries. What is true with a Leben might be totally wrong with a Shindo or whatever else. It is a matter of taste and probably needs some tries.

 

[Katoomer]

When a speaker is "tube friendly" or "easy to drive" as some people say, one should not have to try "about a half dozen different amps" to find a good match !


I never said I had to try a half dozen amps to find a good match. I said the Leben was the best match. Of the other 5 only one did not match up well.

 

[kev313]

My ears are burning. Even when I try to stay out of things, this crap happens. I somewhat conspiratorial, so I want to say part of me suspects that Jerome does this just to get a rise out of me as part of his shadow campaign through back channel discussions with various audio nerds... Finger in the eye of audio manufacturer here, suck up to that one over there. Such effort. Or maybe it's part of his enthusiasm for the hobby. Who knows. Too much effort for my taste, but who am I to judge? BUT BUT BUT my comments are what they are.

I'll own those comments on the super eights and nines. My Shindo (Montille/ Aurieges) and Super 8 system was quite lifeless. I was not at all happy with the pairing in my small room. I think it was missing like 22% of the notes. Ha. No. It played all of the notes, but was missing that Shindo flesh and blood feeling.

On the nines, I worked hard to love them. Check my comments on Audio Asylum from maybe 6 or 7 years ago. It's on the record. I eventually came to love them with a juicy el34 amp. I also used solid state. See my comments. It was holographic, but not my cup o tea.

Cripes...I'm not sure if I'm happy or sad that I reinstalled this app today. Forum-ing about audio might actually detract from my enjoyment of this hobby.


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[kev313]

By the way, my understanding is that JD has a bunch of different types of gear. I'm not sure what his specific design goals are or were, so I wouldn't presume to comment.

For those who find different results with their Super 8s, I have little reason to doubt it. Rooms, tastes, etc. There are probably too many factors to discuss general applicability of results. In my experience, the 8s and 9s definitely had strengths, but there are compromises in any speaker and more so at that price range as compared to where I went from there. There is nothing strange or wrong with that. For my sonic preference, I'd rather leave out some of the holographic imaging to incorporate more of the sweaty meat on the bones feel (that's an audiophile term right there, look it up) and that seems to happen better with higher efficiency and tubes in my experience.





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[kev313]

When a speaker is "tube friendly" or "easy to drive" as some people say, one should not have to try "about a half dozen different amps" to find a good match !


I never said I had to try a half dozen amps to find a good match. I said the Leben was the best match. Of the other 5 only one did not match up well.

I also used half a dozen amps on the Nines. He might have been referring to me. A Rowland was ultimately not my fave BUT was very very good. For those who have not tried ss on the 9s, give it a try! What does it hurt? Have some fun.


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[Paul]

By the way, my understanding is that JD has a bunch of different types of gear. I'm not sure what his specific design goals are or were, so I wouldn't presume to comment.

For those who find different results with their Super 8s, I have little reason to doubt it. Rooms, tastes, etc. There are probably too many factors to discuss general applicability of results. In my experience, the 8s and 9s definitely had strengths, but there are compromises in any speaker and more so at that price range as compared to where I went from there. There is nothing strange or wrong with that. For my sonic preference, I'd rather leave out some of the holographic imaging to incorporate more of the sweaty meat on the bones feel (that's an audiophile term right there, look it up) and that seems to happen better with higher efficiency and tubes in my experience.





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Well said Kev and that goes to any brands speakers.

 

[Jerome W]

My ears are burning. Even when I try to stay out of things, this crap happens. I somewhat conspiratorial, so I want to say part of me suspects that Jerome does this just to get a rise out of me as part of his shadow campaign through back channel discussions with various audio nerds... Finger in the eye of audio manufacturer here, suck up to that one over there. Such effort. Or maybe it's part of his enthusiasm for the hobby. Who knows. Too much effort for my taste, but who am I to judge? BUT BUT BUT my comments are what they are.

"finger in the eye of audio manufacturer here..."

Kev, you must be a great and successful lawyer. Your ability to transform what people say to suit your needs and the pretention to know what people think and did not say is absolutely stunning.

Lawyer. One of the few jobs on earth where students learn to lie and do that for a living.

Please, Please, Please, forget your job when you come over here !


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[kev313]

"finger in the eye of audio manufacturer here..."

Kev, you must be a great and successful lawyer. Your ability to transform what people say to suit your needs and the pretention to know what people think and did not say is absolutely stunning.

Lawyer. One of the few jobs on earth where students learn to lie and do that for a living.

Please, Please, Please, forget your job when you come over here !


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Well well well. You have no trouble throwing bombs do you? Such little regard for the value of words. That's telling. That's also out of line and, perhaps, illustrates the difficulty with some personalities in this hobby as it suggests that some confuse the subjective with the objective.

We (lawyers) can't lie, Jerome. We advocate our client's position. Our ethical obligations are quite high and the rules quite strict. Also, our reputations are our careers, so calling me a liar on a public forum is, at the least, rude. I took that as the implication of your post. If I misread that, please correct me. I know you think it's funny and maybe you just don't like me personally. Maybe you're playing to your crowd.

My comment above is little more than my opinion. Given the amount of conflict I observe on your threads regarding Devore, Shindo, Harbeth, you seem to me to be a pain in the side of these companies. You disagree. I'm not "lying" about it. It's just one man's opinion. I might even be correct. I guess it's not for us to judge whether those comments are correct. You'd have to check with someone from the Shindo organization, for example.

Edit: By the way, I thought I was pretty clear that I have no idea what your motivations are.

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[cmalak]

Gentleman...I think everyone needs to take a deep breath step back and let this one slide. There is no reason why this needs to devolve into personal attacks and innuendo. Let's not get into a he said, she said dynamic and let's get back to this being a friendly and informative community of hobbyists sharing experiences.

 

[Mike]

Gentleman...I think everyone needs to take a deep breath step back and let this one slide. There is no reason why this needs to devolve into personal attacks and innuendo. Let's not get into a he said, she said dynamic and let's get back to this being a friendly and informative community of hobbyists sharing experiences.

+1. Emotions get in the way of objectivity.

I always enjoy Jeff's reviews: http://www.devorefidelity.com/reviews/tone.html


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