Classe closes for good.

There is great solid state and great tubes. I could live happily with Pass, Gryphon, D'Agostino, ARC, VAC, Triode, Viva, Audio Note and many others. There are things tube amps do (like tonality) which SS amps fall a little short. Then there are things solid state amps do (bass, dynamics, etc.) that tube amps fall a little short.

The key is to find the right amp regardless of solid state or tube for the speakers, the music, the room and the budget.

So far, pure Class D is the only amp topology I don't find appealing. Class D is good for cars and subwoofers. It's like junk food of power. Lots of it for cheap, but not necessarily good for you and way over rated. Class D power ratings are so full of crap in many cases. Take 1/10 of the power rating and you will get real world power. No, not in all cases, but in many cases. That has been my experience at least.

I would take a JOB225 A/B amp over any class D amp on the market today - including Moola Moola.
 
RichardAusten said:
I am actually quite surprised there are so many solid state companies still surviving in the high end industry given that often what is "inside the box" are often purchased from the same limited number of suppliers and often sound very much the same.

I am not a big SS fan (to say the least) but when I listen at a dealer and they trot out 5 SS amps for audition I often walk away thinking meh - sounds remarkably the same in the sense that all of them aren't particularly great - one may sound a little fat or have better bass or sound more airy so in that sense they sound different from each other but then I sit back and think yeah but did any of them actually sound any good? And that is listening to amps with a spread of $2k to $60k. You'd really hope that the latter would utterly trounce the former. Meh.
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I have just the opposite view. I can't believe that there are any tube companies still selling product. I am glad there are options for everyone in this hobby.
 
a.wayne said:
RGA ,

Another Dart for SS , if you really want to hear good toobs you gotta get away from Audio Note ..


lol :)

Regards
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Thanks I've had experience with a lot of gear over the years. As a reviewer who has covered several audio shows and have had a lot of gear come and go and special event showcases of gear.

But I am always happy to have more experience auditioning what others think are the best tube amps. Or SS amplifiers for that matter

I have no problem with being called out for my biases as I note my bias up front - but please do others who read forums a service by listing which specific tube amp sounds better than which specific tube amp and the details of said comparison (system, price etc).

I am happy for anyone to recommend some amplifiers to try out that people think are the bee's knees of SS/SET/PP tubes/Class D/etc.

So Audio Note doesn't make any good toobs? You've heard ALL of their amps - man that is impressive indeed. I await the list of the good tooobs.
 
Mike said:
There is great solid state and great tubes. I could live happily with Pass, Gryphon, D'Agostino, ARC, VAC, Triode, Viva, Audio Note and many others. There are things tube amps do (like tonality) which SS amps fall a little short. Then there are things solid state amps do (bass, dynamics, etc.) that tube amps fall a little short.

The key is to find the right amp regardless of solid state or tube for the speakers, the music, the room and the budget.

So far, pure Class D is the only amp topology I don't find appealing. Class D is good for cars and subwoofers. It's like junk food of power. Lots of it for cheap, but not necessarily good for you and way over rated. Class D power ratings are so full of crap in many cases. Take 1/10 of the power rating and you will get real world power. No, not in all cases, but in many cases. That has been my experience at least.

I would take a JOB225 A/B amp over any class D amp on the market today - including Moola Moola.
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Hi Mike - Well I suppose it comes down to the speakers - obviously the harder to drive the speaker the more problems a SET will have in driving them - but IME the bass and dynamics weakness dissipates with higher speaker efficiency. Now for ultimate bass slam at high level then SS is king but then IMO ultimate bass slam at high level isn't really of musical value. And it would probably be best served with some sort of dual subwoofer set-up.

As a dealer you have a unique perspective when it comes to these discussions because you can in effect listen to one system that does tone and then flip over to a big hard Slam system and you can readily "respect" those strengths and weaknesses. But most audiophiles generally come down to one or two systems - but usually just one main system. So they have the difficulty of sorts because they have to decide which kind of sound they will live with day in and day out all the time. They need do it all or all rounder systems.

So there are plenty of SS systems that have impressed me over the years and on any single one day audition. But after more than 25 years I am better able to tell which system is the one that impresses me and the ones I could live with and I can't think off too many SS amps that make it to the second list (at least if I have my overly anal hat on). I mean hell I could probably live happily with a Sugden A48 or A21 from 1992 - I mean this isn't life or death stuff. But if I'm plonking down real money - I'm not sure I would be super happy to live with most SS.

Then again I did choose a room as best of show (CAS7) that used a Tube/SS hybrid amp. So like I usually say - maybe I just haven't heard the "right" amp of any given technology.

I am in the process of looking for a SS reference amplifier to use for review purposes. Simply because the monoblock tube power amps I intend to buy are a whole 7 watts per channel - which leaves very few speaker options to review - so I've been looking in the likes of Accuphase, Bryston and some class D amps from PSAudio and Nord. But class D has improved apparently over the years - and I don't want to be judging class D on what I heard 10-15 years ago. It's like judging CD from 1984. Well it's a lot better now. So perhaps Class D is too.
 
still-one said:
I have just the opposite view. I can't believe that there are any tube companies still selling product. I am glad there are options for everyone in this hobby.
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I think Mike makes the case that the ear and experience prioritize different strengths of systems. I recently covered the California Audio Show and others before that and what I found is that I can be rather a system slut.

I consider myself a SET guy but at one show I had awarded YG Acoustics and MBL as my top two rooms - not exactly HE SET systems. YG was using Ypsilon which is a hybrid but still.

Now that year I also chose Von Gaylord and Acoustic Zen with Triode labs as best sound. And the Tape Project (Focal) would have ranked but it was a Not for Sale room. But here are 5 systems that are all rather completely different and all sounded very good. The Von Gaylord system probably was the weakest in hifi terms but was so stupendous at creating a big fat thick sound that I could almost smell the fog from the fog machine of the venue. Accurate? We don;t need no stinking accurate because it was so "beguiling" that I didn't want it to end. Don't think I could live with it everyday but on show coverage evaluation it was spectacular.

Lastly, this is how the magazines capture everyone. They basically all hire a bunch of reviewers who hear things differently and then the reader can simply select the ears that fit. Stereophile has Art and Fremer and they don't hear it the same.

I myself am trying to expand out and get myself out from just being a SET guy. I am trying to build a quality SS reference system so when I review a speaker that dips to 3ohms and has a bunch of drivers and is 83dB sensitive I have gear that can competently drive said speakers and get out of the way.

Plus being a system slut - I also like the idea of re-checking my ears and not getting locked into a safe sound. I have my comfortable pair of shoes speakers and now it's about a different sort of sound.

Anyway - I keep plugging away - I did like Magico with Technical Brain...but TB apparently had all sorts of failures. I liked Analog Domain with custom DIY horns - spectacular. And YS Audio in Hong Kong made one of the best SS amps I have ever heard but only sold in Hong Kong and start at $250,000US so I can like it all I want but it ain't coming home :)
 
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