Bryston Components v. Sony HAP-Z1ES
- Thread starter DR95497
- Start date
James Tanner - Bryston
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- Joined
- Apr 10, 2013
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Hi DR
Yes we are looking at DSD now but are not rushing into it.
Here is something I wrote up explaining our position at this time.
BRYSTON & DSD
Hi folks
I have been asked a number of times by our customers our position on DSD so please find below our thoughts. DSD currently is available in a number of variations. Assuming you want to produce a product that can grow with time and market forces both hardware and software should to be considered.
DOP 64, 128, 256, 512 (last 2 are theoretical at this point) and DSD Native are the current options. Currently DSD is possible relatively easily with current software and hardware utilizing DOP 64 on current DAC’s and to some degree DOP 128
For example:
DOP-64 requires 176.4 capable DAC’s
DOP-128 requires 352.8 capable DAC’s
DSD Native 64 x 44.1 (standard 2.8224 MHz) (which is equivalent to 16 BIT 176.4 PCM) DAC’s.
Currently the majority of DSD capable products today are using DOP-64 architecture and some DOP-128 and DSD Native. There are also some manufacturers that have proprietary hardware and software which are capable of DOP-64, DOP-128 and Native DSD but proprietary software is not compatible with USB 2 drivers etc.
The other issue we are investigating has to do with the sample rate converters in DAC’s. In order to activate DSD the sample rate converter on the DAC inut stage would have to be a custom piece because current sample rate converters are not equipped to handle DSD to the best of our knowledge?
So that means in a standard PCM converter like our BDA-2 you would have to bypass the sample rate converter which may cause more jitter because our current sample converters reduce jitter on the input. So in Bryston’s case we definitely want the sample rate converter in the circuit for 44.1 to 192 PCM signals. Also some DAC’s we have looked at that are DSD capable convert all the incoming sample rates (44,48,88,96,176,192Hz) to a very high single sample rate ‘Asynchronously’ whereas our preference with our DAC’s is to maintain the ‘Native’ incoming sample rate throughout the conversion process with all PCM signals. If we do up-sample we do it in a synchronous manner so (44.1 becomes 176.4 and 48 becomes 192) not asynchronous.
So before Bryston goes down the DSD road I want to make sure we are providing our customers with the full story and allowing for possible advancements in both hardware and software development as much as possible. Also please offer any info or input if you feel we are mistaken or misinformed.
Note- DOP – Stands for DSD over PCM
James Tanner
Yes we are looking at DSD now but are not rushing into it.
Here is something I wrote up explaining our position at this time.
BRYSTON & DSD
Hi folks
I have been asked a number of times by our customers our position on DSD so please find below our thoughts. DSD currently is available in a number of variations. Assuming you want to produce a product that can grow with time and market forces both hardware and software should to be considered.
DOP 64, 128, 256, 512 (last 2 are theoretical at this point) and DSD Native are the current options. Currently DSD is possible relatively easily with current software and hardware utilizing DOP 64 on current DAC’s and to some degree DOP 128
For example:
DOP-64 requires 176.4 capable DAC’s
DOP-128 requires 352.8 capable DAC’s
DSD Native 64 x 44.1 (standard 2.8224 MHz) (which is equivalent to 16 BIT 176.4 PCM) DAC’s.
Currently the majority of DSD capable products today are using DOP-64 architecture and some DOP-128 and DSD Native. There are also some manufacturers that have proprietary hardware and software which are capable of DOP-64, DOP-128 and Native DSD but proprietary software is not compatible with USB 2 drivers etc.
The other issue we are investigating has to do with the sample rate converters in DAC’s. In order to activate DSD the sample rate converter on the DAC inut stage would have to be a custom piece because current sample rate converters are not equipped to handle DSD to the best of our knowledge?
So that means in a standard PCM converter like our BDA-2 you would have to bypass the sample rate converter which may cause more jitter because our current sample converters reduce jitter on the input. So in Bryston’s case we definitely want the sample rate converter in the circuit for 44.1 to 192 PCM signals. Also some DAC’s we have looked at that are DSD capable convert all the incoming sample rates (44,48,88,96,176,192Hz) to a very high single sample rate ‘Asynchronously’ whereas our preference with our DAC’s is to maintain the ‘Native’ incoming sample rate throughout the conversion process with all PCM signals. If we do up-sample we do it in a synchronous manner so (44.1 becomes 176.4 and 48 becomes 192) not asynchronous.
So before Bryston goes down the DSD road I want to make sure we are providing our customers with the full story and allowing for possible advancements in both hardware and software development as much as possible. Also please offer any info or input if you feel we are mistaken or misinformed.
Note- DOP – Stands for DSD over PCM
James Tanner
BlueFox
New member
James,
That is good information, but there are two components to DSD; the source and the destination. It appears you only addressed the destination (DAC) in your explanation. The source (digital file player) also needs to be addressed.
Thanks.
That is good information, but there are two components to DSD; the source and the destination. It appears you only addressed the destination (DAC) in your explanation. The source (digital file player) also needs to be addressed.
Thanks.
Bud, how are the S5's sounding with the big Pass amps?
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James Tanner - Bryston
New member
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2013
- Messages
- 1,874
The new software in the BDP will output DSD but that will not be realsed for another month or so.
James
BlueFox
New member
Not to hijack the thread, but very nice. Friday night I was rocking and just amazed at how good it sounded, and was mesmerized by the Pass meter bouncing crazily on the right side of the face. Then quiet. I tripped the breaker on the amps 20 amp line. I guess I should have done this from the start, but next week I will get one more 20 amp line. Once each amp has its own line there better not be another interruption.