Aurender in Environment of Disruptive Technology

BayStBroker

BayStBroker

New member
Joined
Jan 15, 2015
Messages
292
Three months ago I was so perfectly content with my Aurender N100H (4TB) that I couldn't think of one complaint. Today I sometimes think my Aurender is already obsolete. With MQA gaining momentum, I'm annoyed that my N100H won't act as an MQA core decoder. In addition, programs like JRiver, HQplayer, Roon and now Audirvana 3.0 allow me to upconvert PCM audio to a variety of sample rates, and even to DSD. (Tidal converted to DSD by Audirvana makes for improved sound from my Lampizator DAC, which likes DSD.)

Increasingly I am pulling my USB cable out from the back of the Aurender to plug it in to my laptop. After the hefty investment in Aurender, I'm not thrilled with this development. At AXPONA, Aurender was a front end presence in many, many rooms. If they want to keep it that way, they need to keep up.

One solution would be to allow Aurender to become "Roon Ready." I know they love their Conductor program, but then they should keep up with the competition.
 
I will admit, Roon would be nice, but I prefer the Aurender app to be honest. As for conversion rates and full control over PCM to DSD or DSD to PCM, only the Lumin U1 has that flexibility. But sonically, there is a difference between the U1 and the N100H/N10.

Also, MQA has nothing to do with the N100H. In fact, the N100H has of February will pass along the first two levels of decoding from Tidal. To get the third level, you need a MQA DAC. I SHOULD have the MQA update for the Berk REF2 in about 2 weeks. I'm very anxious to hear MQA through my own world class DAC (like we've heard with MSB at shows).

P.S. Don't you have an AMG V12? [emoji6]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Yes. mike, nothing at my house sounds as good as the V12, especially when playin 45rpm issues from Quality Records or MoFi. Aurender's web-based manual is vague concerning what kind of decoding happens with models other than their certified A10. You mention the first two levels being passed on. But I can't find details of this.

The last step forces certified DAC manufacturers to hand over keys to their filters to MQA. Since filter design and implementation are major differentiators, guys like Paul McGowan say no deal. I wonder if the Berkeley conforms with MQA certfication required filter configurations only when it recognizes MQA being input. Otherwise there is a risk that all DACs will sound the same.
 
Mike said:
I will admit, Roon would be nice, but I prefer the Aurender app to be honest. As for conversion rates and full control over PCM to DSD or DSD to PCM, only the Lumin U1 has that flexibility. But sonically, there is a difference between the U1 and the N100H/N10.
Click to expand...
Mike - Would you please be willing to share your impressions of the sonic differences between the Lumin U1 and the Aurender N10? Looks like the N10 provides the ability to convert DSD to PCM, but I don't see any mention of also supporting PCM to DSD conversion like the Lumin U1 provides. TIA!
 
audio.bill said:
Mike - Would you please be willing to share your impressions of the sonic differences between the Lumin U1 and the Aurender N10? Looks like the N10 provides the ability to convert DSD to PCM, but I don't see any mention of also supporting PCM to DSD conversion like the Lumin U1 provides. TIA!
Click to expand...

The Aurender to me has more meat on the bones, a more liquid sound. If you paired the U1 with a Lampi with 300b's - that would be a good Ying and Yang.

I look at it this way: the Lumin app is a solid 10/10. The Lumin has more horse power for converting and upsampling. The Lumin sports an external power supply.

Lumin's strength is amazing streamers. The best. A1, T1, S1, D1, take your pick. No one can compete IMO. Aurender's strength is music servers, add your favorite DAC and go. Internal storage, cache drive, strong app, etc.

At the end of the day, sonically, I prefer the Aurender N10 to the U1 with most, but not all, DAC's.

But if upsampling and conversion from PCM to DSD and Roon are important, add a meaty sounding USB cable to the U1 like the Siltech I have and you can get there.

To be honest, you can't go wrong with either. You give up something to get something as is usually the case.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
BayStBroker said:
Yes. mike, nothing at my house sounds as good as the V12, especially when playin 45rpm issues from Quality Records or MoFi. Aurender's web-based manual is vague concerning what kind of decoding happens with models other than their certified A10. You mention the first two levels being passed on. But I can't find details of this.

The last step forces certified DAC manufacturers to hand over keys to their filters to MQA. Since filter design and implementation are major differentiators, guys like Paul McGowan say no deal. I wonder if the Berkeley conforms with MQA certfication required filter configurations only when it recognizes MQA being input. Otherwise there is a risk that all DACs will sound the same.
Click to expand...

Mark, correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem most bent about MQA and now not being able to get full blown MQA.

We are talking about 2000 albums out of how many millions?

Other than the MSB and probably the Berkeley, I haven't heard a MQA DAC that would make me give up something (PCM quality) to get something. The Berkeley, I THINK, will be the game changer - unless $100k for a MSB is in the cards. But time will tell. I need to get the file, run the MQA update to my Berk REF2 and listen. I will be using the N10 to pass MQA to the Berk REF2 in all its glory.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
"Mark, correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem most bent about MQA and now not being able to get full blown MQA.
We are talking about 2000 albums out of how many millions? "

Agreed, Mike. MQA is far, far from my hightest priorities in audio. I'm a DSD guy to the death. In fact, I think that the more MQA gains momentum, the more harm is done to the DSD movement (which rewards our efforts and investments with genuin sonic rewards). But I like to experiment with new formats. And I find it annoying that Aurender so loudly boast the full MQA compatibility of their A10, but admits regarding all other models, "Aurender music servers do not implement any MQA Core decoding." ​What are they thinking?
 
BayStBroker said:
"Mark, correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem most bent about MQA and now not being able to get full blown MQA.
We are talking about 2000 albums out of how many millions? "

Agreed, Mike. MQA is far, far from my hightest priorities in audio. I'm a DSD guy to the death. In fact, I think that the more MQA gains momentum, the more harm is done to the DSD movement (which rewards our efforts and investments with genuin sonic rewards). But I like to experiment with new formats. And I find it annoying that Aurender so loudly boast the full MQA compatibility of their A10, but admits regarding all other models, "Aurender music servers do not implement any MQA Core decoding." ​What are they thinking?
Click to expand...

Core decoding can only be done at the DAC stage, not through a music server. In addition, that DAC must contain specific components in order to receive the certification from MQA.

MQA is quality authentication from the studio master through to the DAC. Aurender music servers are not DAC's.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Mike is spot on. My N10 happily passes along MQA files to my Meridian 808v6 DAC and McIntosh D1100 DAC. Of course, only the 808 outputs everything MQA has to offer whereas the D1100 doesn't have the final step and is limited to out putting 24/44 or 24/48. I gotta admit I love seeing 192 on my 808 display while streaming Tidal. I once streamed 352kHz but that was a 2L label title which has no appeal for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
Mike said:
Mark, correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem most bent about MQA and now not being able to get full blown MQA.

We are talking about 2000 albums out of how many millions?

Other than the MSB and probably the Berkeley, I haven't heard a MQA DAC that would make me give up something (PCM quality) to get something. The Berkeley, I THINK, will be the game changer - unless $100k for a MSB is in the cards. But time will tell. I need to get the file, run the MQA update to my Berk REF2 and listen. I will be using the N10 to pass MQA to the Berk REF2 in all its glory.
Click to expand...

Just FYI, MSB will do full MQA at the sub-$10k level with the Analog DAC. The updated USB module should be available within a month.

Other than that, Mike is right. Aurender servers are already ahead of the game, as far as servers are concerned, by implementing the first two stages of MQA decoding. Not even Roon is doing that right now, AFAIK, and Aurender has it since Feb/17!

I'm guessing Aurender is emphasizing the A10 since it does the whole lot, one of the few products out there to do so, and at a very attractice price point as well! But they should make it clear also that all their other products (music servers) will do the first two stages of MQA, and then rely on a MQA-sanctioned DAC to do the final unfold...



cheers,
alex
 
Mark.......Park a Mytek Brooklyn DAC on top of your Aurender N100H and you're able to unfold full blown MQA for under $2K. If you discover the MQA experience to be satisfying, you can always move to a premium level MQA DAC and sell the Mytek.
 
BayStBroker said:
Three months ago I was so perfectly content with my Aurender N100H (4TB) that I couldn't think of one complaint. Today I sometimes think my Aurender is already obsolete. With MQA gaining momentum, I'm annoyed that my N100H won't act as an MQA core decoder. In addition, programs like JRiver, HQplayer, Roon and now Audirvana 3.0 allow me to upconvert PCM audio to a variety of sample rates, and even to DSD. (Tidal converted to DSD by Audirvana makes for improved sound from my Lampizator DAC, which likes DSD.)

Increasingly I am pulling my USB cable out from the back of the Aurender to plug it in to my laptop. After the hefty investment in Aurender, I'm not thrilled with this development. At AXPONA, Aurender was a front end presence in many, many rooms. If they want to keep it that way, they need to keep up.

One solution would be to allow Aurender to become "Roon Ready." I know they love their Conductor program, but then they should keep up with the competition.
Click to expand...

Interesting comments for I just spoke with the Aurender team about this very subject during the LA Audio Show. No plans whatsoever for Roon Ready integration. Aurender explained they would lose control in a way by doing so - they remain confident they can support their software but not someone else's. From a marketing perspective, it seems as if they are comfortable being the Roon alternative if you will...

Hope this helps you in your decision making moving forward


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
jdandy said:
Mark.......Park a Mytek Brooklyn DAC on top of your Aurender N100H and you're able to unfold full blown MQA for under $2K. If you discover the MQA experience to be satisfying, you can always move to a premium level MQA DAC and sell the Mytek.
Click to expand...

+1 This is what I am doing...great advice.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
"Audirvana Plus 3[FONT=&quot], announced at CES 2017, is [/FONT]the first audiophile player[FONT=&quot] that [/FONT]integrates the MQA Core Decoder."

Core decoding is a software function that doesn't need to happen at DAC level. Level 3 decoding is hardware specific and takes place on the DAC. Aurender could offer it on server lineup but they choose not to. Instead they promote full MQA function for the A10. To me this makes no sense. If they need some time to build the MQA core decoder into their firmware, they could just say so. Btw, I love the Conductor interface like many other people do. So it bugs me to plug in my laptop to stream Tidal MQA or (more frequently) to convert to DSD output.
 
Mark - Aurender is doing the same thing as Audirvana 3. Don't let Audirvana's marketing BS confuse you.

There are THREE stages of MQA. Aurender, Lumin, Audirvana and even the core Tidal desktop app allow the first two stages of MQA unfolding to occur.

The third and final stage can ONLY be unfolded by a certified MQA compatible DAC - NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER at the player side, UNLESS the player also contains a DAC (Aurender A10 now and Lumin players in the future).

MQA is master quality authentication from beginning to end. A music player is NOT the end. The DAC is the end.

"The MQA Core decoder's initial file "unfold" is claimed to recover all direct music-related information and make it available for either analog or digital output at 88.2 or 96kHz. Thus, even without an MQA-enabled DAC, listeners can expect to hear enhanced sound. Optimal sound quality is achieved with an MQA-enabled DAC, which will continue to unfold the file "with precise file and platform-specific DAC compensation and management." Clarification on what all this means follows."


Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content/audirvana-playback-software-now-unfolds-mqa#LQlzym3F08WwAtdZ.99


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I could not be happier with my N100H to my non MQA DAC, Mcintosh D1100 . The combo plays DSD64,128 , 256 and PCM up to over 300khz . For the price the N100H is a audiophile bargain. If your not happy with yours PM me, I may buy it for another system.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top