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  1. #1

    Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Does anyone compare the sound quality between the Ref 6 and Ref 5 SE side by side? What difference you have found?
    What is your choice if you can get a brand new Ref 6 at USD 10,100 and a brand new Ref 5 SE at USD 8750?

  2. #2
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    There is a nice write up in the current issue (MAY2016) of HiFi News about the new 6, and comparisons/differences to the 5se
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Mark Pearson, (MEP) here on the forum, reviewed the REF6 for Positive Feedback.....and compared it to the 5SE.

    ARC Ref 6 Review - PF (mep)
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  4. #4
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Quote Originally Posted by soundqcar View Post
    Mark Pearson, (MEP) here on the forum, reviewed the REF6 for Positive Feedback.....and compared it to the 5SE.

    ARC Ref 6 Review - PF (mep)
    This is a great write up, and having just gone from the 5se to the 6, I couldn't agree, more!! YMMV
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  5. #5
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Quote Originally Posted by MM622 View Post
    Does anyone compare the sound quality between the Ref 6 and Ref 5 SE side by side? What difference you have found?
    What is your choice if you can get a brand new Ref 6 at USD 10,100 and a brand new Ref 5 SE at USD 8750?
    Listened to both the REF6 and REF5SE on Aesthetix Atlas Signature monoblocks and Vandersteen Model 7 speakers. In my opinon, the REF6 was significantly better across the board than the REF5SE. The REF6 is on a par with some of the best preamps I've heard. I owned Pass XP-30 pre and currently own Soulution 520 pre, and the REF6 runs neck and neck with them. It punches way above its price point.

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  6. #6

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    I have both and is totally worth it the jump to REF6


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  7. #7
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    If anyone is interested in a mint condition ref 5se, I'm selling one. Pm me if interested. I also have a ref75. Both mint.

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  8. #8

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    How much would a trade up from a ref 5se to ref 6 cost?

  9. #9

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Quote Originally Posted by murphys33 View Post
    How much would a trade up from a ref 5se to ref 6 cost?
    Depends on how much you can get for your Ref 5SE and what you have to pay for the Ref 6. The retail difference is $1K.
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  10. #10

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    The last post on this thread is over two years old. Even still, I would like to post a few comments, though late, because I picked up a Ref 6 about a month or two ago. I traded in my very excellent Ref 5SE, which I thought was untouchable. Before sharing comments, it might be helpful to mention that my rig is all ARC, …. Ref 150 SE amp, Ref CD-8 CD player and PH-8 phone pre. I am driving very underappreciated Paradigm S8 (v3) beryllium tweeter speakers. One last point, the tubes in my CD-8 were stale, so I recently replaced them with new tubes.

    Ok, to the meat of it. Ref 6 versus Ref 5SE. The Ref 6 surpasses the Ref 5 in pretty much any way you want to compare.

    As far as bass/low-end is concerned, I thought the Ref 6 came with an invisible sub-woofer. My speakers are picking up information I never knew existed in my source material. It is not just bloated bass, but really tight. And btw, I started to de-tweak my rig by removing stuff, like my subwoofer. Don't need it. The Ref 6 passes along all the low-end information in a such a detailed and organized fashion that I do not miss the lowest octave, most of which was sonic bloat anyway.

    Moving up the sound spectrum, mids and highs are very airy. The soundstage is very convincing. Another attribute that I notice is that complex music, such as orchestral selections, is much less congested. Oftentimes when listening to familiar source material, I think that I picked up a better recorded version. No! It's the same source material, just presented much better than before.

    In short, while I love the Ref 5SE, I think the Ref 6 is a step above. I realize that many laud the Ref 10. I can't even imagine how it compares to the Ref 6. How good can great get??

    BIF
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  11. #11
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    I’m so happy that you love the Ref 6. It was never my cup of tea but love the Ref 10 and get more of what I love in a good preamp. I know I’m in the minority re: the Ref 6. I’m just saying I wasn’t crazy about it but there’s no doubt it’s a superb unit. The Ref 6 is ballsier than previous ARC preamps but I feel the Ref 10 is still has a bigger soundstage, more 3D, open sound that’s a little smoother to my ear. Kind of like a speedboat vs ocean liner.
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  12. #12

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    I hear ya Joe. As I said, I can't even imagine how good the Ref 10 sounds.

    On a different topic, Joe, do you direct stream music from the internet? I am trying to learn more about that sound media. I read on A'gon that many member speak highly of Tidal. I don't own a DAC, but if I take the plunge, I may swap out my ARC CD-8 for an ARC CD-9. The CD-9 does redbook and has a very good DAC.
    System description: VPI Classic "2.7" (basic Classic turntable plinth, with Classic 3 tone arm base and SS wand; upgraded stock Classic 600 rpm motor for 300 rpm motor); Lyra Kleos cartridge; VPI periphery ring and SS clamp; 35 pound maple TT slab base; ARC phono 3SE ; ARC Ref 6SE linestage; ARC Ref CD-9SE CD player; ARC Ref 150 SE power amp; Paradigm Signature 8 (v3)speakers w/ BE dome tweeters; Kimber Hero I/Cs; Kimber speaker cables.

  13. #13
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    I do stream a lot. I subscribe to Tidal, Deezer, Pandora and 3-4 more services. I know some look down on it but I can listen to just about anything, anytime. With a great dac and way to feed it, the sound can be awesome. To me, it’s the music that moves me and gets me emotionally involved, not just the quality. I have a bunch of high quality music on a server but feel I get just as much enjoyment streaming.
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  14. #14

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Joe, ... sorry to sound dumb, but when it comes to digital tech, I am a boob. So how do you "feed the DAC"? From what source? A regular PC? And how do you download music? To the PC? And if a PC, how do you connect it to the DAC? USB cables?

    Thanks

    BIF
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  15. #15
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Don’t feel bad, no dumb questions.

    I’m sort of in between DACs right now but you will have a choice of usb, spdif, aes/ebu, and a few others. A staple for me is a Wyred 4 Sound modified Sonos now feeding a Bricasti M1SE via a coaxial spdif. I’m exploring the option of upgrading my DAC with a network connection but that’s another story. When I used a Roon server on my previous DAC, it was fed via a RJ45 network cable.

    Your CD-8/CD-9 has either a usb or spdif digital input. You just need to figure out how much you are willing to spend to properly feed it. You can invest in a Lumin U1 or an Aurender type device to stream or use your computer and use a usb to spdif converter. There’s a million ways to get started. Let me check the specs on your ARC player and think of some solutions.
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  16. #16
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Looks like the CD-9 has 4 digital inputs giving you full flexibility.

    it will decode the following:
    DIGITAL SAMPLE RATES
    24 bits @ 44.1kHz to 192kHz, SPDIF, AES/EBU and USB 2.0 HS.


    Looks like a great unit. The easiest way to get started is to put a computer via usb into it and subscribe to Tidal. The world is your oyster.
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  17. #17
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    If you don't want or need internal storage or a stand-alone DAC the simple solutions are the Auralic Altair or the Lumin D2. Both excellent streamers with built in DAC's. Altair does give you the advantage on having full digital inputs to use it's DAC for other sources which the Lumin doesn't but both are easy to use and sound good. Comparable Aurender unit would be almost $5000.
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  18. #18

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Joe, … is it important that the DAC have internal storage or does one just store downloads on their PC? I checked the ARCDB web site and it does not appear that either the CD-9 or the DAC 8 have internal storage.

    So, if all one needs to do is use their trusty PC to connect with the Tidal website and then use a cable to connect the PC to the CD-9 or DAC 8, then I am good to go.

    I'm kinda hooked on ARC, so I would prefer to stay all ARC. IMO, there's a lot of synergistic benefits by staying with ARC all around.

    Thanks

    BIF

    P.S. I'm listening to DG Swan Lake redbook CDs on my CD-8. Wow. The Ref 6 makes a big difference.
    System description: VPI Classic "2.7" (basic Classic turntable plinth, with Classic 3 tone arm base and SS wand; upgraded stock Classic 600 rpm motor for 300 rpm motor); Lyra Kleos cartridge; VPI periphery ring and SS clamp; 35 pound maple TT slab base; ARC phono 3SE ; ARC Ref 6SE linestage; ARC Ref CD-9SE CD player; ARC Ref 150 SE power amp; Paradigm Signature 8 (v3)speakers w/ BE dome tweeters; Kimber Hero I/Cs; Kimber speaker cables.

  19. #19
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    There's no need for internal storage unless you have a decent amount of music. Jack makes great recommendations but all you need is a computer to start and a Tidal subscription with a decent usb cable. You'll get MQA up 96 kHz via your computer. A macintosh will not need drivers. A windows pc might. Anything you can hear on the computer can be played on the stereo.

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  20. #20
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Quote Originally Posted by joeinid View Post
    There's no need for internal storage unless you have a decent amount of music. Jack makes great recommendations but all you need is a computer to start and a Tidal subscription with a decent usb cable. You'll get MQA up 96 kHz via your computer. A macintosh will not need drivers. A windows pc might. Anything you can hear on the computer can be played on the stereo.

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    A very simple approach


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  21. #21

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Joe, you posted that "[y]ou'll get MQA up 96 kHz via your computer. A macintosh will not need drivers. A windows pc might. Anything you can hear on the computer can be played on the stereo."

    What is MQA? Is that medium quality audio? If so, that implies that the PC is a bottleneck to streaming excellent quality music.


    BIF
    System description: VPI Classic "2.7" (basic Classic turntable plinth, with Classic 3 tone arm base and SS wand; upgraded stock Classic 600 rpm motor for 300 rpm motor); Lyra Kleos cartridge; VPI periphery ring and SS clamp; 35 pound maple TT slab base; ARC phono 3SE ; ARC Ref 6SE linestage; ARC Ref CD-9SE CD player; ARC Ref 150 SE power amp; Paradigm Signature 8 (v3)speakers w/ BE dome tweeters; Kimber Hero I/Cs; Kimber speaker cables.

  22. #22
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    MQA is an essentially new decoding technique to recreate in your home what the mastering technician heard creating the album. For the most part it’s wonderful, my opinion. But you need an MQA authenticated dac. Your ARC piece will not decode MQA. That’s not a dealbreaker. A computer and the Tidal application will only give you the first unfold of a Tidal MQA file. Believe it or not, full blown MQA from an essentially cd quality Tidal file has the ability to be extracted to 24/352(?) I forget the maximum but it also depends on the file. So you will have plenty of room to grow. Because your downstream dac from the computer is not know to the software, the Tidal app only gives you limited MQA decoding but you get cd quality from everything else and potentially much higher resolution from Tidal MQA files.

    You need to start somewhere and get your feet wet. Running a pc into your dac is an inexpensive way to start.

    Of course, buying a Lumin U1 and feeding it to your ARC will give you a wonderful experience, however it retails for 5-6K. You get the full blown streaming service and the ability to attach a drive containing your music and never have to touch a shiny disc again.
    Last edited by joeinid; August 19, 2018 at 12:38 PM.
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  23. #23
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    https://www.computeraudiophile.com/c...for-civilians/

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  24. #24

    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Thanks Joe. Looks like I have a lot to learn. I saved the MQA article into my Outlook files for future reading.
    System description: VPI Classic "2.7" (basic Classic turntable plinth, with Classic 3 tone arm base and SS wand; upgraded stock Classic 600 rpm motor for 300 rpm motor); Lyra Kleos cartridge; VPI periphery ring and SS clamp; 35 pound maple TT slab base; ARC phono 3SE ; ARC Ref 6SE linestage; ARC Ref CD-9SE CD player; ARC Ref 150 SE power amp; Paradigm Signature 8 (v3)speakers w/ BE dome tweeters; Kimber Hero I/Cs; Kimber speaker cables.

  25. #25
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    All you need to start is a computer or a laptop to start and plug it into your dac with a $20/month Tidal subscription. See how it goes and don't stress. There are a myriad of ways to get better sound but cost goes up.

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  26. #26
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    Quote Originally Posted by Bifwynne View Post
    Joe, you posted that "[y]ou'll get MQA up 96 kHz via your computer. A macintosh will not need drivers. A windows pc might. Anything you can hear on the computer can be played on the stereo."

    What is MQA? Is that medium quality audio? If so, that implies that the PC is a bottleneck to streaming excellent quality music.


    BIF
    Hi BIF - glad to hear you’re loving the REF6. I sure love mine. You may want to look at a an all in one digital solution like the Lumin D2. It does MQA, has Tidal integration and more. No computer needed.


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  27. #27
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    Re: Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

    As a point of reference, cds are only 16/44.1 pcm.

    Anything higher is hi res, or high resolution. But there's also two types of music. PCM and DSD. Each is decoded differently.

    Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk
    Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.

    Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE

    NAD C 658 streamer.

    First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)

    Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.

    Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.

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Ref 6 vs Ref 5 SE

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