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Thread: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
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May 20, 2015, 07:51 PM #51
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May 20, 2015, 08:48 PM #52
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.
Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE
NAD C 658 streamer.
First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)
Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.
Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.
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May 20, 2015, 10:55 PM #53
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Joe,
PAB just released a new stand line custom made for Harbeth speakers. You can see the one made for the SHL5 : last pic, black one.
But the pic is not complete.
The stand is fitted with 4 Antivibration feet ( AVF ) that goes underneath. On the upper platform, 4 Lignofol disks will separate the speaker from its shelf. I tried to put AVF between the upper shelf and the speakers, so that makes 8 x AVF for one speaker. The bass at first became much tighter. But after a week, I found it too dry for my taste. Too damped. It lost some life so I asked Wladek to build just little Lignofol disks and the balance I got from 4 x Lignofol AVF on the floor and 4 x Lignofol disks underneath the speakers was the best I could find.
The platforms are made also from Lignofol, which is a very very dense plywood, extremely difficult to build. In Germany, this material was called "tank wood".
The 4 legs are made from high quality plywood.
I actually had the Skylan stand before and I improved it by using PAB AVF and Lignofol disks. I am very satisfied by the result.
I guess that the PAB stand may be better ( Actually I am SURE it is better ) but I do not plan to buy it now. Although I'm sure that they will replace the Skylan one day.
The french Harbeth importer uses one on the SHL5. He called to say that he was floored by the performance. He will now propose the PAB stands to all his customers.
To Paul :
Stands are important, but the most striking effect comes from decent decoupling from bearing devices like PAB and Stillpoints. Both for lower shelf and ground, and for upper shelf and speaker. No matter the stands you used. Spikes do NOT decouple the speaker.
I am sorry to tell you that if you found the bass of the 40.1 to be not to your taste, chances are very high that you did not decouple the speakers from the ground.
Anyway it does not matter. You now have wonderful speakers that you love so all is good. I am still very grateful to you for the opinions you gave me about Harbeth. I bought mine when you told me that the mids were better than PMC and you were right.
Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant TapatalkShindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 20, 2015, 11:37 PM #54
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Stand for the SHL5 and pic of two AVF and disks :
Attachment 11337
Attachment 11338
Attachment 11339Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 21, 2015, 01:48 AM #55
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
I never tried Stillpoints under my speakers and gear but one must know that Stillpoints are not ceramic bearings, ceramic balls only, and that's a big difference. According to a friend, ceramic balls would produce a thinner sound, while ceramic bearings are in a complete different league.
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 21, 2015, 02:05 AM #56
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May 21, 2015, 08:46 AM #57
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Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
If we're discussing the best stands for Harbeth 40's, it would be remiss not to mention the Acoustic Revive Custom Series stands which Jeff Day was so impressed by in his extended Chronicles of AR products. They would have to be on your short list if you're going all out, though not cheap
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May 21, 2015, 10:42 AM #58
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
I do not know if he compared them side by side on the same speaker. I will ask him.
I just know that he knows both systems pretty well and he prefers the PAB.
Of course the Stillpoints must be terrific. Or they would not sell them at this price.
But I do not consider them to be the "best" devices just because they are the most expensive ones.Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 21, 2015, 11:21 AM #59
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 21, 2015, 05:07 PM #60
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Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
That's fair enough Jerome. The PAB products do look very good. I'd be particularly interested to ask if your friend has tested the new Ultra 6's. Bruce Jacobs told me 3 Ultra 6's sound better than 4 Ultra 5's. My Dealer repeated that test & confirmed they are better. They can be further improved by using the Ultra bases which also add height adjustment.
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May 22, 2015, 01:41 AM #61
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Specifications
Transducer system 3-way vented: 300mm Harbeth bass unit; 200mm RADIAL2™ mid; 25mm Ferro-cooled soft dome tweeter
Freq. response 35Hz-20kHz +/-3dB free-space, grille on, smooth off-axis response
Impedance 6 ohms - easy to drive
Sensitivity 86dB/1W/1m
Amp. suggestion Works with a wide range of amplifiers, ideally from 35W/channel.
Power handling 650W programme
Connector Two 4mm gold-plated binding posts for wires or plugs
Dimensions (hxwxd) 750 x 432 x 388mm (+12mm for grille and binding posts)
Finish Cherry, eucalyptus, rosewood, tiger ebony.
Space needs Ideally free-space away from walls.
Stands To bring ears level with tweeters. (Tweeter: 660mm up from cabinet base)
Weight 38kg each
Packing Single speaker per shipping cartonFleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.
Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE
NAD C 658 streamer.
First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)
Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.
Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.
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May 22, 2015, 01:58 AM #62
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
David,
I am not surprised by this.
Vladek from PAB recommends 3 feet and not 4 under electronics. 1 plane of action instead of 4.
As my friend told me, the StillPoints work only by single contact on ceramic balls. There is no bearing. A bearing adds free movement in all planes so we are talking of 2 very different ways of action.
Moreover, the PAB feet can be ordered in various metals, or acrylic, or plywood ( Lignofol). They just released a full ceramic foot that I will try in a few days ( very expensive !). All sound different. Vladek told me that the ceramic ones are the best possible.
How much is the cost of an Ultra 6 ?
( PS: not sure if my friend knows the 6's. ).Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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May 22, 2015, 04:59 PM #63
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Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Bruce Jacobs from Stillpoints recommend a mix of 3 and 4 feet depending on the component. 4 feet under the power amp/pre/conditioner, and 3 feet under the cdp, whilst Hans Ole Vitus also recommended using 4 feet under my SCD-025's drive. So there is no hard and fast rule.
Did your friend provide commentary on how and why the Ultra 6's work, or a-b test those feet against the PAB feet in his system?
Stillpoints experimented with a lot of different materials, including composites and carbon before settling on stainless steel which they found transfers energy faster than Aluminum and is more stable. Stillpoints are designed so they do not alter the tonality of the connected component unlike many other feet. Everything about the design and materials used in Stillpoints has a specific purpose.
$899 each, or $939 with Ultra base
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January 1, 2016, 04:14 PM #64
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Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
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January 13, 2016, 06:39 PM #65
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
I am staying with my 40.1 and will die with them !
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 13, 2016, 06:42 PM #66
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Beautiful photos and setup Jerome! Love it.
Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.
Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE
NAD C 658 streamer.
First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)
Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.
Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.
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January 14, 2016, 01:39 AM #67
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January 14, 2016, 01:42 AM #68
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Jerome - great looking setup! Beautiful. I would love to hear it.
Jerome, have you ever heard of ISOAcoustics? http://www.isoacoustics.com/index.php I have a sneaking suspicion their stands would sound wonderful under Harbeth's. They had an excellent presentation & demo at CES.My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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January 14, 2016, 02:18 AM #69
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Jerome,
That's a beautiful setup indeed!
What turntable are you using?
Mike,
Thanks for the heads up on those stands. There seems to be a clear difference when the speakers are placed on the stands. Did you hear them at CES? If you did, what were your impressions?
So much for Alan's claim that ANY platform would do.
My only gripe would be that they have a cheap look. I wish they had a better finish and design. IMO, Harbeths generally look best on traditional looking stands, if you know what I mean.
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January 14, 2016, 04:18 AM #70
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 14, 2016, 04:19 AM #71
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January 15, 2016, 04:18 PM #72
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Jerome, that's just a gorgeous room and system! Thanks for sharing, exquisite taste in furnishings.
Mark
Kharma DB9 Signature
Pass Labs XP32......incoming
Pass Labs X350.8
Esoteric N-05XD
VPI Avenger with Magnetic Drive
Manley Chinook Phono Pre
Ortofon Cadenza Black cartridge
Kharma Elegance speaker cables
Kharma Elegance interconnects
REL Subs
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January 15, 2016, 10:09 PM #73
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Very nice system and room Jerome. C'est magnifique!
_______________
Mike
Amplification: MBL 6010D, MBL 9008A Monos
Analog: Kuzma R, Kuzma 4Point (11”), MSL Ultra Eminent EX
Phono Pre: Pass XP-27
Digital: Esoteric N01XD Esoteric K05
Speakers: MBL 101E MKII
Subwoofers: REL Carbon Specials
Conditioner: Shunyata Triton 3
Power Cables: Shunyata Sigma 1 & 2, Alpha 2, Delta and Venom
ICs and SCs: Wireworld Platinum 8
Rack: Artesania Exoteryc
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January 15, 2016, 10:10 PM #74
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Mark, Mike : thank you !
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 16, 2016, 12:39 AM #75
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Beautiful gear and room. You made a wise decision. Its a world class speakers.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPaul
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January 16, 2016, 06:33 AM #76
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January 16, 2016, 11:26 AM #77
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Beautiful room, Jerome! Perfectly suited for music enjoyment.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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January 16, 2016, 05:03 PM #78
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 17, 2016, 01:09 PM #79
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January 17, 2016, 03:19 PM #80
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
To my huge surprise, yes. The vocals on my Altecs are as good as the ones of the Harbeth. They sound a bit different though, the Altecs being less warm than the Harbeth.
But naturalness and transparency are top notch for both.
There is much more life in the Altec speakers. And they still sound musical and not "in your face". And the bass, although not going very low like Harbeth, is just faster, richer and cleaner than the Harbeth one.
The Harbeth are great for relaxing.
The Altecs are closer to the real life imho.Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 17, 2016, 05:18 PM #81
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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January 18, 2016, 02:35 AM #82
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January 18, 2016, 03:53 AM #83
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Yes maybe. But honestly I seriously doubt that you could reach with the 40.2 the level of "you're there" reached by high eff speakers.
The technology is so different. Very light paper membranes against heavy mass polymer ones with rubber suspensions. Just two different worlds.Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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January 18, 2016, 11:22 AM #84
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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January 18, 2016, 11:34 AM #85
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January 18, 2016, 12:10 PM #86
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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January 18, 2016, 12:35 PM #87
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January 18, 2016, 04:37 PM #88
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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January 18, 2016, 05:18 PM #89
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January 18, 2016, 11:27 PM #90
Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
I wouldn't say any other part of your quote but I can say this. I heard both pair and I choose the M40.1 over 40.2
The bass is simply amazing on 40.2 and it will be easy to work with various room without spending a much $$ on stands as what Jerome and I did and gives you bit more bite to mid range however same time you lose the that magic sweet mid range on new 40.2. YMMV.
Mike heard them at the show. Hope he can chime in his experience.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkPaul
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January 19, 2016, 01:02 AM #91
Re: Harbeth 40.2 Announced at Munich
That is interesting Paul. Although it is possible that what you heard was the effect of the different rooms and gear associated.
The only way to hear the real differences between the 40.1 and .2 would be to have both in the same room, with the same gear.
This will never happen because dealers have to first sell their 40.1 before ordering the 40.2.
And that lets the door wide open for all the marketing hype !Shindo, Nagra, Electrocompaniet, Harbeth, AMR, Mc Intosh, Auditorium 23, Rega, DeVore, JC Verdier, WireWorld, Kimber
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AudioShark forum is a leading forum site for High End Audio Discussion, Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater System Discussion, Best Home Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater Installation Discussion etc.
The AudioShark forum was created for sharing the passion of high-end Audio. We have Audiophiles from all over the world participating and sharing their knowledge. From novice to experts, you will find a friendly environment for discussing about High End Audio, Stereo System, Home Theater System, Home Stereo System, Home Theater Installation, Amplifiers, Speakers, Subwoofers, Integrated System, Acoustic treatments & Digital Room Corrections and many more.
At AudioShark, we also have incorporated an exciting Marketplace where members can peruse terrific buys on used gear, as well as meet dealers and discuss the purchase of new gear.
We are as crazy about this hobby as you are! So come on in and join us! Audioshark.org the Friendliest Audio Forum!
Industry Participation Disclosure : The owner and administrator of Audioshark is the owner of Suncoast Audio LLC in Sarasota Florida. Suncoast Audio has a full brick and mortar presence in Sarasota with several great show rooms with many world class brands. More information can be found at http://www.suncoastaudio.com
Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
The Audioshark.org Team
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