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Thread: Shootout Palooza
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February 28, 2015, 07:20 PM #1
Shootout Palooza
I spent the last 6 hours trying a bunch of different shootouts.
First I tried my Jena Labs Twin 15 speaker cables against Chord Sarum speaker cables (the chord Sarum tuned Aray has been one of the best interconnects I have heard especially running from arc ref2se to air tight preamp).
The Jena Labs won. More coherent, cohesive, harmonically/tonally pleasing, bigger more spacious soundstage. All the adjectives I use to describe something that sounds "musical" to me. The Chord Sarum won on speed and tight fisted bass. Not sure if it is due to some silver in the mix but there was a grip and detail on the bass that was exceptional. The downside is there was a little artificial brightness and splash on high end. Jena nailed the midrange. I think I will be moving up the Jena Labs line to the 31 strand speaker cable.
Next was Beck Sea Change MoFi playing on Modwright Sony, vinyl and DSD straight from Chord Hugo into Constellation Centaur using Hugo as preamp.
Hugo won on detail, clarity, and absolutely everything coming thru. Goldfinger on Spiral Groove took second place on being the Hoover for detail, and won on largest soundscape / creating a wall of sound. ModWright with gold untradisc was surprisingly good. Won as most analogue sounding digital source. Was a close second in overall best sounding.
Which leads me to final battle that had two parts. First with Beck spinning on all three turntables the AMG v12 with Benz LP-S won as most enjoyable "if I could pick only one to keep". Was full spectrum and musical and toe tapping get lost in the music. Not as much detail and not as large as spiral groove and Goldfinger statement but more balanced in delivery (a touch of warmth). Again I am surprised at how good the Modwright sounds - today better than my Clearaudio with graham phantom and mc Anna. Go figure.
Final part of the shootout was swapping audience au24se 20amp power cord with a Jena Labs new Model Two power cord / conditioner. The Jena Labs won. It removed all traces of sibilants without removing detail or ambience cues. The Audience at first seemed to allow more dynamics and energy through but going back and forth I realized the Jena labs was just as energetic but with more ease (if that makes sense).
So it was fun and exhausting, and I am more committed to upgrade path (Jena Labs) and to what components matter most (amgv12 and Benz LP-S) so I may be selling some cables, and a table or two. It is fun to have different sources not just for ease of use but to either match my mood / ears tonally or to better suit the recording.
Cheers. ImageUploadedByTapatalk1425165614.745444.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1425165647.050350.jpg
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March 1, 2015, 11:00 AM #2
Re: Shootout Palooza
Wow, what a great time ! It's amazing to me that the Benz LP-S is that good, I may have to try one sometime.
I've always loved the AMG table, I wish I could afford one.Mark
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March 1, 2015, 05:21 PM #3
Re: Shootout Palooza
Yes I think the LP-S is one of my favorite purchases ever. I believe it is the only piece of gear that is with me from the beginning of my audio journey 4-5 years ago. Replacing my first Benz cartridge with the LP-S on my first nice turntable (basis 2001) was revelatory.
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March 1, 2015, 05:27 PM #4
Re: Shootout Palooza
Great shoot out Darrin. Thanks for posting. You have some awesome gear, the AMG table must be great.
Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.
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NAD C 658 streamer.
First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)
Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.
Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.
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March 1, 2015, 06:33 PM #5
Re: Shootout Palooza
What is that under the S5s? Do they replace the stock spikes?
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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March 1, 2015, 07:21 PM #6
Re: Shootout Palooza
Cool Darrin! The V12/BENZ must be so enjoyable. I've heard good things about the Jena Labs from a friend of mine.
Thanks for the write up.
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March 1, 2015, 09:11 PM #7
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Re: Shootout Palooza
What I thought was jaw dropping was the difference between the LP, and then changed to the LPS. ....and then again when I removed the LPS from the 10.5 and listened with the VPI printed arm.
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March 1, 2015, 09:57 PM #8Myles B. Astor, Senior Editor, PF, www.positive-feedback.com
Zellaton Plural Evo speakers, Doshi Audio EVO phonostage, VPI Avenger direct-drive turntable/VPI 12-inch gimbal Fatboy/vdH Colibri Master Signature/Triangle Art Apollo cartridges, SAT LM-12 tonearms/Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, VPI 12-inch gimballed Carbon Fiber arm/vdh Black Crimson and Sumiko Songbird, Mutech Hayabusa cartridges
Technics RS1506 reel-to-reel with low inductance Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi Audio EVO tapestage, AudioQuest Dragon Zero, Audience FrontRow, Ensemble PC, Skogrand, Kubala-Sosna Realization speaker cable, Ikigai Kangai speaker cable, SRA Craz 3/OHIO 2.3 platforms and Symposium ISIS/Ultra rack/platforms, Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC.
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March 1, 2015, 11:42 PM #9
Re: Shootout Palooza
Yes I replaced spikes with stillpoint ultras with optional hats facing floor. I never did a comparison to spikes versus stillpoints. Magico says to not use anything but spikes due to height. I am confused by that since listening seat height and height of ears on the body are infinitely variable. Anyone try the spikes vs stillpoints and hear any differences? Part of putting the stillpoints for me was ability to scoot the speakers on my carpeted (second story) floor.
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March 1, 2015, 11:42 PM #10
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March 1, 2015, 11:43 PM #11
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March 1, 2015, 11:44 PM #12
Re: Shootout Palooza
Myles B. Astor, Senior Editor, PF, www.positive-feedback.com
Zellaton Plural Evo speakers, Doshi Audio EVO phonostage, VPI Avenger direct-drive turntable/VPI 12-inch gimbal Fatboy/vdH Colibri Master Signature/Triangle Art Apollo cartridges, SAT LM-12 tonearms/Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, VPI 12-inch gimballed Carbon Fiber arm/vdh Black Crimson and Sumiko Songbird, Mutech Hayabusa cartridges
Technics RS1506 reel-to-reel with low inductance Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi Audio EVO tapestage, AudioQuest Dragon Zero, Audience FrontRow, Ensemble PC, Skogrand, Kubala-Sosna Realization speaker cable, Ikigai Kangai speaker cable, SRA Craz 3/OHIO 2.3 platforms and Symposium ISIS/Ultra rack/platforms, Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC.
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March 2, 2015, 12:37 AM #13
Re: Shootout Palooza
I would like to upgrade the stock S5 spikes with some other grade spikes, for example the Mapleshade brass carpet piercing spikes. However, I have discovered, for me, the S5 sounds best with my ear slightly above the tweeter. Before I used a recliner for a chair, and while that was great for reading, it put my head below the tweeter. Fortunately, I have a couple of office chairs that let me sit ears above the tweeter. However, I suspect changing the spikes will then raise the tweeter above my ears.
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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March 2, 2015, 01:47 AM #14
Re: Shootout Palooza
I need to go back and read Myles' review - he had specific thoughts on tweeter to ear level. I think my ears are slightly below the tweeter. He is one of only two reviewers I have utter confidence in (other is Martin Colloms).
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March 2, 2015, 01:48 AM #15
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March 2, 2015, 06:37 AM #16
Re: Shootout Palooza
Myles B. Astor, Senior Editor, PF, www.positive-feedback.com
Zellaton Plural Evo speakers, Doshi Audio EVO phonostage, VPI Avenger direct-drive turntable/VPI 12-inch gimbal Fatboy/vdH Colibri Master Signature/Triangle Art Apollo cartridges, SAT LM-12 tonearms/Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, VPI 12-inch gimballed Carbon Fiber arm/vdh Black Crimson and Sumiko Songbird, Mutech Hayabusa cartridges
Technics RS1506 reel-to-reel with low inductance Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi Audio EVO tapestage, AudioQuest Dragon Zero, Audience FrontRow, Ensemble PC, Skogrand, Kubala-Sosna Realization speaker cable, Ikigai Kangai speaker cable, SRA Craz 3/OHIO 2.3 platforms and Symposium ISIS/Ultra rack/platforms, Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC.
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March 2, 2015, 09:11 AM #17
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- 966
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March 2, 2015, 12:48 PM #18Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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March 2, 2015, 12:53 PM #19
Re: Shootout Palooza
Exactly. So that would affect the sound and it would seem hard to separate whether the sonic changes were due to repositioning the chair or changing the height of the speaker? That is why I have tried to find a chair with a seat back that didn't come above shoulder height (or sit forward when listening).
Myles B. Astor, Senior Editor, PF, www.positive-feedback.com
Zellaton Plural Evo speakers, Doshi Audio EVO phonostage, VPI Avenger direct-drive turntable/VPI 12-inch gimbal Fatboy/vdH Colibri Master Signature/Triangle Art Apollo cartridges, SAT LM-12 tonearms/Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, VPI 12-inch gimballed Carbon Fiber arm/vdh Black Crimson and Sumiko Songbird, Mutech Hayabusa cartridges
Technics RS1506 reel-to-reel with low inductance Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi Audio EVO tapestage, AudioQuest Dragon Zero, Audience FrontRow, Ensemble PC, Skogrand, Kubala-Sosna Realization speaker cable, Ikigai Kangai speaker cable, SRA Craz 3/OHIO 2.3 platforms and Symposium ISIS/Ultra rack/platforms, Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC.
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March 2, 2015, 01:37 PM #20
Re: Shootout Palooza
While the chair probably has some effect, especially on any reflected sound sound from the rear, what I noticed is that as I pressed on the arms of the chair and raised my body up the sound level increased, and it became a bit clearer as my ears went slightly above tweeter level. This couild have been from removing my head from the barrier of the chair, or from putting my head into a posistion where I heard a bit more energy. Either way, I have moved the recliner out, and now use a chair that I can adjust the height setting. However, at max height it just puts me above the tweeter, so I am hesitant to increase the speaker height.
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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March 2, 2015, 02:20 PM #21
Re: Shootout Palooza
Amazing how simple things change the sound 10x more than a component or cable change. For example I have small ears. If I put my index finger behind my ear and push forward so out ear bends forward the openness and transparency multiplies incredibly. I need an audio accessory that i wear behind my ear that pushes my outer ear forward.
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March 2, 2015, 03:25 PM #22
Re: Shootout Palooza
LOL. Sounds like a market opportunity. There can be different models from entry to audiophile.
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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March 2, 2015, 03:46 PM #23
Re: Shootout Palooza
Perhaps you need a pair of Serious Listeners!
See #13.
Audio Asylum Thread PrinterMyles B. Astor, Senior Editor, PF, www.positive-feedback.com
Zellaton Plural Evo speakers, Doshi Audio EVO phonostage, VPI Avenger direct-drive turntable/VPI 12-inch gimbal Fatboy/vdH Colibri Master Signature/Triangle Art Apollo cartridges, SAT LM-12 tonearms/Lyra Atlas SL Lambda, VPI 12-inch gimballed Carbon Fiber arm/vdh Black Crimson and Sumiko Songbird, Mutech Hayabusa cartridges
Technics RS1506 reel-to-reel with low inductance Flux Magnetic heads, Doshi Audio EVO tapestage, AudioQuest Dragon Zero, Audience FrontRow, Ensemble PC, Skogrand, Kubala-Sosna Realization speaker cable, Ikigai Kangai speaker cable, SRA Craz 3/OHIO 2.3 platforms and Symposium ISIS/Ultra rack/platforms, Silver Circle Tchaik 6 PLC.
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March 2, 2015, 04:20 PM #24
Re: Shootout Palooza
Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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March 2, 2015, 04:49 PM #25
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March 2, 2015, 11:11 PM #26
Re: Shootout Palooza
A new trend. For me cupping effect is overkill - I just need bigger ears that bend forward more - although my wife would disagree!
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March 2, 2015, 11:19 PM #27
Re: Shootout Palooza
Also did some more listening today. Interestingly I preferred the MC Anna on the Innovation Wood - playing Dead Can Dance MoFi. Widest soundstage and meatiest miss and bass and most natural highs on some Mingus vinyl. Funny how depending on day and music my preferences shift. Especially on my Audeze LCD-X cans thru my ALO Studio Six I am loving the warmth and solidity of the mc Anna. It has a more anchored in space and gripped flavor to it. ImageUploadedByTapatalk1425352710.268417.jpg
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1425352742.375130.jpg
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March 9, 2015, 03:12 PM #28
- Join Date
- Jan 2015
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- 181
Re: Shootout Palooza
In some ways, my Sens have better sound than my speakers....
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March 9, 2015, 04:11 PM #29Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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AudioShark forum is a leading forum site for High End Audio Discussion, Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater System Discussion, Best Home Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater Installation Discussion etc.
The AudioShark forum was created for sharing the passion of high-end Audio. We have Audiophiles from all over the world participating and sharing their knowledge. From novice to experts, you will find a friendly environment for discussing about High End Audio, Stereo System, Home Theater System, Home Stereo System, Home Theater Installation, Amplifiers, Speakers, Subwoofers, Integrated System, Acoustic treatments & Digital Room Corrections and many more.
At AudioShark, we also have incorporated an exciting Marketplace where members can peruse terrific buys on used gear, as well as meet dealers and discuss the purchase of new gear.
We are as crazy about this hobby as you are! So come on in and join us! Audioshark.org the Friendliest Audio Forum!
Industry Participation Disclosure : The owner and administrator of Audioshark is the owner of Suncoast Audio LLC in Sarasota Florida. Suncoast Audio has a full brick and mortar presence in Sarasota with several great show rooms with many world class brands. More information can be found at http://www.suncoastaudio.com
Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
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