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  1. #1

    Intro System for a 25yo?

    My son has an interest in getting a decent starter system. Sole source today is streaming- Spotify premium.
    Budget $4-5k, say. Apartment living for a while, so book shelf rather than floor standing speakers.
    Listens to, oh, light rock (?), Dinosaur Jr is a favorite, Hendrix, Led Zep and such. Plays guitar (got an array of amps to include tubes, to compare distortion, so he listens well).
    He seems to want: punch/ fast attack, broad soundstage (wall of sound), on the warm side.
    Hardware ideas for him? Int. amp, streamer, speakers?
    Thx

  2. #2

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Smile View Post
    My son has an interest in getting a decent starter system. Sole source today is streaming- Spotify premium.
    Budget $4-5k, say. Apartment living for a while, so book shelf rather than floor standing speakers.
    Listens to, oh, light rock (?), Dinosaur Jr is a favorite, Hendrix, Led Zep and such. Plays guitar (got an array of amps to include tubes, to compare distortion, so he listens well).
    He seems to want: punch/ fast attack, broad soundstage (wall of sound), on the warm side.
    Hardware ideas for him? Int. amp, streamer, speakers?
    Thx
    I was thinking of something similar for my son as well.

    I plan to explore the B&W Formation Wedge Wireless Speaker. See review below:

    https://www.whathifi.com/us/reviews/...ormation-wedge

    The wedge can be placed on a shelf. You can use as a stand alone or you can add more speakers. They all work wirelessly which makes it nice for an apartment.
    Also It works with Spotify (and as a bonus it is a Roon endpoint).

    It is an active speaker (no need for separate amp) and is good to go out of the box. At less than $1k it is well within your budget.

    I have not listened to it yet but plan to.

  3. #3
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    When I got back into the hobby, I started with a Rotel RA-1592 / B&W 685 combo (with an Oppo 105D). Cost a bit over $3,000 and a very nice sounding bookshelf based system. And since the Rotel had pre-amp outputs, I could then gradually make my way from an integrated amp to separates when the budget and space allowed. The Rotel also had Bluetooth built in (with a dongle attached), so I could stream directly from my phone or my computer. At the time it wasn't the AptX standard (this was four or five years ago), but I'd bet more modern integrateds would use this better standard.
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  4. #4
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Smile View Post
    My son has an interest in getting a decent starter system. Sole source today is streaming- Spotify premium.
    Budget $4-5k, say. Apartment living for a while, so book shelf rather than floor standing speakers.
    Listens to, oh, light rock (?), Dinosaur Jr is a favorite, Hendrix, Led Zep and such. Plays guitar (got an array of amps to include tubes, to compare distortion, so he listens well).
    He seems to want: punch/ fast attack, broad soundstage (wall of sound), on the warm side.
    Hardware ideas for him? Int. amp, streamer, speakers?
    Thx
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  5. #5
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    I would look at something like the Hegel H190 with KEF R series or Dynaudio speakers in the budget. A decent set up but not what I'd call "warm"

    If really wanting "warm", but not too much, look at the McIntosh 252 and maybe a good B&W bookshelf.

    Streaming on the reasonable I like the HEOS Link around $349.00, I think would be fine for Spotify. There are better but more money. Hegel tweaks the Apple Airplay feature which could eliminate the streamer, it's usually an endpoint as well if he can use his computer. The Hegel has A DAC.
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  6. #6
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    The KEF LS50W would fulfill most of his requirements (wide soundscape, punch, clarity) but I wouldn't call them particularly warm. It would take care of streamer/DAC, amplification, and speakers.

    Quad has a new streaming integrated, the Artera, but I know nothing about it. The Quad VA One is a good tube integrated with Aptx BT and a DAC - I've owned the PA-One headphone amp and thought it was a great unit. However the VA One would present problems integrating a subwoofer as it only has speaker outs and no pre outs.

    For "warm" there's also Klipsch The Sixes which are significantly down-market from his $4-5K budget but as a Klipsch-head I have to throw them into the mix. I replaced a $2500 KEF LS50W system with a $300 Klipsch The Three in my great room and I love the damned thing.

    For "audiophile" Mr Peabody is probably dead-on the best place to start with the Hegel integrated.
    PRIMARY 2 CH SYSTEM: Backert Labs Rhythm 1.3; Parasound JC3+ Phono pre; Luxman M900u; Pure Fidelity Harmony with Origin Live Illustrious tonearm and PF Stratos cart; Naim NDX 2; Naim 555PS; Innuos Zen MK III (Roon Core); EtherRegen; Volti Audio Rivals; JL Audio e112 (2); Transparent Super Speaker Cables; Transparent Super interconnects; Transparent Premium & High Performance power cables; Naim Fraim; Stillpoints Ultra SS; Symposium Ultra platforms; IsoTek EVO3 Sigmas conditioner; GIK Acoustics absorption and diffusion panels

  7. #7
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    What Mr. Peabody and JSQT said. I'll add Klipsch speakers and Schiit amp/s.

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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by JSQT View Post
    The KEF LS50W would fulfill most of his requirements (wide soundscape, punch, clarity) but I wouldn't call them particularly warm. It would take care of streamer/DAC, amplification, and speakers.
    I would agree on the KEF LS50W. I have these in my second system and my 23 yr old son has them in his apartment. There are no components to deal with, unless you want to add a turntable. Spotify is easy. They have DSP to allow for different setup conditions. Truly a high value and easy to use product.
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  9. #9

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by JSQT View Post
    The KEF LS50W would fulfill most of his requirements (wide soundscape, punch, clarity) but I wouldn't call them particularly warm. It would take care of streamer/DAC, amplification, and speakers.

    Quad has a new streaming integrated, the Artera, but I know nothing about it. The Quad VA One is a good tube integrated with Aptx BT and a DAC - I've owned the PA-One headphone amp and thought it was a great unit. However the VA One would present problems integrating a subwoofer as it only has speaker outs and no pre outs.

    For "warm" there's also Klipsch The Sixes which are significantly down-market from his $4-5K budget but as a Klipsch-head I have to throw them into the mix. I replaced a $2500 KEF LS50W system with a $300 Klipsch The Three in my great room and I love the damned thing.

    For "audiophile" Mr Peabody is probably dead-on the best place to start with the Hegel integrated.
    What did you like better about the Klipsch that made you ditch the KEF? The sound? The features?

  10. #10

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    All good advice, thx.
    I see a Hegel 160 for sale; good and cheaper alternative? The inputs are a question to me. How would I add lower cost streaming? He's using ROKU, but it outputs in only HDMI.

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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Also, check in with Mike, the owner of this forum and of Suncoast Audio. One of the largest high end audio stores in the country. He has an excellent rep. I'm in the process of purchasing a system from him. No complaints. I'll get to know Mike better when I visit Suncoast Audio in October.

  12. #12
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Smile View Post
    All good advice, thx.
    I see a Hegel 160 for sale; good and cheaper alternative? The inputs are a question to me. How would I add lower cost streaming? He's using ROKU, but it outputs in only HDMI.
    Look at an all in one solution like the Lumin D2.
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  13. #13
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    That's a good choice. Grab a Bluesound Node 2i and he's good to go.
    PRIMARY 2 CH SYSTEM: Backert Labs Rhythm 1.3; Parasound JC3+ Phono pre; Luxman M900u; Pure Fidelity Harmony with Origin Live Illustrious tonearm and PF Stratos cart; Naim NDX 2; Naim 555PS; Innuos Zen MK III (Roon Core); EtherRegen; Volti Audio Rivals; JL Audio e112 (2); Transparent Super Speaker Cables; Transparent Super interconnects; Transparent Premium & High Performance power cables; Naim Fraim; Stillpoints Ultra SS; Symposium Ultra platforms; IsoTek EVO3 Sigmas conditioner; GIK Acoustics absorption and diffusion panels

  14. #14
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by nicoff View Post
    What did you like better about the Klipsch that made you ditch the KEF? The sound? The features?
    Just suited the purpose better for much less money. I was looking to add easy streaming in the great room and the KEF seemed like crazy overkill once I got it and listened to it for a few days. The sound was very "stereo-like" and not very exciting, which was fine for that room, as it was going to be mostly background music. But then when I thought about it, I realized for background music etc, I could pocket the $2000 difference and go with The Three instead. It's dynamic, has strong bass, streaming via bluetooth or high res via the HEOS app, and more than fills the entire space with excellent music.

    Just seemed the more practical choice for background music.
    PRIMARY 2 CH SYSTEM: Backert Labs Rhythm 1.3; Parasound JC3+ Phono pre; Luxman M900u; Pure Fidelity Harmony with Origin Live Illustrious tonearm and PF Stratos cart; Naim NDX 2; Naim 555PS; Innuos Zen MK III (Roon Core); EtherRegen; Volti Audio Rivals; JL Audio e112 (2); Transparent Super Speaker Cables; Transparent Super interconnects; Transparent Premium & High Performance power cables; Naim Fraim; Stillpoints Ultra SS; Symposium Ultra platforms; IsoTek EVO3 Sigmas conditioner; GIK Acoustics absorption and diffusion panels

  15. #15

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    This thread has been helpful to me since I am considering making a similar purchase. I read about the different products being recommended here and have concluded that in my case the active speaker route is the way to go. Any other option like streaming unit or integrated amps require buying another component (speakers) and makes the set up and installation more complex. I am leaning heavily toward the Klipsch The Three right now since I read that it also integrates easily with Google Home and Amazon Alexa.
    Thanks everyone!

  16. #16
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by nicoff View Post
    This thread has been helpful to me since I am considering making a similar purchase. I read about the different products being recommended here and have concluded that in my case the active speaker route is the way to go. Any other option like streaming unit or integrated amps require buying another component (speakers) and makes the set up and installation more complex. I am leaning heavily toward the Klipsch The Three right now since I read that it also integrates easily with Google Home and Amazon Alexa.
    Thanks everyone!
    As a fan of the Klipsch sound (I have Heresy IIIs and La Scala IIs) I'm really impressed with the sound of The Three. I feel obliged to mention a few caveats however...

    First, it is by no means an "audiophile" component; for using in an office, living room, etc it is hard to beat for sound quality to value. It's not even "stereo," but it does throw a large soundstage with plenty of bottom end and detail. For a higher end solution by Klipsch that is still a good value, you may want to check out the Sixes active bookshelf speakers. It's great for my situation.

    The other thing is, if you want to throw Spotify via Bluetooth to the Three, it is easy as pie. However if you expect to integrate it into a streaming setup like Roon or something it is not going to work. That's the advantage higher end components bring to the table. In fact, the Klipsch-branded HEOS app is the only way to integrate Tidal or Qobuz lossless/high res and that app is a huge pain in the ass. I generally use Spotify with The Three, unless I'm listening to a whole album from Qobuz, when I'll deal with the HEOS app.

    Hopefully that doesn't muddy the waters too much, but I felt obliged to point these things out.
    PRIMARY 2 CH SYSTEM: Backert Labs Rhythm 1.3; Parasound JC3+ Phono pre; Luxman M900u; Pure Fidelity Harmony with Origin Live Illustrious tonearm and PF Stratos cart; Naim NDX 2; Naim 555PS; Innuos Zen MK III (Roon Core); EtherRegen; Volti Audio Rivals; JL Audio e112 (2); Transparent Super Speaker Cables; Transparent Super interconnects; Transparent Premium & High Performance power cables; Naim Fraim; Stillpoints Ultra SS; Symposium Ultra platforms; IsoTek EVO3 Sigmas conditioner; GIK Acoustics absorption and diffusion panels

  17. #17

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by JSQT View Post
    As a fan of the Klipsch sound (I have Heresy IIIs and La Scala IIs) I'm really impressed with the sound of The Three. I feel obliged to mention a few caveats however...

    First, it is by no means an "audiophile" component; for using in an office, living room, etc it is hard to beat for sound quality to value. It's not even "stereo," but it does throw a large soundstage with plenty of bottom end and detail. For a higher end solution by Klipsch that is still a good value, you may want to check out the Sixes active bookshelf speakers. It's great for my situation.

    The other thing is, if you want to throw Spotify via Bluetooth to the Three, it is easy as pie. However if you expect to integrate it into a streaming setup like Roon or something it is not going to work. That's the advantage higher end components bring to the table. In fact, the Klipsch-branded HEOS app is the only way to integrate Tidal or Qobuz lossless/high res and that app is a huge pain in the ass. I generally use Spotify with The Three, unless I'm listening to a whole album from Qobuz, when I'll deal with the HEOS app.

    Hopefully that doesn't muddy the waters too much, but I felt obliged to point these things out.
    Thank you for the observations specially regarding Roon. I use Roon and for me connectivity with Roon is very important. On the other hand, I am quite sure that my son has never heard of Roon and would not mind at all.

    Since you mentioned Roon connectivity for yourself, have you considered using a Raspberry Pi as a Roon EndPoint? The Pi has an USB output and I noticed that The Three has a USB input so you might be able to connect the two together.

    Then all you do is set the Klipsch input to USB, and use your Roon app from your phone or tablet to play music to the RPI end point. The RPI sends a digital signal to the Klipsch.

    I built a RPI Roon end point (with a Digi+ Pro HAT) and used it to play Roon/Tidal to a preamp that has no Roon connectivity. It worked perfectly fine. It cost less than US$100.

    Edit:
    PS. I just looked at the Klipsch Sixes. They are not part of the Klipsch Stream Wireless Multi-Room System so future expandability would be limited. Also, The Sixes seem to cost the same as The Three.

  18. #18
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    In addition to the KEFs, I would also consider an ELAC system. Andrew Jones showcased a very dynamic and good sounding system at AXPONA earlier this year within the range you are seeking for your son.
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by nicoff View Post
    I was thinking of something similar for my son as well.

    I plan to explore the B&W Formation Wedge Wireless Speaker. See review below:

    https://www.whathifi.com/us/reviews/...ormation-wedge

    The wedge can be placed on a shelf. You can use as a stand alone or you can add more speakers. They all work wirelessly which makes it nice for an apartment.
    Also It works with Spotify (and as a bonus it is a Roon endpoint).

    It is an active speaker (no need for separate amp) and is good to go out of the box. At less than $1k it is well within your budget.

    I have not listened to it yet but plan to.

    I was also thinking of the Formation series.
    4-5K even buys you the Formation Duo.

    https://www.whathifi.com/reviews/bow...-formation-duo

    It seems that their specs (goes down to 25 Hz!) are not exaggerated...
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  20. #20

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by bluegrassphile View Post
    Also, check in with Mike, the owner of this forum and of Suncoast Audio. One of the largest high end audio stores in the country. He has an excellent rep. I'm in the process of purchasing a system from him. No complaints. I'll get to know Mike better when I visit Suncoast Audio in October.
    bought an Aurender from Mike.
    I

  21. #21
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    I happened to like the HEOS app. It's much better to me and offers more than Bluesound or Spotify. I enjoyed how HEOS provides the bios on the artist and the history I found useful, it keeps track of the last 500 or so tracks you played. Similar artists was another great feature.
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  22. #22
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    For a warm sound

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  23. #23
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    How you considered used? I would also recommend Parasound. You can get a pre and amp for around $2k. This would give you a great base to start with.

  24. #24
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Welcome to the forum, thank you for joining.
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    Intro System for a 25yo?

    Of your requirements are you looking only at "lifestyle"set ups and/or new gear?

    If he has literally any interest in audio, maybe bypass the lifestyle type product offerings and send him on his way with some inexpensive separates from the likes of Schiit, Nord, etc. that could provide connections for his needed digital doodads and then add passive loudspeakers of his liking to let him have a real stereo to start with?

    Just my 2 cents...
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  26. #26
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jdsmoke View Post
    How you considered used? I would also recommend Parasound. You can get a pre and amp for around $2k. This would give you a great base to start with.
    I own a Parasound A21 and it is not warm sounding. In fact, I gave it to my son and he is going to sell it to get something smoother and warmer. Their preamps are also not warm and fuzzy.

    For separates, I would consider the Schiit Frey+ preamp and Vidar amp or even better,
    Van Alstine Tube preamp for $899 and one of his new SET SS amps like the SET 120 and 400. I reviewed them on the AC forum for Frank VA. These amps are heavy hitters, smooth, slightly warm with a killer midrange and deep punchy bass and good high end. They can compete with $5K-$6K amps.

    An all Vincent Audio system would also be a way to go for a warmer sound.
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  27. #27
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    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    AVA and Vincent are good suggestions. Especially if wanting separates. Although Vincent does have some integrated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    I own a Parasound A21 and it is not warm sounding. In fact, I gave it to my son and he is going to sell it to get something smoother and warmer. Their preamps are also not warm and fuzzy.

    For separates, I would consider the Schiit Frey+ preamp and Vidar amp or even better,
    Van Alstine Tube preamp for $899 and one of his new SET SS amps like the SET 120 and 400. I reviewed them on the AC forum for Frank VA. These amps are heavy hitters, smooth, slightly warm with a killer midrange and deep punchy bass and good high end. They can compete with $5K-$6K amps.

    An all Vincent Audio system would also be a way to go for a warmer sound.
    Aurender ACS10 w/Audioquest Diamond USB, Esoteric N05xd
    Mark Levinson #526, 534 & JBL 4367's
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    SVS PC13 Ultra
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  28. #28

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    I ended up going for a Sonos Amp, Amazon Echo Dot solution combined with an existing pair of speakers. The Echo Dot can control the Sonos Amp via voice. Ease of use/simplicity won. Not a high end solution by any means but very easy to use and scalable.

  29. #29

    thumbsup Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    One of the very best options for an an entry level system is the Lumin Music M1 integrated amp streamer renderer DAC. Please see Lumin Music model M1.

  30. #30
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    17

    Re: Intro System for a 25yo?

    My son went shopping in the attic. Here's what he came up with. Belles Aria integrated, Rega RP1, ProAc Tablette. The Belles I had intended to repurpose in my office but he got to it first. It's a pretty nice setup for a small room.
    Toolshed Amplifiers 300b DHT amp, Supratek Cabernet DHT preamp, Weiss 502 DAC, Spatial Audio X3 open baffle speakers, Pro-ject RS2T transport, Silversmith speaker cables, Grover Huffman ICs.

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Intro System for a 25yo?

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