Results 151 to 200 of 545
Thread: Why no turntable?
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July 13, 2019, 07:31 PM #151
Why no turntable?
I’m strongly considering adding Analog, but strictly under budget and in comparison to what I have assembled, I’m curious if what I spend will be worth it?
The Clear Audio Concept interests me and their phono amp; will it bring me the best qualities analog is known for?
Will it be better or just different than my digital?
Does it matter?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProSource Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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July 13, 2019, 07:42 PM #152
Re: Why no turntable?
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 13, 2019, 08:15 PM #153
Re: Why no turntable?
Again, I clearly said I was talking about streaming music over the internet and not your files loaded on hard drives on your home network. Unless you have SSDs, you still have spinning motors at crazy RPMs. You still have reliability issues with your NAS, server, and DAC.
Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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July 13, 2019, 08:29 PM #154
Re: Why no turntable?
Source Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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July 13, 2019, 08:51 PM #155
Re: Why no turntable?
I’ll bet you will really enjoy it and begin to listen differently (entire albums vs jumping around tracks and artists). The thing with a vinyl rig is that you don’t have to go nuts (like $400,000 AF Zero).
The VPI HW40 ($15,000) or Avid Acutus DARK ($14,000) with a Ortofon Cadenza Black or similar and a Zesto Phonostage or Manley Chinook or Luxman EQ500 would be an absolute killer rig (and a killer rig in 10 years from now).
BUT, start with a simple, less expensive setup to make sure you really like it. I’m betting you’ll love it. If you do, don’t forget to budget for a record cleaning machine. Everyone bitches about the cost of them, until they get it and then say it’s the best investment they’ve ever made. ClearAudio Double Matrix is the best. But Uber $$$. But worth it IMO.
I would grab a few Music Matters jazz albums before they’re all gone, unless you’re not into jazz. Then, start to research some of your favorite albums and find the good pressings (Acoustic Sounds, Elusive Disc, Discogs). Pay attention to the source of the pressing (if it’s tape, rock on. If it’s digital files, proceed with caution.). For example, the most recent Led Zeppelin releases are cut from the 24/96 files. When you compare those to any of the Classic Records (cut from the master tapes, and the last time those tapes were touched), it’s game over. I’m listening to Led Zeppelin II (Classic Records) right now and it’s incredible. That being said, the latest pressings aren’t bad and are cheap compared to finding a Classic Records release.
For fun, pick up a first pressing of the 1965 Frank Sinatra Strangers in the Night. —> https://www.discogs.com/sell/item/892086462
Buy 10 albums to start. That will get you going.My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 13, 2019, 09:21 PM #156
Re: Why no turntable?
Yes SSDs. But even regular HDs are more reliable than turntables. I have (knock on wood) zero reliability issues with any digital. Period.
But you went further, you clearly implied that digital was not as reliable as LPs.
The bolded part is, quite frankly, nonsense. Poor internet connectivity has nothing to do with "digital" playback reliability, which is superior to any form of archaic "analog". You are conflating digital with internet.
If the internet goes down, queue up a CD or a local file or a network file. Instantly.
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July 13, 2019, 09:38 PM #157
Re: Why no turntable?
this point is a biggie for me. Shuffle play, play lists, yada yada is nothing more than muzak. would you listen the 4th movement of Pathétique first and then jump back to the 2nd? im not the arbiter of good taste or really care what one does within the confines of their domicile, but skipping around tracks is akin to starting a book on chapter 12 then going straight to chapter 3 then starting a new book on chapter 7 before you even finish the first book! Do you also fast forward through movies just the watch the end and then rewind to the middle? or eat dessert between the 1st and 2nd to last course? its moronic. the next thing you'll be admitting to is regularly listening to yer $500k of hifi 50 ft away off the patio deck while reading the paper
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July 13, 2019, 09:44 PM #158
Re: Why no turntable?
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 13, 2019, 09:52 PM #159
Re: Why no turntable?
This is a GREAT list to work from:
https://www.analogplanet.com/content...s-worth-owningMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 13, 2019, 09:54 PM #160
Re: Why no turntable?
I’m listening now to two new CDs I bought and ripped today. So far, with the first CD there are two tracks, out of 16, that I will add to my Rock playlist. Now to listen to the 2nd CD, and find it’s decent tracks.
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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July 13, 2019, 10:32 PM #161
Re: Why no turntable?
I can’t tell you the last time I found ONE Album that I didn’t want to skip at least one track. I can’t remember the last album that didn’t have a shit track unworthy of a second listen. Why would I waste 3 1/2 minutes listening to something I don’t enjoy? I don’t eat crappy food just because some chef presents it to me. I don’t stand in front of a painting that doesn’t capture my attention.
Puroagave’s example of us re-sequenceing music or books for fun is plain hyperbole. We do it to not waste time listening to crappy tracks not because we are hyper kinetic.Jim
D'Agostino Momentum M-400's MxV’s & HD Pre-amp
Wilson Alexandria X2 Series 2 speakers
Digital: dCS Vivaldi APEX DAC, Clock & Upsampler
Analog: SME 20/3 with Esoteric E-03 Phono
Transparent Opus Speaker Cable & Interconnects & Opus Power Cords
Power Cords on Digital: Shunyata
Power Conditioner - Shunyata Everest
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July 14, 2019, 12:47 PM #162
Re: Why no turntable?
Source Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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July 14, 2019, 12:48 PM #163
Re: Why no turntable?
Source Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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July 14, 2019, 06:42 PM #164
Re: Why no turntable?
You’re picking fly shit out of pepper now AJ. If your only source for digital music is streaming, you are screwed if you lose your internet connection. Next you will argue that no one does that. If you are using a headless server and your WiFi goes down, your remote app won’t work.
Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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July 14, 2019, 06:53 PM #165
- Join Date
- Apr 2013
- Posts
- 1,622
Re: Why no turntable?
At one point I was very much into vinyl but these days with the convenience, not to mention the “economics” of streaming services and virtually unlimited selection of music, it is difficult for me to convince myself to get back into it. That’s not to say I didn’t appreciate the analog qualities of vinyl playback with a good turntable, cartridge and phonostage.
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July 14, 2019, 07:03 PM #166
Re: Why no turntable?
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July 14, 2019, 07:23 PM #167
Re: Why no turntable?
Btw, I don't know a single audiophile whose only source of music is streaming. Teen kids, sure. Audiophile, not one.
I do know countless audiophiles who are digital only...with no streaming whatsoever.
CDs came out in the 80s. Plenty folks went full digital that far back. Tidal launched in 2014. Gimme a break that audiophiles were streaming Spotify only as there music source prior.
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July 14, 2019, 07:27 PM #168My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 14, 2019, 07:34 PM #169
Re: Why no turntable?
No CDs, SACDs, no Lumin files, etc? Only stream these days?
Swore you had an MQA CD not far back....
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July 14, 2019, 07:42 PM #170
Why no turntable?
Not me. A client of mine. He’s 100% streaming.
Me? 12,000 LP’s, 2,000+ CD’s and SACD’s, 50+ tapes. I have a really bad habit of buying music. I probably buy 10+ albums a month or more. I’m running out of room. But that won’t stop me.
I stream to find albums and then buy the CD, SACD, LP. But honestly, I mostly listen to music from the 50’s, 60’s and 70’s, so I just order it if the pressing is expected to be good.My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 14, 2019, 08:25 PM #171
Re: Why no turntable?
It's not ridiculous because it happens.
You like to put words in peoples' mouths to lend credence to your arguments. Lots of people stream music. Yes, you can be full digital with zero internet, but most people who are into digital have both. I never said that digital streaming and listening to digital files from your hard drive was the same.Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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July 14, 2019, 08:25 PM #172Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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July 14, 2019, 09:08 PM #173
Re: Why no turntable?
It's ridiculous because "digital" is infinitely more reliable than turntables, period. Turntable unreliability "happens" too, a lot more often.
Your hand waving and red herrings not withstanding.
Because it isn't and is a red herring/false equivalence of your creation. I quoted your claim multiple times.
If one has internet issues, get a new ISP, or start using digital files.
Both are still far more reliable than 19th century needle dragging tech.
Why no turntable?
Because they are not as reliable.
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July 14, 2019, 09:11 PM #174
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July 15, 2019, 08:12 AM #175
Re: Why no turntable?
herein lies the conundrum...
~$5k seems to only get you a teaser analog rig which, presumably, will be unsatisfying.
~25k gets you a killer rig which brings out the "best qualities" of vinyl... which is the whole point here, right?
believe me, i really want to add analog... but, the $5k route seems inefficient. why not just go straight to the intended destination? so, looks like $25k is the price to get past the velvet rope and that is a different set of calculus...
is adding a good analog source really worth $25k?
why not just go all-in on digital with a killer DAC?
heck, why not rent a house in tuscany for a year and enjoy the weather, food and wine?
in the end, maybe just too much puritan frugality standing between me and vinyl bliss.viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | almarro a318b + air tight atc-5 (phono) | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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July 15, 2019, 08:28 AM #176
Re: Why no turntable?
All valid points. I’m part of a few groups of vinyl lovers and 95% don’t have a analog rig more than a VPI Prime or even VPI Scout or similar from Avid or ClearAudio. These folks start out with a few records from GoodWill for 75 cents. Within a few months they are buying Music Matters, Analog Productions, MOFI, finding rare first pressings, etc. You NEVER EVER EVER hear them say, “oh geez, I should have bought a CD player.” In fact, I had to look hard to find a group dedicated to CD’s (I found ONE). But there are dozens of vinyl groups. Hell, there is a group dedicated to just Music Matters pressings - and there are only about 165 (I have them all). There are groups just for MOFI pressings. Vinyl collector groups are everywhere. That’s the fun.
My point is that it becomes more about the collecting of the records and the listening to them, then who’s got the best turntable. In fact, most guys don’t give a shit which turntable you have. They’re more interested in your take on a particular new pressing or a rare old one.
I haven’t witnessed too many turntable fights. Why? Because the turntable guys want them all and love them all. I would love that black gold AF3 TT. OMG, it’s so pretty and yet, I sell AF’s number one competitor - Kronos. I would love an SME, Kuzma or ClearAudio. There isn’t a bad one in the bunch.
The only squabbles I’ve seen is when you see things getting out of hand like $35,000 tone arms and $400,000 tables. Are they good products? Sure, but as I’ve said, buy the $25K rig instead and get $375,000 worth of records!
So you start with a simple setup and start enjoying a part of the hobby you may not have ever experienced before or haven’t done for a long time. Unlikely you will be thinking of a better turntable for a few years. You will be probably more focused on finding that Japanese pressing of DSOTM.My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 15, 2019, 08:38 AM #177
Re: Why no turntable?
wow!! now that is a convincing argument and, i think, answers the question posed in the OP definitively.
i am in... project for 2020viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | almarro a318b + air tight atc-5 (phono) | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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July 15, 2019, 08:44 AM #178My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 15, 2019, 08:47 AM #179
Re: Why no turntable?
Even $5k is a lot to "try" vinyl again. I had vinyl. In the day it really was the only choice for top flight sound. I had Nakamichi decks and a top flight tuner as alternatives to listening to turntable. The tape was mainly used to make my own playlists (I make and delete playlists all the time now). But at that time vinyl was the only game in town.
Now, yes vinyl is a "thing" and I know a few who love the albums and "playing" with their turntables and record cleaning machines. I personally do not look back fondly to the days when I cleaned an album with every playing (other wise I feared that I would damage that fragile vinyl disk)... very loud first generation VPI machine... and constantly making sure my SME III arm was adjusted as good as possible, and making sure the my Grace Ruby cartridge was perfectly clean. And my ex did break off the ruby cantilever and stylus once when she was "dusting".
Honestly, I don't look back to those days fondly. And when I listen to a friend with a 1/4 million dollar rig and the first thing I hear is pops and clicks I go home and listen to the DSD512 decoded output from my T+A ($4500 retail) and I smile, enjoying it a ton more than his turntable (no idea costs) and his $30k phono pre (Audio Research Ref 10 phono pre-amp). This is just me, of course he swears by his vinyl and that is 100% ok. To each his own!McIntosh C49, MC152, MR85, R778 | T+A DAC 8 DSD | KEF LS50 Meta w/S2, KC62 (x2) | Rega RP8, Ania Pro, NEO PSU | Technics SL-1500C | Audio Technica VM750ML | Hexmat Eclipse, Yellow Bird, Molekula, Molekula Mini | Pro-Ject VC-E | Falcon NW PC Server (Roon Core & HQPlayer) | Microsoft Surface Pro 6 (Roon Controller) | Wyred 4 Sound ISO Recovery, DC Recovery | Abyss Diana Phi | Schiit Jotunheim 2 | Astell&Kern SE200 | Oppo BDP105
“One of the great challenges in life is knowing enough to think you're right but not enough to know you're wrong”
"You can't use reason to convince anyone out of an argument that they didn't use reason to get into"
― Neil deGrasse Tyson
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July 15, 2019, 09:16 AM #180
Re: Why no turntable?
If you’re phased only by analog noise and not by digital noise , then congrats , the rest of us will have to just struggle along , enjoying both of course ...
Regards
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July 15, 2019, 09:18 AM #181
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July 15, 2019, 09:27 AM #182
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July 15, 2019, 09:32 AM #183
- Join Date
- Jan 2017
- Location
- Leyden
- Posts
- 596
Re: Why no turntable?
Pre amp: Ocatve Phono Module Power amps: Octave MRE130 Turntable: SAC Girati Grande. Tonearm: Dynavector 507mkII Cartridge: Dynavector Ikeda 9TT Streamer: Aurender A10 Power Distributor: Anzus Mains D8 Speakers: Raidho X-3 Speaker Cables: AudioQuest Rocket 88 XLR Interlink: Ansuz A2, [B]XLR Interlink: [B]Phono interlink: Cammino Serie 1.0 - PH 1.0s Power cables: Anzus Mains Ceramic, two Pom, Aluminium, X series Audio Rack: Rack of Silence 4 and 2.
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July 15, 2019, 09:38 AM #184
Re: Why no turntable?
Analog TT is driven more by setup , combination and alignment than cost. There are basic TT Jungle laws if followed narrows the gap. The really top notch expensive stuff allows a wider performance window going from pressing to pressing , pulling more out of the groove so to speak...
Regards
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July 15, 2019, 11:43 AM #185
Re: Why no turntable?
I can't/won't dispute this. All I can say is that I rarely notice anything that I would classify as digital noise (I'm also sure it is there but it does not appear to affect me much), but I instantly notice noise from any vinyl system I hear, weather it is the tell tale pops and clicks or the inherent low level hums, etc., that seem to be the norm in phono listening. Then again I have never owned or lived with systems the level that I see discussed here. Us middle class worker bees would never be able to wildly consider spending $25k + on a vinyl setup.
McIntosh C49, MC152, MR85, R778 | T+A DAC 8 DSD | KEF LS50 Meta w/S2, KC62 (x2) | Rega RP8, Ania Pro, NEO PSU | Technics SL-1500C | Audio Technica VM750ML | Hexmat Eclipse, Yellow Bird, Molekula, Molekula Mini | Pro-Ject VC-E | Falcon NW PC Server (Roon Core & HQPlayer) | Microsoft Surface Pro 6 (Roon Controller) | Wyred 4 Sound ISO Recovery, DC Recovery | Abyss Diana Phi | Schiit Jotunheim 2 | Astell&Kern SE200 | Oppo BDP105
“One of the great challenges in life is knowing enough to think you're right but not enough to know you're wrong”
"You can't use reason to convince anyone out of an argument that they didn't use reason to get into"
― Neil deGrasse Tyson
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July 15, 2019, 12:28 PM #186
Re: Why no turntable?
That's because you can't hear inside Mr Waynes head where it originates/resides.
It doesn't exist in physical reality of measurable soudwaves, or else it would be demonstrable, like LP snap, crackle, pop.
No imagination needed to hear, or surprise, surprise, measure that. Because it's real.
Vinylphiles somehow ignore it, we can't. I have heard relatively quiet vinyl playback. Actually sounds great with stuff like Elvis, etc, better than the digital release versions. Then they queue up some classical....
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July 15, 2019, 12:47 PM #187
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July 15, 2019, 12:50 PM #188
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July 15, 2019, 12:50 PM #189
Re: Why no turntable?
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July 16, 2019, 11:45 PM #190
Why no turntable?
Blondes...Brunettes
Ferraris...Porsches
Gibsons...Fenders
Vinyl...Digital
Why choose only one?
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkRockport Lyra speakers; TotalDac Amp-1 mono blocks; four box CH Precision L1/X1 pre/power supply monos; CH precision P1/X1 phono/power supply; TotalDac d1-driver monos; Pacific Microsonics Model 2 DAC; TotalDac d1-12 MkII DAC with two reclockers; Kodo The Beat Turnatable with LT Schroder magnesium tonearm and Lyra Atlas cart; Taiko Extreme server; Kalista Dreamplayer CD Transport; Taiko Audio Daiza Platforms; Nordost Odin2 Power Cords and Analog ICs; 512 Engineering/Tim Marutani Balanced Transformers (30 amp for sources; 50 amp for amps); Rives designed dedicated room.
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July 17, 2019, 12:06 AM #191
Re: Why no turntable?
No Ed, don't do it. It is as big a hole as digital. Never ending trying to extract the best. And its hard. Very hard to learn and really set up right. Joe can set it up, but, he sells VPI. Then you need a phono preamp. Another pit of what to get. How to select. Then the cartridge. More owe my god. It will keep you from listening to music. And, your digital setup is going to slaughter any vinyl rig unless you spend $30K or more. Your really are at the pinnacle of digital. It will be hard to match it.
Owe yea, it takes up a lot of room because it needs a dedicated stand to meet the expectation you are going to place on it. And where is that going to go in your listening room. Your speakers are very powerful. They will inject sound waves right into any TT near them.First Sound Mark3SI preamp. Audion Black Shadow 845 SET Monoblocks. Mojo Audio Deja Vu Server. Mojo Audio Mystic 3 DAC. Linear Solution Ethernet Switch. Gigafoil with LPS. STST Motus II TT with Vertere SG1 arm, Hana ML Cartridge, Allnic H1201 phono pre. Pure Audio Project Trio 15 Horn speakers with Mundord Supreme oil caps. Power via 10 awg Oyaide cable from panel to custom distribution strip feeding front end. Oyaide dedicated10 AWG branch circuits from panel to each amp. Inakustik speaker and interconnect cables, Genesis Interconnect.
Kingrexelectric.com Lyncole certified grounding specialist.
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July 17, 2019, 12:12 AM #192
Re: Why no turntable?
Aside from the cost and maintenance hassle, the biggest issue for me with analog is you can’t create playlists of songs you like. Being able to do that with my Lumin gives me hours of uninterrupted pleasure listening to music.
Bud
Lumin X1 file player, Westminster Labs interconnect cable
Sony XA-5400ES SACD
Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes
Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR for source, Denali 2000 (2) for amps
Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables
Mapleshade Samson four shelf maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
Three 20 amp circuits.
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July 17, 2019, 02:17 AM #193
Re: Why no turntable?
Source Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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July 17, 2019, 08:15 AM #194
Re: Why no turntable?
i assume most here have seen this new yorker cartoon. if not, enjoy...
viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | almarro a318b + air tight atc-5 (phono) | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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July 17, 2019, 08:16 AM #195
Re: Why no turntable?
Another one bits the dust ...
I could never go back. All the hassles associated with vinyl would interfere with my enjoyment of music. I hear people say the hassles of digital , and I wonder how in the world is digital more of a hassle then caring for and setting up a turntable and keeping said table from ruining my albums.... and storage of those albums and record cleaning machines and isolating that table from sound waves in the room, and.... and... and... and then my head starts spinning...
especially when I know how straight forward and simple digital can be... much less so if you do not depend on streaming and "services" but instead keep your music locally.McIntosh C49, MC152, MR85, R778 | T+A DAC 8 DSD | KEF LS50 Meta w/S2, KC62 (x2) | Rega RP8, Ania Pro, NEO PSU | Technics SL-1500C | Audio Technica VM750ML | Hexmat Eclipse, Yellow Bird, Molekula, Molekula Mini | Pro-Ject VC-E | Falcon NW PC Server (Roon Core & HQPlayer) | Microsoft Surface Pro 6 (Roon Controller) | Wyred 4 Sound ISO Recovery, DC Recovery | Abyss Diana Phi | Schiit Jotunheim 2 | Astell&Kern SE200 | Oppo BDP105
“One of the great challenges in life is knowing enough to think you're right but not enough to know you're wrong”
"You can't use reason to convince anyone out of an argument that they didn't use reason to get into"
― Neil deGrasse Tyson
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July 17, 2019, 08:53 AM #196
Re: Why no turntable?
A true music lover listens to entire albums start to finish, no matter how torturous individual tracks are. Take the pain.
Oddly enough, I listened to 2 Rachmaninoff symphonies back to back last night...on my digital rig. No irresistible urge to hit shuffle/random play. Weird.
Btw, speaking of "analog" playlists, aren't cassettes making a comeback?
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July 17, 2019, 09:22 AM #197
Why no turntable?
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Most of those telling you not to do it, don’t presently own a turntable. Hmmm. And memories are a fickle thing. I don’t know who “Joe” is, but VPI is a real good one. Get a Prime and a nice Ortofon or similar cart and you’re in your budget.
Setup is hard? No. And it’s something you should learn anyway. Reading glasses help. Buy and watch this video and you’ll have a new skill —> https://www.amazon.com/21st-Century-.../dp/B000HA4WU2
There are dozens of videos online as well like this one:
https://youtu.be/VfJnMtolAWo
But I would definitely get the Fremer one and watch it. That being said, I’m sure your dealer will set it up for you, but frankly, it’s really a skill you want to know yourself. You will need a few basic tools and you’re on your way. VPI’s come with a scale.
Phonostage? SimAudio makes one for about $300. iFi too (iPhono 2). You can go up from there. The Manley Chinook is a killer for the $$.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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July 17, 2019, 09:51 AM #198
Re: Why no turntable?
The only problem with the Fremer one is that he is a pompous ass ... I admit to not watching this dvd/video, however I have seen videos and read many a review. I watched the video where speakers were being delivered to his "listening space" (I can't in good conscience call it a listening room). I have never seen a bigger mess in my life and the way he treats insanely expensive gear is simply overwhelming, frustrating, irritating, and above all else disrespectful.
McIntosh C49, MC152, MR85, R778 | T+A DAC 8 DSD | KEF LS50 Meta w/S2, KC62 (x2) | Rega RP8, Ania Pro, NEO PSU | Technics SL-1500C | Audio Technica VM750ML | Hexmat Eclipse, Yellow Bird, Molekula, Molekula Mini | Pro-Ject VC-E | Falcon NW PC Server (Roon Core & HQPlayer) | Microsoft Surface Pro 6 (Roon Controller) | Wyred 4 Sound ISO Recovery, DC Recovery | Abyss Diana Phi | Schiit Jotunheim 2 | Astell&Kern SE200 | Oppo BDP105
“One of the great challenges in life is knowing enough to think you're right but not enough to know you're wrong”
"You can't use reason to convince anyone out of an argument that they didn't use reason to get into"
― Neil deGrasse Tyson
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July 17, 2019, 10:28 AM #199Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.
Reviewer for Positive Feedback
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July 17, 2019, 10:39 AM #200
Re: Why no turntable?
He has always been kind to me and you know what? When we launched the Florida Audio Expo, Jason and Michael from Stereophile jumped right in to cover it and all the guys from Part Time Audiophile and Enjoy The Music too. The guys from TAS told us to go pound sand. Michael gave several seminars that people are still talking about today. I don’t forget those things.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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Industry Participation Disclosure : The owner and administrator of Audioshark is the owner of Suncoast Audio LLC in Sarasota Florida. Suncoast Audio has a full brick and mortar presence in Sarasota with several great show rooms with many world class brands. More information can be found at http://www.suncoastaudio.com
Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
The Audioshark.org Team
AudioShark forum is a leading forum site for High End Audio Discussion, Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater System Discussion, Best Home Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater Installation Discussion etc.
The AudioShark forum was created for sharing the passion of high-end Audio. We have Audiophiles from all over the world participating and sharing their knowledge. From novice to experts, you will find a friendly environment for discussing about High End Audio, Stereo System, Home Theater System, Home Stereo System, Home Theater Installation, Amplifiers, Speakers, Subwoofers, Integrated System, Acoustic treatments & Digital Room Corrections and many more.
At AudioShark, we also have incorporated an exciting Marketplace where members can peruse terrific buys on used gear, as well as meet dealers and discuss the purchase of new gear.
We are as crazy about this hobby as you are! So come on in and join us! Audioshark.org the Friendliest Audio Forum!
Industry Participation Disclosure : The owner and administrator of Audioshark is the owner of Suncoast Audio LLC in Sarasota Florida. Suncoast Audio has a full brick and mortar presence in Sarasota with several great show rooms with many world class brands. More information can be found at http://www.suncoastaudio.com
Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
The Audioshark.org Team
Peter, That fixed it. Thank you.
Can't Get Spoft to Play Through...