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  1. #51
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Gene View Post
    Hey Mike, I must have forgot to fill that part of my profile in. I'm way up north from you in Kentucky. Wish you were closer, I 'd have my go-to dealer!
    I suspect there are other Harmonizer users that are shy to speak up because they might be accused of having lost their minds too!
    I shake my head in amazement sometimes trying to grasp whats going on and like you will not part with them.
    Yes indeed! They are amazing. I know there are lots of disbelievers out there (I would have been one of them). But when you hear the before and after, it’s game over.
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  2. #52

    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    So here are my questions to you Mike: With your stereo system turned off or on mute, can you hear any sound(s) coming from the active devices? Are there any disturbances to the air that you can hear in your room with no sound playing but the active devices are on?
    Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.

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  3. #53
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by mep View Post
    So here are my questions to you Mike: With your stereo system turned off or on mute, can you hear any sound(s) coming from the active devices? Are there any disturbances to the air that you can hear in your room with no sound playing but the active devices are on?
    1. No. Dead silence.
    2. No. Nothing detectable.
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

    "We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."

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  4. #54

    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    1. No. Dead silence.
    2. No. Nothing detectable.
    Interesting. Does every recording played with those do dads in the room take on a sonic similarity? In other words, after you get over the "gee whiz" period, does the sound become predictable with the active devices in the system?
    Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.

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  5. #55
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by mep View Post
    Interesting. Does every recording played with those do dads in the room take on a sonic similarity? In other words, after you get over the "gee whiz" period, does the sound become predictable with the active devices in the system?
    It doesn’t affect tone. It affects the perception of space. Music seems unconstrained by the room. It was especially noticeable in our small room (14 x 18). That room never sounded as big and spacious as it does now.
    My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481

    "We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."

    Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.

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  6. #56

    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    It doesn’t affect tone. It affects the perception of space. Music seems unconstrained by the room. It was especially noticeable in our small room (14 x 18). That room never sounded as big and spacious as it does now.
    If you are manipulating the air pressure in the room which affects the sound waves coming from your speakers, how can it not affect tone? If you can change the height and position of a singer in your room, how can that not affect tone? The bottom line is your room boundaries are still there and they are still having the largest impact on your sound second only to the speakers themselves. What these active devices are doing can't be benign otherwise you wouldn't hear any effects from them.
    Micro Seiki SX-8000 air bearing table, SME 312s arm, SME 3012R arn, Dynavector XV-1s cartridge, Lyra Etna SL cartridge, ARC Ref 3 phono stage, Otari MX-55 2 track R2R, Ampex 350 tape repros, Roon Nucleus Plus music server, HiFi Rose 150B DAC, ARC Ref 6, ARC Ref 75 with KT-150s, Parasound JC5 amp , JBL 4345 speakers, Viero Equilibro Level 3 speaker cables, and Definitive Technology Ref subs.

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  7. #57
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    I'm sort of with MEP but a little divergent on this. I don't know that I believe the tone will change by using this device. But I fully agree when the stereo is off the device is still working. That means any conversation, TV, or anything else going on in the room is going to be acted upon by the device and alter the way it is heard. If it's giving the illusion of the music playing in a different room, it seems to me everything else would be recreated as in a different room.

  8. #58
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    I've had mine for 7-8 years. Four Harmonizers, stands, plus black stones plus blue diamonds.

    Over the past dozen years or so, I evaluate any component purchase solely as to how high - if at all - musical engagement is enhanced.

    The Steins were an unqualified success in that area.
    DPT4ME - Dynamics, Presence & Tone for Musical Engagement; MBP (3) - stripped down for music only; Shunyata Omega & Sigma USBs; ISO REGEN w/short Curious USB links; Berkeley Alpha USB; Aqua La Scala II Optologic DAC; Schiit Yggdrasil - fully updated; Ayre Codex dac - updated; Pass Labs INT-60 integrated amp; Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE-2 preamp, Quicksilver Mono 120 amps w/Tung-Sol KT150s; Quicksilver Mid Mono amps w/Gold Lion KT77s; Fyne Audio 703s; Symposium Svelte Plus & Ultra Platforms; REL S-812 subwoofers; Duelund DCA12GA speaker cables; AV Room Service EVPs, Stein Music Harmonizers, Duelund DCA16GA & 20GA ICs; Shunyata Denali 6000S/V2; Tripp Lite PCs; Wyred 4 Sound power cords; AudioDharma cable cooker; dedicated custom room; various GIK & ASC room treatments; etc.

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  9. #59
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    I am guessing (since I have never heard these), but from what I understand from several reviews, including Mike's, these do not change or affect the tonality of the music but make the air and atmosphere in the room easier for sound waves to to travel trough. Therefore they open up the music by allowing it to travel through the room unhindered, or so it seems from what many people are saying.

    I am very interested in trying them, however I do have one question from those who own the Steins. I am a tad concerned that with my listening room in a loft with both side walls open (half walls opening to approximately 30' high ceilings below) and how this might affect the Harmonizers. Any thoughts about if these open walls will neutralize the Steins, rendering them ineffective?
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  10. #60
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Myers View Post
    I am guessing (since I have never heard these), but from what I understand from several reviews, including Mike's, these do not change or affect the tonality of the music but make the air and atmosphere in the room easier for sound waves to to travel trough. Therefore they open up the music by allowing it to travel through the room unhindered, or so it seems from what many people are saying.

    I am very interested in trying them, however I do have one question from those who own the Steins. I am a tad concerned that with my listening room in a loft with both side walls open (half walls opening to approximately 30' high ceilings below) and how this might affect the Harmonizers. Any thoughts about if these open walls will neutralize the Steins, rendering them ineffective?

    For me, placement has been the key in several rooms, (maybe 10’ away in front, outside and a bit back from the mains, maybe 5’ in the rear - spread a bit wide as my seat is about 4' from the rear wall. You do have a level control. In mine, since they are relatively close, IIRC, the front level control is somewhere above 10:30 or so, and the rear is a bit below 10.

    I wouldn't think you'd have a problem,
    but Mike may have a much better answer to your specific question.

    DPT4ME - Dynamics, Presence & Tone for Musical Engagement; MBP (3) - stripped down for music only; Shunyata Omega & Sigma USBs; ISO REGEN w/short Curious USB links; Berkeley Alpha USB; Aqua La Scala II Optologic DAC; Schiit Yggdrasil - fully updated; Ayre Codex dac - updated; Pass Labs INT-60 integrated amp; Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE-2 preamp, Quicksilver Mono 120 amps w/Tung-Sol KT150s; Quicksilver Mid Mono amps w/Gold Lion KT77s; Fyne Audio 703s; Symposium Svelte Plus & Ultra Platforms; REL S-812 subwoofers; Duelund DCA12GA speaker cables; AV Room Service EVPs, Stein Music Harmonizers, Duelund DCA16GA & 20GA ICs; Shunyata Denali 6000S/V2; Tripp Lite PCs; Wyred 4 Sound power cords; AudioDharma cable cooker; dedicated custom room; various GIK & ASC room treatments; etc.

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  11. #61
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    A question for Jim. Is there a psychological component to it? In other words, do you feel more relaxed with it on? Not a byproduct of the acoustics, but a additional advantage. What is the effect of turning up the control on the units? Thanks

  12. #62

    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    I do have a question: how does a typical Stein Music setup look like, which components do you you need and why?


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  13. #63
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B. View Post
    A question for Jim. Is there a psychological component to it? In other words, do you feel more relaxed with it on? Not a byproduct of the acoustics, but a additional advantage. What is the effect of turning up the control on the units? Thanks
    There has always been some that believe quartz can relieve stress and restore your sense of calm.
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  14. #64
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    Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuoppis View Post
    I do have a question: how does a typical Stein Music setup look like, which components do you you need and why?


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    2 x https://steinmusicstore.de/en/portfolio-item/h2/
    Placed front left and right

    7 x http://v2.stereotimes.com/post/stein-music-blue-sun
    Placed one middle between speakers at front of room. Two just past the tweeter on each side. Two just in front of the listening position on each side. One at back of room. One on ceiling just in front of the listener.

    7 x https://steinmusic.de/portfolio-item/diamonds/
    PLACED ON TOP of the Blue Sun Signature’s (listed above).

    Placed one middle between speakers at front of room. Two just past the tweeter on each side. Two just in front of the listening position on each side. One at back of room. One on ceiling just in front of the listener.

    Of course you can go with less, I’m just trying to relay what I did in my rooms. The only thing I added was two more H2’s at the back of the room in the big room only.

    You stick up with some tacky putty. Ideally black.
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  15. #65
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B. View Post
    A question for Jim. Is there a psychological component to it? In other words, do you feel more relaxed with it on? Not a byproduct of the acoustics, but a additional advantage. What is the effect of turning up the control on the units? Thanks
    Hmm, I never thought of it as psychological, but as I think of it now, I think it does have some of that aspect.

    For me it is a more relaxing, yet more involving musical experience. The reproduced sound is smoother in a good way - maybe not as super clinical (with recordings that lean that way).

    If I were to name one thing that I especially value, it's the sense of Presence, especially on recordings that were closely mic'd. It can be quite literally as if the performers are in the room.

    Re the level control, I don't remember much about it since it was so long ago that I settled on an acceptable level. IIRC, if turned up too high, things got bloated in their effect - not better, in other words.
    DPT4ME - Dynamics, Presence & Tone for Musical Engagement; MBP (3) - stripped down for music only; Shunyata Omega & Sigma USBs; ISO REGEN w/short Curious USB links; Berkeley Alpha USB; Aqua La Scala II Optologic DAC; Schiit Yggdrasil - fully updated; Ayre Codex dac - updated; Pass Labs INT-60 integrated amp; Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE-2 preamp, Quicksilver Mono 120 amps w/Tung-Sol KT150s; Quicksilver Mid Mono amps w/Gold Lion KT77s; Fyne Audio 703s; Symposium Svelte Plus & Ultra Platforms; REL S-812 subwoofers; Duelund DCA12GA speaker cables; AV Room Service EVPs, Stein Music Harmonizers, Duelund DCA16GA & 20GA ICs; Shunyata Denali 6000S/V2; Tripp Lite PCs; Wyred 4 Sound power cords; AudioDharma cable cooker; dedicated custom room; various GIK & ASC room treatments; etc.

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  16. #66
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Smith View Post
    Hmm, I never thought of it as psychological, but as I think of it now, I think it does have some of that aspect.

    For me it is a more relaxing, yet more involving musical experience. The reproduced sound is smoother in a good way - maybe not as super clinical (with recordings that lean that way).

    If I were to name one thing that I especially value, it's the sense of Presence, especially on recordings that were closely mic'd. It can be quite literally as if the performers are in the room.

    Re the level control, I don't remember much about it since it was so long ago that I settled on an acceptable level. IIRC, if turned up too high, things got bloated in their effect - not better, in other words.
    Thank you for the detailed response. I am working on something similar. When I reached it's to much level the music was in my face. That should give the chicken bones guys something to laugh about. I just ran across this ad for a used set for anyone interested.
    https://www.audiogon.com/listings/li...-stands-tweaks

  17. #67
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    Re: Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike B. View Post
    Thank you for the detailed response. I am working on something similar. When I reached it's to much level the music was in my face. That should give the chicken bones guys something to laugh about. I just ran across this ad for a used set for anyone interested.
    https://www.audiogon.com/listings/li...-stands-tweaks
    Wow - that's an incredible deal.
    DPT4ME - Dynamics, Presence & Tone for Musical Engagement; MBP (3) - stripped down for music only; Shunyata Omega & Sigma USBs; ISO REGEN w/short Curious USB links; Berkeley Alpha USB; Aqua La Scala II Optologic DAC; Schiit Yggdrasil - fully updated; Ayre Codex dac - updated; Pass Labs INT-60 integrated amp; Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE-2 preamp, Quicksilver Mono 120 amps w/Tung-Sol KT150s; Quicksilver Mid Mono amps w/Gold Lion KT77s; Fyne Audio 703s; Symposium Svelte Plus & Ultra Platforms; REL S-812 subwoofers; Duelund DCA12GA speaker cables; AV Room Service EVPs, Stein Music Harmonizers, Duelund DCA16GA & 20GA ICs; Shunyata Denali 6000S/V2; Tripp Lite PCs; Wyred 4 Sound power cords; AudioDharma cable cooker; dedicated custom room; various GIK & ASC room treatments; etc.

    www.getbettersound.com

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Holger Stein visits Suncoast Audio

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