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March 22, 2019, 03:16 PM #1
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Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
...I'm looking for any combination of speakers, amps (integrated or separates), and streaming hardware and software. I don't need a turntable. It would be nice to have something to rip my CDs and have high quality sound. I prefer a 2 channel system and not HT. Speakers can be passive or active. If you go active please recommend a preamp. I also prefer all new gear as good deals are likely to expire by the time I'm ready to buy (about a year). I'm looking for a system that can hold it's own with about anything below $25,000. This thread is mainly to help me become more familiar with names of various top notch, high end audio builders. Thank you!
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March 22, 2019, 03:50 PM #2
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Lumin U1MINI - 2K (streamer)
Hegel H360 - 5K (integrated + DAC)
Dynaudio "Special Forty" - 3K (speakers)
Cables - 1K
Total 11K
Prices are European.
But I'm sure the US prices are not so far from ours.
A bit more expensive:
Hegel H590 - 10K (top integrated + top DAC + streamer)
Dynaudio "Special Forty" - 3K
Cables - 1K
Total 14K
If you can stretch to the second option, it offers a much better DAC, more and better power.
Later on, when the funds will allow, the H590 will be a perfect fit for even (much) better speakers.Vivid Audio - Burmester - Hegel - Marantz - Oppo - Pioneer 60" - Wireworld
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March 22, 2019, 04:47 PM #3
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Mark Levinson 5802 ($7k) or 5805 ($8500.00), both include DAC but the 5802 is a digital only where the 5805 has analog inputs. + Either Revel Performance 3 F206 ($3500) or (F208 ($5k). KEF R series or Monitor Audio Gold could also be speaker options that I know would sound good. I really like the Monitor Audio but if you are a big bass head or listen to EDM they may not be your best choice. The MA have fast transients and brass is excellent through them.
I heard a small McIntosh integrated driving the new JBL L100's and was impressed. The JBL msrp is $4k, Mac has a variety of integrated amps at various price points. Mac tends to lean warm. Most tend to agree it's worth the money to get up to a model with the output transformers.
For digital you can pick up a Bluesound Vault that will allow streaming and a 2TB hard drive to rip your CD's to. A Node 2i will take care of just streaming if you want astand alone disc player. I know these options didn't allow much if you aren't also wanting a turntable.
I saw the Marantz Ruby integrated & SACD player bundle for $7k, add the Marantz Ref 15 turntable that will have cartridge for $1500.00 with the rest of the budget for speaker. The Ref 15 is made by Clearaudio and one of the best TT values going, IMO.
I'm not sure what current pricing is on the Octave Audio integrated, it was around $4500, it with something like the new Klipsch Forte III would be fun. Maybe a Rega P3 and digital depending on whether disc or streaming or both.
I'm sure others will chime in to help with your home workAurender ACS10 w/Audioquest Diamond USB, Esoteric N05xd
Mark Levinson #526, 534 & JBL 4367's
Clearaudio Performance DC w/Maestro cart
Clarus Concerto & their Crimson cables
HT: Marantz AV8003, Linn 5125, JBL SAM3ha, Revel s30,
SVS PC13 Ultra
Transparent, Analysis Plus & Tributaries. PS Audio filtering
Sony XBR-75X940D & BDP
Parasound P6, MBL 8006b, Artisan speakers/subwoofer
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March 22, 2019, 05:44 PM #4
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Asking such a question is akin to asking someone else to select and purchase a pair of speakers for you that you will love...mission impossible. I do notice your end purpose though and just encourage you to keep things well in perspective, do your homework now matter how long it takes and remember everything in feedback you get will be 100% subjective. Bottom line, build the system for you and nobody else. Don't look for approval or you will fail guaranteed.
Food for thought, it is possible to build a system that will perform well above it's cost. $12k can give you a system that can keep up easily with a system twice the price or more.
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March 22, 2019, 07:51 PM #5
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Thank you for your post. I do appreciate what you're saying. But reality dictates that I will have to have a certain amount of trust in the judgement of others. I will never have the opportunity to go listen to all the audio systems discussed in this thread. I will be lucky to be able to audition just a few of them. But the more I can become familiar with many of the name brands of top shelf audio systems the better. Just knowing how highly regarded various components are is a big help. My ears can do the rest with driving distance being a limiting factor.
I live in a geographical area where there is only one high end audio shop within a reasonable driving distance (1 1/2 hours). The next closest is about 4 hours. Between those stores I won't even begin to scratch the surface of trying out a significant number of high end audio gear. So, like it or not, I have to depend heavily on the judgement of others regarding certain brands and models of audio gear.
I'm just getting back to the high end audio hobby after about a 40 year hiatus. I'm already overwhelmed by the shear numbers of new companies. And it takes just as long to learn/relearn of all the companies that have existed for decades. I'm glad I have a year to research and learn about high end audio. I'll need it. But, when it comes to learning about current audio systems, I wish I lived in the Chicago area or Florida or California or other highly populated area.
With all that considered would you like to recommend a sub $12,000 system? I appreciate your high end audio expertise and would like to hear your recommendations. If you prefer not to, that's OK too. Either way, thank you for posting.
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March 22, 2019, 08:19 PM #6
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Axpona (an audio show) will be at Chicago very soon and is not that far from you. It would be well worth a trip up there.
You would be able to hear a great many pieces of gear and get an idea of what kind of sound you like.
To have others make suggestions would require more info. Like how large is your room, how loud would you play the system, what type of music do you listen to? Are there any speakers/systems that you have heard recently that you like?
Many Many ways to spend $12KMy System
Acoustic Revive RTP-4
Innuos Pulsar
Lampizator BALTIC4
Cary SLP-05
Pass XA30.5 or
Line Magnetic 845ia
Reference 3A Reflector's
Pr SVS SB3000 Subs
Cables & Tubes "subject to change without notification".
Complete system on battery power/solar
Core Audio Design Rack
DIY bass traps and custom curved diffusors.
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March 22, 2019, 08:39 PM #7
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Monitors or floorstanders? (IWO how big a room you have to fill?)
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March 22, 2019, 09:23 PM #8
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Harbeth C7 Anniversary - $5000
Hegel 360 - $6000
Lumin U1 mini - $2000
And I’m sure I’ve got some cables I can give you.
Package deal from Mike - $12k
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 22, 2019, 09:26 PM #9
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
This is just a rough sketch you can play with:
Aries G1 / G2 (server/streamer) --- $2,500 / $4,000
Primaluna Tube Pre-amps: $2,200 - $4,500
Elac Navis ARF-51 speakers (active) - $4,000
Elac Navis ARB-51 speakers (active) - $2,000
That can put you (roughly) about $10.5k - $12.5k on the high end (depending on what you buy or don't buy), with the rest dedicated to power conditioners and cables.
UMI Power Conditioner (Amazon)
Furman PST-8D Power Conditioner (Amazon)
iFi AC iPurifier (Amazon)
Ice Age Power Cables
[insert any high end RCA/XLR cables]
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March 22, 2019, 09:27 PM #10
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Room is 11' x 27'. Prefer floor standers but would consider Harbeths.
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March 22, 2019, 09:41 PM #11
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Fleetwood Deville by Oswald Mills Audio, Vienna Acoustics Haydn Jubilee, Wharfedale Linton w/ stands, Klipsch RB-75, Klipsch RP-160M.
Job INTegrated. Luxman L-595aSE
NAD C 658 streamer.
First Watt SIT-3, Job 250 Monos, NuForce STA200, AkitikA GT-102 amp, ASL Wave monos, Dennis Had 45 monos. Absolute Audio Labs PCF 25 amp (improved First Watt F7 super clone)
Topping D90, RME Audio ADI-2 DAC FS, ModWright Ultimate Sony XA-5400ES.
Burmester 948, McIntosh MCLK12, Kimber Kable, Siltech, Cardas, Avanti Audio cables.
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March 22, 2019, 10:16 PM #12
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Thanks for having me, looks like a chill place. Looking forward to interacting and reading!
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March 23, 2019, 06:32 AM #13
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Ha Mike, I like your choices!
We're very close aren't we.
I wouldn't take the Harbeths, but you already know I don't really like them.
That package seems like a nice deal.
PS What I would recommend is to visit indeed a dealer with many different systems, to get the taste, and attend a couple of audio shows.Vivid Audio - Burmester - Hegel - Marantz - Oppo - Pioneer 60" - Wireworld
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March 23, 2019, 06:48 AM #14
Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Here’s another one:
Gryphon 120 w/ DAC
Harbeth 30.2
AQ Rocket 88 LS cables + AQ ICs
Might be slightly over budget, but good sound.
For a slightly more affordable amp try T+A PA2500 R.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk“Life’s too short to listen to bad audio.”
Big rig: Brinkmann Taurus DD TT + 12.1 arm + Lyra Etna Lambda SL MC + HRS M3X2/ Cardas Clear Beyond phono/ Stillpoints LPI/ Brinkmann Edison mk2 phono + RöNT II Tube PS/ Synology NAS with Roon + HD Plex linear PSU + Shunyata HD/ AQ Vodka RJ45 + Aqvox Network Switch SE + AQ Diamond RJ45 into DAC/ Brinkmann Nyquist mk2/ Audionet Humboldt/ Cardas Clear Beyond ICs/ Kharma DB9-S 1.1 LS/ Inakustik Reference LS 4004 AIR/ Audioquest Niagara 5000/ Shunyata Alpha power (HC, Analogue, Digital)/ Finite Elemente Pagode Rack/ Stillpoints Ultra SS/ Vicoustic panels + Stillpoints Aperture II.
Small rig: Naim UnitiServe/ Curious USB/ Tidal/ Linn Klimax DS3/ Shunyata Power cable/ Pass Labs INT-60/ Acoustic Zen Silver Reference II/ HiD Diamond 8/ Harbeth 30.2 40th Anniversary/ Shunyata Venom EU7 & Venom 3 HD.
HP rig: MacBookAir/ Tidal/ Auralic Gemini 2000/ Sbooster LPSU/ Audeze LCD-2 Classic + WyWires Red/ Shunyata HD/ Shunyata Hydra 2/ Shunyata Venom.
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March 23, 2019, 08:36 AM #15
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
great exercise to help with research before purchasing. hard to know exactly what you would like best, so here is a system i would research for myself. i have also listed a higher priced speaker that i would consider as an alternative:
12k system
$2,895 ... still audio el84 integrated amp
$4,695 ... omega speaker systems super alnico high output XRS
$4,200 ... t+a dac 8 dsd
$2,000 ... lumin u1-mini network transport
$13,790 msrp but street price will close to or maybe less than the $12k
speaker upgrade:
$12,500 ... viking acoustics briton III halvdan ...price is also msrp
also, if you are handy with a screwdriver and familiar with computer software installation you can build an exceptional DIY fanless server/transport to run roon ROCK for about $1,100. similarly (but not as well) spec'd pieces are $2,500 and up.viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | air tight atc-5 + atm-300r | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + kanjiroba diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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March 23, 2019, 09:17 AM #16
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
If you shop used of demo like I do $12k can get a full range system. The best sounding combination I ended up witt was the Usher Be-20DMD's with a Hegel h360 driving it. those two pieces combined for $10k that leaves $2k for a streamer and wires, the hegel has a good sounding dac built in.
KEF Blade, Mc-611's, C49 rega jupiter, roon nucleus, revox tuner. Meridian dsp8000 se upgrade, meridian 218 zone controller VA Beethoven's, Hegel h360.
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March 23, 2019, 09:32 AM #17
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
2chl : Vincent Sp331MkII, W4S STP-SE Stage 2, Kef 201/2, KEF 140, Vapor Breeze, Lumin, Bryston CD, BHA-1, Quicksilver Headamp, HD650, HD800s, HD820's, Dan Clark 1.1, Focal Stellia, OPPO 203, 105. ( Boxed up: Pass Xa-30.5, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV-20XL, Manley Chinook, Cadenza Bronze)
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March 23, 2019, 11:44 AM #18
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
My budget was $20,000 to $25,000 but, so far, I've learned I might not have to spend that much to have an excellent system. I still could make that my budget if necessary. But It looks like I'll have to spend less than my initial estimate. So now I'm thinking roughly $12,000 to $15,000 could do the job extremely well.
I'm loving the system recommendations. Keep 'em coming. I'm starting to see some redundancy in the recommendations and that's a good thing. But I'll consider any of the recommendations if I can have the opportunity to audition them. Thank you so much for the recommendations so far. As I said above...keep 'em coming. Much of my auditioning will come from the systems you're recommending.
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March 23, 2019, 11:46 AM #19
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
2chl : Vincent Sp331MkII, W4S STP-SE Stage 2, Kef 201/2, KEF 140, Vapor Breeze, Lumin, Bryston CD, BHA-1, Quicksilver Headamp, HD650, HD800s, HD820's, Dan Clark 1.1, Focal Stellia, OPPO 203, 105. ( Boxed up: Pass Xa-30.5, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV-20XL, Manley Chinook, Cadenza Bronze)
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March 23, 2019, 12:01 PM #20
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I can not recommend an entire system, nobody can. That is foolish to even try. I would question anyone recommending an entire system right off the bat because since you can't hear it you have no idea whether it works for you or not and if it doesn't you have blown your whole wad on dissatisfaction. If you are anything like me, you can only do this once, there is no money for do-overs, your decisions have to be as educated and vetted as possible.
I don't like to strongly recommend particular pieces in this manner because it is completely subjective. What I like, others will not and visa versa. I can tell you my experience with this or that, but it will likely not be the same as yours.
I am glad you are taking a year to research this, that should be enough. The best thing to do first is ask yourself the following questions:
1) What are your dominate media formats for listening (vinyl, CD, stream, PC, etc)? This is important as it initially narrows down the type of gear to look at.
2) What size is the room you plan on having the system in and how much space can you allow for the electronics and the speakers? Cramming a pair of towers into a rather small room will severely limit your sound quality because the will be no room for setup.
3)What kind of overall sound signature do you like most (something that leans toward the warm side of neutral or the bright side? Something that is mostly flat? Something that is more analytical or fun and musical? etc)?
I do highly recommend building this system one piece at a time. I also recommend sectioning your budget. For example: so much allocated to the amp, so much to speakers, etc.
I do recommend starting with the speakers. I would also allocate the largest portion of your budget to speakers. Without good and the right speakers for you, nothing else will matter. I can't tell you how much of your $12k to allocate to the speakers, but no need to go crazy with something like $9k or $10k. You can get incredibly fantastic speakers to your liking for as little as just under $1k. I'm not saying to limit yourself to that amount, it is just an example of what is possible. In other words, if you really like a pair of speakers and they check all the boxes for you, but they are say, $1200 for example and not considered "high-end" or "audiophile" by most of those folks, DO NOT let that influence your decision! This system is for you, nobody else.
Once you have the speakers next you will want to find the amp. It is far easier to find the amp after you select the speakers because you need to match amp to speakers. Beyond just load requirements (4 ohm, 6 ohm, 8 ohm) you need to match the signature timbre of sound. If you have bright speakers you do not want an amp the leans toward the forward side of neutral (bright). In that case you would want an amp that is as close to neutral as possible or something that leans towards the warm side of neutral.
After you have that, you can then work on the source gear.
I would not worry about cables. Cables may give you about 1% sound "improvement" at best. No need to go nuts, just get decent ones, hell, some $30 or $40 interconnects will more than do the job. Same with speaker cable, you can get away with a lot or make your own from Beldin or Canare or one of the industry standards like that. (That is what a lot of the uber expensive cable makers use).
At the end of the day you want to have some money left over for music if you do other than streaming. In fact, the goal is also to come in under budget by any amount.
I live in California, but let me tell you, there may be a few more shops around, but not much. For me I only have four within driving distance and the closest one of them I would not trust as far as I could throw them. Another one is some distance, but doable. Another is just a shade too much of a drive.
If you are comfortable with this, I would also recommend contacting those makes that allow for in-home demo. That is becoming more and more popular. One example would be PS Audio, there are others, I just can't think of them off the top of my head right now. For speakers it is a challenge. there might be some makes that will lend bookshelf speakers for demo, but towers, no. The shipping alone makes it a non-starter.
There is usually a charge for in-home demos so be aware. I would narrow it down to two choices if possible if you are going to go the in-home demo route. That way you don't spend 30% of your budget doing that.
If it comes to the shove, you can get speakers first and if you have nothing to hook them up to, you can get a cheap integrated like an Outlaw or Marantz or something for $200 let's say to give you something to listen to while you shop for your main amp or what have you. If you have an amp already, by all means use that as long as it can handle the speaker load.
This is just my take in a nutshell. I'm not an audiophile by any stretch. I just like and know good sound quality for my music. Music is the most important to me. The gear is just a means to an ends. I do have experience in the industry including journalistic, but that adds up to a whole lot of nothing. I'm just a realist.
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March 23, 2019, 12:52 PM #21
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
“Life’s too short to listen to bad audio.”
Big rig: Brinkmann Taurus DD TT + 12.1 arm + Lyra Etna Lambda SL MC + HRS M3X2/ Cardas Clear Beyond phono/ Stillpoints LPI/ Brinkmann Edison mk2 phono + RöNT II Tube PS/ Synology NAS with Roon + HD Plex linear PSU + Shunyata HD/ AQ Vodka RJ45 + Aqvox Network Switch SE + AQ Diamond RJ45 into DAC/ Brinkmann Nyquist mk2/ Audionet Humboldt/ Cardas Clear Beyond ICs/ Kharma DB9-S 1.1 LS/ Inakustik Reference LS 4004 AIR/ Audioquest Niagara 5000/ Shunyata Alpha power (HC, Analogue, Digital)/ Finite Elemente Pagode Rack/ Stillpoints Ultra SS/ Vicoustic panels + Stillpoints Aperture II.
Small rig: Naim UnitiServe/ Curious USB/ Tidal/ Linn Klimax DS3/ Shunyata Power cable/ Pass Labs INT-60/ Acoustic Zen Silver Reference II/ HiD Diamond 8/ Harbeth 30.2 40th Anniversary/ Shunyata Venom EU7 & Venom 3 HD.
HP rig: MacBookAir/ Tidal/ Auralic Gemini 2000/ Sbooster LPSU/ Audeze LCD-2 Classic + WyWires Red/ Shunyata HD/ Shunyata Hydra 2/ Shunyata Venom.
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March 23, 2019, 12:58 PM #22
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | air tight atc-5 + atm-300r | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + kanjiroba diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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March 23, 2019, 01:07 PM #23
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I think asking for a complete system is brilliant because the op is using our experience in gear we've already mixed and matched. I buy a pair of speakers first or an amp then decide which one i'm going to match the other to! We're saving many demos
KEF Blade, Mc-611's, C49 rega jupiter, roon nucleus, revox tuner. Meridian dsp8000 se upgrade, meridian 218 zone controller VA Beethoven's, Hegel h360.
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March 23, 2019, 01:09 PM #24
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Good post! Thank you so much. A lot of very good info to consider. I need to listen to a lot more systems in order to decide upon a "personality" for my system.
I generally like a slightly open top end (not too much), yet good clean, clear, low mids and bass. I do like some warmth. But I don't like speakers that sound veiled or like they have a blanket thrown over them. Bottom line is I like a fairly balanced frequency spectrum with some warmth.
I'd like to split the difference between musicality and analytical. Musicality. I like musicality. I'm not really looking for recording studio monitor linearity but I want some accuracy/transparency, if that makes sense. I'm not looking for a highly colored speaker either.
Most of the language I just used to describe my sonic tastes is not all that helpful, I know. And, since it is nearly impossible to describe sound in words, listening will obviously be the key. Lots of listening.
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March 23, 2019, 04:37 PM #25
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Merrill of Merrill Audio allows in home audition. He builds very good Class D amps. Easily in your budget.
Cara preamp - $3500.00
Taranis power amp - $2500.00 or Thor Monblocks $5k. He also has some 5 digit price points if you change your mind and go crazy
Speakers like I already mentioned would work, Revel Monitor Audio, Dynaudio who has a variety of lines and price points.
Cary Audio sells direct if interested in tubes and allows a 60 day time to audition. Their gear has a "house" sound, as many brands do. So take that time. In addition, they need plenty of break in.
If not working with a local though, I'd find someone who has several brands to offer and the expertise to steer you in the right direction. If only we knew anyone like that around here, LOL
There are other online retailers, my experience has been they will not recommend one brand over another, don't have the experience with the gear to tell you about the sound or want to sell the flavor of the day. I'm not just saying that, in the past I've bought gear from East coast to West coast dealers but never from an online retailer for the reasons mentioned. if I'm buying I have to be comfortable with the person selling. Now I have a local guy I work with.Aurender ACS10 w/Audioquest Diamond USB, Esoteric N05xd
Mark Levinson #526, 534 & JBL 4367's
Clearaudio Performance DC w/Maestro cart
Clarus Concerto & their Crimson cables
HT: Marantz AV8003, Linn 5125, JBL SAM3ha, Revel s30,
SVS PC13 Ultra
Transparent, Analysis Plus & Tributaries. PS Audio filtering
Sony XBR-75X940D & BDP
Parasound P6, MBL 8006b, Artisan speakers/subwoofer
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March 23, 2019, 06:01 PM #26
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
If you are interested in tubes, you could take a look at Prima Luna, good bang for buck. Their stuff sounds good and kind of like how you describe. Warm yet not too warm and just enough openness on top to satisfy. There are other good choices too.
If you are going solid state, your choices widen unless you don't like solid state of course.
When it comes to speakers you won't find many that have a veiled sound. Speakers tend to range from harshly bright to too much bottom. When looking for speakers and if you can demo any it is important to use your own music you are familiar with. Relying on the dealer choice is a fools errand because they play it very safe. You don't want to get the speakers home only to find that they don't do well with the music you listen to.
I've heard countless speakers starting with my own quest years ago. For example I found Vandersteens to excel for classical music, but not much else and they fall apart with anything uptempo. It is the way they are voiced, they are not fast speakers. I'm not a fan of horned speakers. I'm also not a fan of Magicos or Wilsons for example. I know that is blasphemy around here, but they just don't come close to suiting my taste is all, cost not withstanding.
Almost all speakers are colored, just as most amps are. There is not a "perfect" piece of gear, period. You just need to decide what flavor you like. I suggest listening to different types of speakers if you can. I don't have time to give my opinion on all the speakers I have heard, besides that doesn't do you any good, because like music, speakers are personal. What you like, someone else will hate.
If you want to know, I landed years ago on Paradigm Studios (Discontinued). I heard the whole line at the time and found the Studios to my liking. I like a balanced sound not tilted too much either way with ability to go to the smallest detail, in other words, "revealing" even if it means I chance upon a recording in my collection that is not as good as I thought. I like the truth. I have heard the Personas and don't care for them, I find them too harsh and tilted up. I have not heard the Prestige yet. Oh yes, I'm a tower guy.
Again, I would ignore my opinions because that is all they are. Opinions are biased, we all have bias. We all seek what we resonate with.
When you hear the speakers you like, you will know it. When I landed on the Paradigms (after 38 other speakers...whew!), I knew I found the right speakers for me, but I went back and listened to them two more times for an hour to an hour and a half each before I laid down my money. I wanted to be absolutely sure. That's just me. Of course this was back when we still had shops.
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March 23, 2019, 06:22 PM #27
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Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I love your name, Audiophobiac .
Simaudio Moon Neo 260 DT CD Transport / MIT SL-Matrix Plus AES/EBU digital cable / Schiit Yggdrasil Analog 2 DAC / Octave HP 700 preamp / Octave RE 320 stereo amp with Super Black Box / Reference 3A Reflector monitors on Sound Anchors Signature Stands / dual JL Audio Fathom 112 v2 subwoofers on ASC SubTraps / ZenWave Audio D4 and SMSG cables / Acoustic treatment: tube traps, Tri-panels, window plugs, ceiling diffusers (all ASC), large absorbing panels (Acoustics First), diverse carpets chosen for acoustic properties: wool, polypropylene basket-weave
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March 23, 2019, 08:04 PM #28
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March 23, 2019, 08:07 PM #29
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Sure, I’ll jump in.
If you’re not sure, and want to spend the 12K, then use Suncoast Mike and be done with it.
At this dollar, you will have a nice system.
Warning: if you like it you’ll soon want more, and will go down the upgrade path, this only means your $12K will return $5/6K towards a bigger system.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProSource Analog: Kuzma Stabi R w/4point 11 arm | Kuzma 50 Cartridge
Source Digital: Aurender N10 | Brinkmann Nyquist MK II
Amplification: Dan D’Agostino Momentum HD and M400’s | Boulder 508
Speakers: Wilson Alexias
Cabling: Nordost Leif, Norse, V2 and Odin
Power and Isolation: Audio-Ultra Home & Room Power Foundation Performance Package with StromTank S1000 | HRS
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March 23, 2019, 09:22 PM #30
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March 24, 2019, 07:42 AM #31
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
for sale directly from Viking... $8,250
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/li...riton-monitors
also, from time-to-time dealers / manufacturers have demos and trade-ins which can be veritable bargains...
https://www.viking-acoustics.com/instrument-grande-voix
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/li...ton-full-range
in doing exhaustive research your audio dollar will go farther than you might otherwise expect.viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | air tight atc-5 + atm-300r | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + kanjiroba diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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March 24, 2019, 08:45 AM #32
- Join Date
- Feb 2016
- Location
- west Michigan
- Posts
- 713
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
While discussed in other forum threads, I question the wisdom of buying an "integrated" that has a DAC in it.
How often has anyone here changed their DAC in the last several years?
I can see that it is a simple one box solution that will appeal to some but as technology, especially in the digital realm, continues to evolve at a rapid pace I feel that a person would be "tying their hands" with such a piece.
YMMVMy System
Acoustic Revive RTP-4
Innuos Pulsar
Lampizator BALTIC4
Cary SLP-05
Pass XA30.5 or
Line Magnetic 845ia
Reference 3A Reflector's
Pr SVS SB3000 Subs
Cables & Tubes "subject to change without notification".
Complete system on battery power/solar
Core Audio Design Rack
DIY bass traps and custom curved diffusors.
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March 24, 2019, 09:40 AM #33
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March 24, 2019, 09:59 AM #34
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
KEF Blade, Mc-611's, C49 rega jupiter, roon nucleus, revox tuner. Meridian dsp8000 se upgrade, meridian 218 zone controller VA Beethoven's, Hegel h360.
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March 24, 2019, 04:57 PM #35
- Join Date
- Nov 2013
- Location
- St. Louis, MO, USA
- Posts
- 3,054
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I should clarify, I consider an "online dealer" those who sell almost exclusive online via a website and magazine. I've not ever used them for the reasons mentioned. I have bought from retailers, B&M, who happen to sell online, or would if no dealer in the area with the line. As an example, long before I knew of Mike, I purchased my Conrad Johnson gear from a dealer now out of business called Spearit Sound. The guy who helped me knew his stuff and would allow a return if I didn't like the gear. I don't consider someone like that a "online dealer/retailer". However, if looking for a certain line or in an area not being serviced, these types of dealers can be a real asset.
Aurender ACS10 w/Audioquest Diamond USB, Esoteric N05xd
Mark Levinson #526, 534 & JBL 4367's
Clearaudio Performance DC w/Maestro cart
Clarus Concerto & their Crimson cables
HT: Marantz AV8003, Linn 5125, JBL SAM3ha, Revel s30,
SVS PC13 Ultra
Transparent, Analysis Plus & Tributaries. PS Audio filtering
Sony XBR-75X940D & BDP
Parasound P6, MBL 8006b, Artisan speakers/subwoofer
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March 24, 2019, 05:50 PM #36
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I would pick the Devialet Expert 140 Pro ($6500) for myself. It hits all the feature checkboxes except ripping CDs but I assume you plan to use your computer for that. It sounds incredibly good and pulls out amazing amounts of detail with a very balanced and neutral sound. If you want a nicer streaming music user interface, you can front it with Roon.
For speakers, I might go with the Acoustic Zen Adagios ($4500) or Salk Sound Veracity HT3 ($6500). Although the Veracity HT3 sensitivity is pretty low and it would put you slightly over your $12k budget. A friend of mine likes Spendor and their D7 ($6400) may also be a good choice; the D7 is also in the Devialet SAM database.Neko Audio
Authorized Dealer: AC Infinity, APC, Audeze, Bryston, Devialet, Elite HTS, Fortress Seating, JMF Audio, JVC, Kaleidescape, LG, LUMIN, Magico, Ortofon, RME, Samsung, Soulution, STAX, Trinnov, Vivid Audio, Weiss & more.
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March 25, 2019, 12:59 PM #37mauidanGuest
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
032519-ELAC-600.jpg
"I heard more good sound in the Trends Electronics / Elac room, where Elac's wireless-capable (but wired at the show) Navis ARF-51 3-way powered speakers ($CA6400) were delivering big sound and deep, pounding bass. Each driver in the Navis is powered by an amp (bass, midrange, and tweeter: 160Wpc, 100Wpc, and 40Wpc, respectively) which might help explain the clarity and force I heard across the frequency range. Electronic bass whomps never overwhelmed softer sounds such as delicate cymbal trails, which were allowed to express themselves without interruption. Downstream components included Alchemy by Elac's DDP-2 preamplifier/DAC/streamer ($CA3000) and Discover server ($CA1500), which streamed music from what appeared to be the most commonly used streaming platform among exhibitors: Tidal. Cabling was provided by Audioquest."
Read more at https://www.stereophile.com/content/...RG5gWaRqexD.99
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March 26, 2019, 06:20 AM #38
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- Jan 2017
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- Leyden
- Posts
- 596
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
If you use a laptop or other digital source already maybe the Kii speakers would be an option. They are about $11k. Connect your laptop and stream Qobus.
Not really sure if this works.Pre amp: Ocatve Phono Module Power amps: Octave MRE130 Turntable: SAC Girati Grande. Tonearm: Dynavector 507mkII Cartridge: Dynavector Ikeda 9TT Streamer: Aurender A10 Power Distributor: Anzus Mains D8 Speakers: Raidho X-3 Speaker Cables: AudioQuest Rocket 88 XLR Interlink: Ansuz A2, [B]XLR Interlink: [B]Phono interlink: Cammino Serie 1.0 - PH 1.0s Power cables: Anzus Mains Ceramic, two Pom, Aluminium, X series Audio Rack: Rack of Silence 4 and 2.
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March 26, 2019, 04:16 PM #39
- Join Date
- Apr 2013
- Location
- New York, New York
- Posts
- 657
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I agree with a. Wayne. If you invest some time and effort , you can build a very nice $25K system for $12Kish used....Most gear will last forever. Why not buy with the depreciation at someone else's expense....
T+A MP3100HV, T+A PA3100HV. Custom made Furutech cables with ETP-609 distributor with NCF outlets, Harbeth 40.2 Anniversaries.
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March 27, 2019, 06:30 AM #40
- Join Date
- Dec 2016
- Posts
- 152
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Audiovector QR5 - 3350 USDAnsuz cables and accesories : 2x powercord, speakerwires, ethernet cable, Mainz 8 X power distributioner and 3x darkz A. - 5700 USD
Primare I35 Prisma | Integrated amplifier and streaming module - 3350 USD
Pricing is not 100% right though
Total price : 12.400 usdScansonic MB-1, Aavik U-300, Sony CD Player as transport, mixture of ansuz cables in different qualities, Ansuz Mainz X Power Distribution, Ansuz Power Distribution for DTC cables
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March 27, 2019, 09:33 AM #41
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
For a 11' x 27' room size I think this is an interesting suggestion.
I’m not sure that many in the forum will be familiar with the Danish designed Audiovector QR5 loudspeakers, but they are 3 way floorstanders which in room offer near full range performance. Amazing value for money.
The OP just needs to add a music server to rip and store his CD’s and the package is complete.Borresen Acoustics Loudspeakers, Borresen Model 01 Compact monitor loudspeakers with Ansuz Darkz T2s Supreme resonance control, Audio Video Manufaktur GmbH (AVM) Inspiration amplifier & streamer, Innuos Zen MKII music server, Ansuz Acoustics cables & accessories. Please visit my system thread hosted on Audioshark for more details. Disclosure: The author is materially connected to Ansuz, Aavik & Borresen Acoustics via friendship with an owner.
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March 27, 2019, 10:09 AM #42
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
acknowledging the importance of good cabling and clean power... $5.7k might be out of balance in a $12k system. i would counsel first getting the best amp, speakers and source possible, then backfilling over time with expensive cables and power conditioning if needed.
in the interim, there are many great low cost cables that provide excellent results. also, diy cables are an option that can provide equal results at an even lower cost... in fact, many who could well afford otherwise choose diy with dueland wire - not because it is less expensive but because they prefer the sound. see this positive feedback review by jeff day.
if a/c power is an issue, something like the audioquest niagara 1200 for $1,000 msrp should be great in a $12k system.viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | air tight atc-5 + atm-300r | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + kanjiroba diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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March 27, 2019, 10:42 AM #43
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Kii Threes.
2chl : Vincent Sp331MkII, W4S STP-SE Stage 2, Kef 201/2, KEF 140, Vapor Breeze, Lumin, Bryston CD, BHA-1, Quicksilver Headamp, HD650, HD800s, HD820's, Dan Clark 1.1, Focal Stellia, OPPO 203, 105. ( Boxed up: Pass Xa-30.5, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV-20XL, Manley Chinook, Cadenza Bronze)
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March 27, 2019, 11:33 AM #44
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Kii three - often faulty.
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March 27, 2019, 11:34 AM #45
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 27, 2019, 12:17 PM #46
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
2chl : Vincent Sp331MkII, W4S STP-SE Stage 2, Kef 201/2, KEF 140, Vapor Breeze, Lumin, Bryston CD, BHA-1, Quicksilver Headamp, HD650, HD800s, HD820's, Dan Clark 1.1, Focal Stellia, OPPO 203, 105. ( Boxed up: Pass Xa-30.5, VPI Classic, Dynavector DV-20XL, Manley Chinook, Cadenza Bronze)
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March 27, 2019, 12:52 PM #47
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Just got done watching a youtube video from John Darko on the Mytek's Brooklyn Bridge and amp. It's a class D amp which can be good or bad for some. But, the price point for performance would be in the $12k build point. He's very good at telling the strong and weak points of any product IMO. Worth a watch.
Speakers: Magico S3 (23')
Integrated:Gryphon Diablo 300 plus DAC
Streamer: HiFi Rose RS150b
CD/DVD: Oppo 205
Cables: Cardas-Shunyata-AudioQuest-Supra
Roon Core: sonicTransporter i7 powered with HDPlex 200w linear PS, running AudioLinux for Roon--Tidal and Qobuz with iPad Pro
Time is just a tool humans created to measure movement and record events
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March 28, 2019, 03:21 AM #48
- Join Date
- Dec 2016
- Posts
- 152
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
Scansonic MB-1, Aavik U-300, Sony CD Player as transport, mixture of ansuz cables in different qualities, Ansuz Mainz X Power Distribution, Ansuz Power Distribution for DTC cables
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March 28, 2019, 03:26 AM #49
- Join Date
- Dec 2016
- Posts
- 152
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I've heard 6k USD systems that when done right easiliy outperforms 15k systems.
I believe that we've different views on where to spend with this budgetScansonic MB-1, Aavik U-300, Sony CD Player as transport, mixture of ansuz cables in different qualities, Ansuz Mainz X Power Distribution, Ansuz Power Distribution for DTC cables
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March 31, 2019, 12:34 PM #50
Re: Put together a dream $12,000 system for me...
I'll do the combo for less than $12k delivered.
KEF Blade, Mc-611's, C49 rega jupiter, roon nucleus, revox tuner. Meridian dsp8000 se upgrade, meridian 218 zone controller VA Beethoven's, Hegel h360.
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Yes...it makes for a BIG improvement. Every demo I've heard where at Altaira was in the system, folks listened, and then the Altaira(s) were removed, and folks immediately demanded the Altaira be put...
Altaira or Gemini CGS on...