Magico Q-Sub 15’s

**Mike** · February 13, 2019, 08:26 AM

A few pictures from yesterday’s Magico Q-Sub 15’s install.

**joeinid** · February 13, 2019, 08:28 AM

What a beautiful setup and room.

**Alpinist** · February 13, 2019, 10:13 AM

That system must have world-class bass response!

Ken

**Cincy2** · February 13, 2019, 10:29 AM

Mike,

Interesting placement with the transducers firing left/right. Did they start out this way or make the switch after taking spectrum data?

Eric

**Mike** · February 13, 2019, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Mike,

Interesting placement with the transducers firing left/right. Did they start out this way or make the switch after taking spectrum data?

Eric

The subs are very flexible due to the software which controls them. Ideally, the subs should be behind the mains.

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**Cincy2** · February 13, 2019, 10:34 AM

Makes sense. The DSP would correct for any modes. Does a mortal human have any chance of getting them set up or do you need a PhD in quantum physics?

EG

**Mike** · February 13, 2019, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Makes sense. The DSP would correct for any modes. Does a mortal human have any chance of getting them set up or do you need a PhD in quantum physics?

EG

Myself, Peter and one other person from Magico measure the room and dial the subs in perfectly.

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**Alpinist** · February 13, 2019, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Myself, Peter and one other person from Magico measure the room and dial the subs in perfectly.

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Mike,

I’m guessing those Q-Subs are mighty fast if they are designed to keep pace with Magico’s latest speaker models. Do you think the Q-Subs could keep up with a good set of planar speakers like Alsyvox?

Ken

**PeterA** · February 13, 2019, 12:06 PM

Wow, another Magico/Pass system. I've heard the Q subs set up well at Goodwins. It sounded great and integration was exemplary. They are massive, heavy, and expensive, but at this level, could be a very nice addition to a system.

**Cincy2** · February 13, 2019, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Myself, Peter and one other person from Magico measure the room and dial the subs in perfectly.

Wow. I think I'm in trouble here........

EG

**Alpinist** · February 13, 2019, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Wow. I think I'm in trouble here........

EG

No question about it, Eric.

Ken

**Kingsrule** · February 13, 2019, 12:39 PM

Are the subs sitting on MPods or QPods? 3 or 4 per sub?

Were the 3 of u all at the install or was the programming done remotely?

How did u wire the system to incorporate the subs?

Is the sub program both Mac and Windows or just Windows?

Do the subs come with the software and microphone?

**The Sandman** · February 13, 2019, 01:11 PM

They are on 4 stock feet. MPOD upgrade to follow.

Mike and Peter were on site. There was remote programming involved as well.

Subs receive direct output from preamp via XLR. Mains run their normal, full range. Subs are contoured via DSP to correct overall system response.

DSP software for both Windows and MAC.

No, microphone and sound analysis software not included.

**Kuoppis** · February 13, 2019, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Mike,

Interesting placement with the transducers firing left/right. Did they start out this way or make the switch after taking spectrum data?

Eric

This is also exactly how REL recommend to place their subs, firing diagonally through the room.

Slight correction: now I see the subs are pointing 90 degrees to the listening position. REL recommendation is more like 45 degrees.

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**Kuoppis** · February 13, 2019, 04:47 PM

Dream subs - luckily I lack the space

.

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**bart** · February 13, 2019, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Kuoppis

luckily I lack the space

.

There is always space!
I seriously doubt your commitment about this hobby!

**Mike** · February 13, 2019, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by Alpinist

Mike,

I’m guessing those Q-Subs are mighty fast if they are designed to keep pace with Magico’s latest speaker models. Do you think the Q-Subs could keep up with a good set of planar speakers like Alsyvox?

Ken

Absolutely. They keep up with Avantgarde’s.

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**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 06:37 AM

Regarding orientation - I’m not sure it’s clear in the photos but each subwoofer has two 15” drivers, one on each end. So both subs are firing both left and right. Both subs could have been rotated to any position - this is the orientation Peter chose.

**Kuoppis** · February 14, 2019, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by The Sandman

Regarding orientation - I’m not sure it’s clear in the photos but each subwoofer has two 15” drivers, one on each end. So both subs are firing both left and right. Both subs could have been rotated to any position - this is the orientation Peter chose.

Thanks Howard for the clarification. Then a diagonal orientation would only make sense, if there is a lots of space behind the subs.

The REL diagonal orientation is a function of one front- and one downfiring membrane.

Congrats for the superb subs, must be a fantastic sound.

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**brodricj** · February 14, 2019, 07:18 AM

So how does it work getting Magico people on-site to do these installs, their airfares and time etc chargeable to the client?

**Mike** · February 14, 2019, 07:22 AM

Originally Posted by brodricj

So how does it work getting Magico people on-site to do these installs, their airfares and time etc chargeable to the client?

We included it with the purchase of the dual Q-Sub 15’s. We wanted to be sure he was 100% happy. The Q-sub 15’s have sophisticated software to ensure incredible integration. Frankly, they make other subs sound like toys.

**brodricj** · February 14, 2019, 07:55 AM

Don't suppose those Magico people could come around to my place to help put Mpods on my M3?

**Mike** · February 14, 2019, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by brodricj

Don't suppose those Magico people could come around to my place to help put Mpods on my M3?

Your dealer should help you.

**PeterA** · February 14, 2019, 11:28 AM

Originally Posted by The Sandman

They are on 4 stock feet. MPOD upgrade to follow.

Mike and Peter were on site. There was remote programming involved as well.

Subs receive direct output from preamp via XLR. Mains run their normal, full range. Subs are contoured via DSP to correct overall system response.

DSP software for both Windows and MAC.

No, microphone and sound analysis software not included.

Sandman, can an owner integrate these subs into his system without the dealer or company rep being on site? I'm curious what will happen if and when a Q sub ever shows up on the used market and the new owner wants to set it up without the help of a dealer or Peter McKay.

**Cincy2** · February 14, 2019, 11:32 AM

QSub-15_Owner_Manual.pdf

The User Manual has some appropriate guidance.

Eric

**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 12:03 PM

The subs are super sophisticated and more than a little intimidating but yes, they could be integrated into a system by an end user. I added my subs to my home network so I can access the DSP controls easily. If you get hold of the recommended microphone and audio analysis software and follow the instructions carefully you should be able to get a good result.

My recommendation to Magico would be to make a video of the procedure of both Peter’s optimizations and the actual use of the analyzer graphics to adjust the DSP controls to contour the overall system response. It’s fairly well presented in the PDF but I don’t think most people would be comfortable jumping in without actually seeing how it works.

**Cincy2** · February 14, 2019, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by The Sandman

I added my subs to my home network so I can access the DSP controls easily.

Do the subs have an ethernet port? Wireless? How did you manage the network interface?

Thx
Eric

**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 12:11 PM

Once the system settles back down and the subs break in some more I’ll make a detailed post about the sound of the system with the QSub 15s. The mains were moved a good couple of feet further into the room which means all 6 of the room treatments on the sidewalls need to be repositioned which should further improve imaging.

**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Do the subs have an ethernet port? Wireless? How did you manage the network interface?

Yep, each sub has an Ethernet port so you can add them to your network pretty easily. Alternatively you can hook up a laptop directly to each sub using the USB port.

**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 12:16 PM

Cincy... you’re pretty close to me btw... lemme know if you want to come over for a listen.

**Kingsrule** · February 14, 2019, 12:28 PM

Thoughts...

Are the sub drivers broken in when delivered? If not does the setup take that into account? (IME woofer break-in changes are the most dramatic...) or is a follow up visit required?

**Mike** · February 14, 2019, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by Kingsrule

Thoughts...

Are the sub drivers broken in when delivered? If not does the setup take that into account? (IME woofer break-in changes are the most dramatic...) or is a follow up visit required?

The client has the subs running for about two weeks prior to setup.

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**Cincy2** · February 14, 2019, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by The Sandman

Cincy... you’re pretty close to me btw... lemme know if you want to come over for a listen.

Howard,
Thanks. To be honest, I would not feel at risk buying any product Magico designed. I feel the same way about Dan D'Ag and Transparent Audio.
Eric

**The Sandman** · February 14, 2019, 03:20 PM

Originally Posted by Cincy2

Thanks. To be honest, I would not feel at risk buying any product Magico designed. I feel the same way about Dan D'Ag and Transparent Audio.

Ha - I wasn’t trying to imply a concern about risk of any type. Sorry for the miscommunication.

**the professor** · February 14, 2019, 08:27 PM

The DSP software can do many many things. But also it is pretty straight forward and I think with some effort and time most people could get them set up.

**kzhtoo** · February 14, 2019, 11:25 PM

BTW those M-coat S7’s look gorgeous.

**The Sandman** · February 15, 2019, 06:07 AM

Originally Posted by kzhtoo

BTW those M-coat S7’s look gorgeous.

Well yes, they do... but only when they’re idle. Once the music starts they’re invisible.

**Darrel** · February 15, 2019, 12:51 PM

Want an amazing system. I'd love to hear a ultra high end Magico system like that some day.

One thing that caught my eye is the sub placement. Instead of the subs firing towards the listener. The drivers are facing towards each other. Coming from a HT system where a sub or subs drivers push into the listeners and rooms. Why is that the preferred setup on this system?

**Mike** · February 15, 2019, 01:20 PM

Originally Posted by Darrel

Want an amazing system. I'd love to hear a ultra high end Magico system like that some day.

One thing that caught my eye is the sub placement. Instead of the subs firing towards the listener. The drivers are facing towards each other. Coming from a HT system where a sub or subs drivers push into the listeners and rooms. Why is that the preferred setup on this system?

It’s about pressurizing the room, not rattling your ass for every car crash and bomb explosion in the movie.

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**The Sandman** · February 15, 2019, 01:24 PM

As far as I know, you can’t really “aim” the bass... the waves propagate in all directions.

**Darrel** · February 15, 2019, 02:04 PM

I understand about the realism of a car crash, explosion etc. in a home theater. In stereo you are not going to be listening to a car crash etc. unless your still part of a home theater/stereo setup. And if bass is as The Sandman and others state is omnidirectional then why placing the subs facing each other I still find of interest and am curious about.

I have two small sealed subs behind my A3's and decided last night to turn them towards each other just to experiment with. I don't have a tech team or software to work with.

**The Sandman** · February 15, 2019, 02:14 PM

The omnidirectionality is theoretical - the drivers, the box, and the room all play a part. And rotating the subs might change the phase.

You can either adjust by ear or purchase some reasonably priced audio analysis gear (microphone and software for your laptop) and then make adjustments based on your measurements.

**nicoff** · February 15, 2019, 02:33 PM

I had an expert help set up my subs. He used his ears and his own music/test materials. In the end, he placed two subs facing each other and not facing the listener.

**Darrel** · February 15, 2019, 02:33 PM

Mike mentioned pressurizing the room by their placement. I would think 2000wpcX2 could accomplish that. And I would think software would take care of any phase issues. I have read articles about omnidirectional sound waves over the years and I'm still left with trying to understand this kind of sub driver placement.

**the professor** · February 15, 2019, 04:28 PM

I've always tried to put the subs in whatever configuration that gave the flattest bass for the room. That way you can do the least amount of correction with the DSP. In some rooms it's having the drivers face the listener, in some it's facing at various angles.

With some subs to be able to get deep bass 15-20hz the sub has to go in the corner because it needs the room to help.

**nicoff** · February 15, 2019, 05:35 PM

Questions:
At what frequency are these Magico subs kicking in? Does the DSP affect only the subs?

**the professor** · February 15, 2019, 06:31 PM

You can control the crossover freq to whatever you want. And yes - the DSP only controls the sub. The main speaker is running full range.

Originally Posted by nicoff

Questions:
At what frequency are these Magico subs kicking in? Does the DSP affect only the subs?

**Kuoppis** · February 16, 2019, 12:08 AM

Originally Posted by The Sandman

As far as I know, you can’t really “aim” the bass... the waves propagate in all directions.

At least, while human hearing is able to determine the source or direction of high/ mid signals, it is much less able to do so for low frequencies. I also think that might also have to do with how low frequency sound waves propagate.

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**Cincy2** · February 18, 2019, 07:52 AM

I will be joining the Q-Sub club in a few months. Thanks to my favorite crack dealer Mike :-)

Now the waiting begins. I have a smallish room so the set up should be relevant to a lot of other addicts. I'll post after the Dream Team completes the tuning.

Eric

**brodricj** · February 18, 2019, 08:00 AM

You get the dream team if you only order one Qsub-15?

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