GigaFoil v4 Inline Ethernet Filter

[veindoc]

King,
Any experience with Uptone Audio UltraCap 1.2 LPS or Paul Hynes SR4 & SR7?

I'm using ultracap 1.0 LPS works fine after getting 2.1 to 2.5mm adapter and then set it to 5v. I am awaiting a more formal cable to convert 2.1 directly from LPS from Ghent audio gothem quad design cable. Alex C. from Uptone recommended them. They are closed till after chinese new year.

[Kingsrule]

King,
Any experience with Uptone Audio UltraCap 1.2 LPS or Paul Hynes SR4 & SR7?

Sorry but no on both.....

The Sbooster MkII is what I'm using now

[SuperDave]

UltraCap 1.2 LPS is much better sounding than the iPower. I have compared them on my SOtM sMS-200 endpoint and W4S Recovery USB reclocker and the difference was well worth the $400 extra.

The UltraCap 1.2 LPS is based on the latest wonder chip - LT3045 Ultra Low Noise LDO Voltage Regulator, which has ultralow RMS noise @ <0.8µV and ultrahigh PSRR @ 76dB at 1MHz. Those are absolute class leading figures. Components of that quality were simply not available just a few years ago.

I'm about to order alternative voltage regulators (since the LPS-1.2 is in fact an advanced voltage regulator, and requires another PSU to drive it) based on same LT3045 chips:

http://www.ldovr.com/product-p/dxp-1a5s.htm

They are only $95 (plus say $49 for the ifi iPower to drive it), so 4x less than LPS-1.2.

I will be ordering two to drive my two Ethernet switches (a regular TP-Link and the new SotM switch that I just bought).

Adam,
Thanks! Great information. I'll look into the product you mentioned.

Jim,
I'm curious how the SR7 would compare. It's pricey if I remember.

Dave

[Kingrex]

Are you guys saying an inexpensive PS, followed by a good VR = a very good overall PS.

[Kingrex]

Anyone try an Optical Rendu. I don't have an ethernet renderer. Though I could kill 2 birds so to speak. Optical isolation and diversify the chores Roon performs.

[Alpinist]

Are you guys saying an inexpensive PS, followed by a good VR = a very good overall PS.

Hi Rex,

The reason we upgrade to a high quality LPS is to eliminate noise on the ethernet line before it reaches the DAC. The GigaFoilv4 eliminates 99.99999999% of the noise on the line according to their specs. So, the upgrades that will overwhelmingly make the most difference in sound quality are at or after the ethernet filter. So, add a high quality LPS like the Keces P3 to power the GigaFoilv4 and the highest quality and best insulated ethernet cable between the GigaFoilv4 and the DAC. What’s done upstream of the GigaFoilv4 to reduce noise in terms of high end ethernet cables and LPS is belt and suspenders.

Best,
Ken

[Kingsrule]

Anyone try 2 Gigafoils in their system...one on the renderer line and one on the core line?

[mep]

Hi Rex,

The reason we upgrade to a high quality LPS is to eliminate noise on the ethernet line before it reaches the DAC. The GigaFoilv4 eliminates 99.99999999% of the noise on the line according to their specs. So, the upgrades that will overwhelmingly make the most difference in sound quality are at or after the ethernet filter. So, add a high quality LPS like the Keces P3 to power the GigaFoilv4 and the highest quality and best insulated ethernet cable between the GigaFoilv4 and the DAC. What’s done upstream of the GigaFoilv4 to reduce noise in terms of high end ethernet cables and LPS is belt and suspenders.


Best,
Ken

How is the Ethernet noise being measured? And again, is it correct that you can't hear this Ethernet noise when you have your preamp turned up to where you would normally listen to your DAC and you unmute your preamp with no music playing?

[Kingrex]

Ken, I'm wondering if I can get an Ifi PS and put the regulator used in the LPS 1.2 behind it and get Ultracap quality sound.

Most decent PS I see are in the $800 and greater price range. $200 for 80% or more of they performance is interesting.

[aKnyght]

fascinating thread which i have been following with great interest.

as i understand it, the gigaFoil v4 is an opto-isolator. here, the basic underlying concept is to convert the incoming electrical signal to an optical signal which provides (almost) perfect galvanic isolation, thereby, filtering/removing all the accumulated upstream electrical noise from the signal. the "clean" optical signal is then converted back to an electrical signal before exiting the device. extrapolating this to the larger audio world...

1) the same principle would seem to be at work in optical s/pdif connections.

2) SFP optical network input of the type used in some lumin network players would seem to be the future.

just thinking out loud and i have no deep knowledge in this area -- very happy to be corrected.

[Daudio]

Ken, I'm wondering if I can get an Ifi PS and put the regulator used in the LPS 1.2 behind it and get Ultracap quality sound.

Do you mean using an IFI as an energizing suppy for the UpTone LPS 1.2,
or using the LT3045 regulator devices as used inside the LPS 1.2 ?

I have built a very nice semi-DIY LPSU for my digital audio using various regulator modules, to get hi end performance on the cheap.

The other question is what voltage and current do you need ?

[wklie]

the "clean" optical signal is then converted back to an electrical signal before exiting the device. extrapolating this to the larger audio world...

1) the same principle would seem to be at work in optical s/pdif connections.

2) SFP optical network input of the type used in some lumin network players would seem to be the future.

1) Yes: Toslink would be free of signal noise, but in typical implementations it introduces more jitter due to conversion, because the clock is embedded inside the SPDIF signal (synchronous). With optical conversion of Ethernet, it is not sensitive to jitter because the network player will use its own clock (asynchronous).

[aKnyght]

1) Yes: Toslink would be free of signal noise, but in typical implementations it introduces more jitter, because the clock is embedded inside the SPDIF signal (synchronous). With optical conversion of Ethernet, it is not sensitive to jitter because the network player will use its own clock (asynchronous).

thanks -- fortunately my dac will switch over to its internal clock, given a source signal of sufficient quality. so, in my case optical s/pdif is a good way eliminate upstream electrical noise in the signal... but, only up to 96kHz.

converting the parts of a LAN serving an audio system to fiber with routers/switches having SFP ports which then connect to components having SPF inputs or (less optimally) media converters would seem to be the future.

again, my knowledge is limited here.

[Jeffy]

I have a J cat Net Card Femto to a local router to the AQVOX SE Switch. This is connected to the GigaFoil V4 that I recieved yesterday. I can tell you the GigaFoil made a bigger difference than the AQVOX switch. This thing has transformed my digital. I am thrilled. I have not tried changing the power supply to the Gigafoil as I love the sound the way it is. I am using the best Wireworld through out. I even ordered Sablon cables and received them yesterday, thinking the brightness I was getting was do to the Wireworld. I have no desire to even try the Sablon. Jeff

[UltraFast69]

I have a J cat Net Card Femto to a local router to the AQVOX SE Switch. This is connected to the GigaFoil V4 that I recieved yesterday. I can tell you the GigaFoil made a bigger difference than the AQVOX switch. This thing has transformed my digital. I am thrilled. I have not tried changing the power supply to the Gigafoil as I love the sound the way it is. I am using the best Wireworld through out. I even ordered Sablon cables and received them yesterday, thinking the brightness I was getting was do to the Wireworld. I have no desire to even try the Sablon. Jeff

Why not try the Sablon since you have them?

My hunch is a new linear power supply will do you right!


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[Alpinist]

I have a J cat Net Card Femto to a local router to the AQVOX SE Switch. This is connected to the GigaFoil V4 that I recieved yesterday. I can tell you the GigaFoil made a bigger difference than the AQVOX switch. This thing has transformed my digital. I am thrilled. I have not tried changing the power supply to the Gigafoil as I love the sound the way it is. I am using the best Wireworld through out. I even ordered Sablon cables and received them yesterday, thinking the brightness I was getting was do to the Wireworld. I have no desire to even try the Sablon. Jeff

Hi Jeff,

Upgrade the power supply. The stock one isn’t very good. Even the $50 IFI power supply makes a substantial improvement. The Keces P3 will make even more of an improvement but costs more.

Ken

[kzhtoo]

I have a J cat Net Card Femto to a local router to the AQVOX SE Switch. This is connected to the GigaFoil V4 that I recieved yesterday. I can tell you the GigaFoil made a bigger difference than the AQVOX switch. This thing has transformed my digital. I am thrilled. I have not tried changing the power supply to the Gigafoil as I love the sound the way it is. I am using the best Wireworld through out. I even ordered Sablon cables and received them yesterday, thinking the brightness I was getting was do to the Wireworld. I have no desire to even try the Sablon. Jeff

Thank you Jeff for the info. Have you compared Gigafoil alone in the chain vs. Gigafoil + AQVOX SE in the chain?

I think the question a few of us wondering is if Gigafoil further improves a system that already has AQVOX SE.

[Jeffy]

I already told you that I have the aqvox and when I added the foil to the mix the sound improved. I think what your saying is can you go right from router to foil with same effects?

[Jeffy]

Ken what would be better for the foil Keces or Sbooster?

[Alpinist]

Ken what would be better for the foil Keces or Sbooster?

Jeff,

I’ve not done a direct comparison. I know people that own the Keces P3 and the SBooster MkII. I’ve been told that both are excellent and significantly better than the IFI that I own.

Ken

[wklie]

I already told you that I have the aqvox and when I added the foil to the mix the sound improved. I think what your saying is can you go right from router to foil with same effects?

Reading this led me to think about: what if the audiophile switch is replaced with an ordinary switch (with LPS if possible), while the keeping the GigaFoil - would there be a degradation? Based on my incomplete understanding of the theories behind these stuff, I speculate that the degradation might be negligible.

[Alpinist]

Reading this led me to think about: what if the audiophile switch is replaced with an ordinary switch (with LPS if possible), while the keeping the GigaFoil - would there be a degradation? Based on my incomplete understanding of the theories behind these stuff, I speculate that the degradation might be negligible.

Peter,

If all the audiophile switch does is reduce noise, then I agree with you.

Ken

[wklie]

In addition to lower noise, the audiophile switch also uses a good clock with low jitter for the network data packets (let's ignore the debate of whether this can improve SQ and assume it does anyway), but I suspect this benefit may be largely reduced because the conversion to optical then back to copper (for noise elimination) should affect jitter.

This is just a speculation. Experimentally anything can happen and SQ is usually system dependent and not deterministic from a single factor.

[Jeffy]

I just tried using the foil with only the local router. The result is not as good. Without the switch the inner detail is less, quietness less, and the dynamics are a little less. The switch went back in. I also tried the Sablon and so far like wireworld better. It is brighter and has more sibilants. I will put 120 hours on it and try again. I thought this was broken in already.

[Kingrex]

Interesting result with the switch and the gigafoil

[Daudio]

Rex,

Check the previous page for a question:

[PeteG]

For SQ would it be better to start with gigafoil then add the switch later on or....

[joeinid]

Can someone start a list of all of the recommended digital dingleberries you need to make your system really shine? And digital dingleberries are anything you insert in the digital signal path that is not required to hear music play.

I'd like to also ask politely for the recommended pieces. I've been ignorant of this thread until now because a friend really made me look at it and he's using the gigafoil with great sucess.

I don't have any audiophile switches with power supplies and better ethernet cables but have been looking. I've been afraid to just try a shotgun approach so I'd love some recommendations from my cable modem out to my audio system. I've neglected that part of the audio chain. Ignorance can be bliss.

[Mike]

I'd like to also ask politely for the recommended pieces. I've been ignorant of this thread until now because a friend really made me look at it and he's using the gigafoil with great sucess.

I don't have any audiophile switches with power supplies and better ethernet cables but have been looking. I've been afraid to just try a shotgun approach so I'd love some recommendations from my cable modem out to my audio system. I've neglected that part of the audio chain. Ignorance can be bliss.

Joe, just call me! Ken and I and a few others have been working hard on this. Testing multiple power supplies and dealing with problems with NetGear products and the like. Hint: NetGear MESH products don’t work well with things like the GigaFoil. No issues with Linksys or a number of others.


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[joeinid]

Thanks Mike, I need to ask you about this stuff. Now that the speakers, amps, and preamp are set, I need to clean up the audio chain part of it. Everything seems to matter

[rrwmd]

Well, I'm the friend that talked with Joe about the GigaFOIL as well as the Keces P3 power supply. Here's my experience in my system so far...

First off, I already had an Audioquest Diamond ethernet cable for awhile. Now I have it running from the GigaFOIL to my Lumin and an AQ Vodka feeding the GigaFOIL.

I ordered them both from Mike at the same time but got the GigaFOIL about ten days before the Keces so I had some time to listen to it with just the stock power supply. The Keces came earlier this week and was a HUGE improvement over the stock one. In fact, to me the delta was even greater after adding the Keces than when I first inserted the plain GigaFOIL. The P3 is an impressive piece in terms of the look and build as well. I guess if there's gonna be some break-in improvement it'll only get better.

I always wondered about the whole network grunge business. I'd read about audiophile grade routers, switches, and other tweaks. I just wasn't sure what to do or what would actually help. But this thing makes sense to me since it's at the end of the chain right before the gear.

Does it work? You betcha. Everything I associate with digital is much improved. Background is cleaner, for sure. But beyond that everything's smoother, more solid, and more relaxed in a good way. There's virtually no upper midrange glare that had been there on certain recordings.

I would say if you have a decent system and stream quite a bit (whether from a NAS or music service) try it and I bet you will be pleased with the results.

[joeinid]

Rance,

Thank you so much!


I'm looking forward to better sound!

[Kingrex]

Rex,

Check the previous page for a question:

Was there something I was suppose to see or respond to?

[CPP]

Was there something I was suppose to see or respond to?

Rex see post #111

[Kingrex]

Rex,

Check the previous page for a question:

Rex see post #111

Thanks Chris. I see the Keses is only $350 or so. If they work I may try one instead of trying to Macgyver my own.

[PeteG]

I believe I would benefit from the filter. I have a long outdoor bulk ethernet cable run that I terminated the ends, so I'm going to give the gigafoil a try. I'll use my own power supply but just need to know the barrel plug size (2.1mm or 2.5mm).

[UltraFast69]

I believe I would benefit from the filter. I have a long outdoor bulk ethernet cable run that I terminated the ends, so I'm going to give the gigafoil a try. I'll use my own power supply but just need to know the barrel plug size (2.1mm or 2.5mm).

It’s 2.5MM


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[Jim Smith]

I believe I would benefit from the filter. I have a long outdoor bulk ethernet cable run that I terminated the ends, so I'm going to give the gigafoil a try. I'll use my own power supply but just need to know the barrel plug size (2.1mm or 2.5mm).

I have one that I bought from Mike, though I haven’t had time to connect it or the Keces yet.

IIRC, it’s 2.5 mm.


FWIW - my PS Audio LanRover and the Icron version I use for back-up are 2.1. They are powered by a Paul Hynes SR-7 with custom 2.1 connectors - they did not fit the gigaFOIL.

[PeteG]

Thanks guys.

[Daudio]

Thanks Chris. I see the Keses is only $350 or so. If they work I may try one instead of trying to Macgyver my own.

nevermind...

[Kingrex]

nevermind...

Do you think I can do alot better than the keces if I have electrical skills. I would like to get the most performance possible. I just wont spend $1k at this time to clean up my last shortcomings. I know my streaming can improve as its pretty noticeable the difference between files in my server and those streamed. My streaming is very good, but can be better.

[PeteG]

I ordered one with Mike. Can't wait, hopefully will have it soon.

[SuperDave]

I ordered one with Mike. Can't wait, hopefully will have it soon.

I ordered one a few days ago from Mike with the Keces LPS. Now I need a new ethernet cable. I'm considering the Audioquest Diamond, are there any others you guys are using? I'm using Transparent now but I believe there are some better options.

Dave

[Jim Smith]

I use the AQ Diamond to GigaFoil to .75 M AQ Diamond - either with my PS Audio LanRover, or with my Small Green Computer & ultraRendu.

There may be a better ethernet cable, but I've not heard it.

[calloway]

Mike..do you think this product is a worthwhile investment.?.I did talk, via email, with the website and they agreed that the best location for the product was, in my case, just before my Lumin, attached with a short lead ethernet cables.

[Mike]

Mike..do you think this product is a worthwhile investment.?.I did talk, via email, with the website and they agreed that the best location for the product was, in my case, just before my Lumin, attached with a short lead ethernet cables.

Yes, absolutely.


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[Billt1]

Mike..do you think this product is a worthwhile investment.?.I did talk, via email, with the website and they agreed that the best location for the product was, in my case, just before my Lumin, attached with a short lead ethernet cables.

Frankly you won't believe it. The next surprise is adding a better power supply. Even the $50 ifi PS will surprise you

[PeteG]

Any break-in with the gigafoil?

[Alpinist]

Any break-in with the gigafoil?

I didn’t notice one.

Ken

[SuperDave]

My GigaFoil v4 showed up yesterday with the stock power supply. I'm still waiting on the Keces. Out of the box, a lower noise floor and more density. Notes carry more weight and bass seems more focused all contributing to a less mechanical sound. I also have a Sablon Ethernet cable and an AQ Diamond in route to demo. The GigaFoil offers great value IMO!!

Dave