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  1. #1
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    Ford Abandoning Cars

    Ford announced earlier in the week that they are phasing out all cars except for the Mustang and a Crossover version of the Focus. They are going to sell only Suv's and trucks. Apparently the 5% profit on cars was not enough.

    GM and foreign manufacturers must be happy. Too bad for the consumer though with less domestic choices. The new Ford Fusion is an excellent car and the Focus drove somewhat like a Euro built car (it was designed in Germany). Every where I go I see lots of Fusions and Focuses on the road.

    I suspect this has a little bit to do with Trump easing the up coming mpg benchmark that cars have to meet in the upcoming years along with low gas prices.

    Unfortunately, compact and midsize SUV's don't get as good mpg and they use anemic engines for the most part.

    I think that Ford is making a huge mistake because eventually gas prices are going to sky rocket again at some time in the next coming years and people will want high mpg cars.
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  2. #2
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    I think you will see Chevrolet follow. Like keeping the Vette and Camaro,. Last week " GM Chief Financial Officer Chuck Stevens told reporters that the company will “make significantly lower investments on a go-forward basis” in its passenger car lineup" Yep SUV's and cross-overs and pickups are the new norm in the US. .
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  3. #3
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Good Riddance. Ford with their quality issues globally are a joke. the beginning of the end.
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  4. #4
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by XV-1 View Post
    Good Riddance. Ford with their quality issues globally are a joke. the beginning of the end.
    Never ever had an issue with my F150's.
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  5. #5
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by CPP View Post
    Never ever had an issue with my F150's.
    Me either.


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  6. #6
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    They prefer to make trucks and suv's because the profit margins are higher. Pickup trucks use to be dirt cheap but 20 years ago or so the prices skyrocketed. I once read that it cost GM less than $15K to make a Suburban that they charge $40K. If GM follows suit then the Japanese and Korean's will steal the market even more.
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  7. #7
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    They're far from done, new Ranger:

    https://www.ford.com/trucks/ranger/2019/

  8. #8
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by CPP View Post
    Never ever had an issue with my F150's.
    I bought one of their SUV's and the biggest piece of shite I have ever owned.

    See link below on how Ford Australia treat their customers after the Government fined them. they have got off very lightly

    Ford ordered to pay $10 million fine for 'unconscionable conduct'

    https://www.smh.com.au/business/cons...26-p4zbrc.html
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  9. #9
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    The price of gas here is quite reasonable...$1.75/liter (premium). ...Regular is only $1.55/liter, and should go over $2.00/liter later on when you need to drive your trucks more...pulling campers for summer vacation, mobile home trailers.

    https://www.cheknews.ca/get-your-wal...rivers-443066/
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  10. #10
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Interestingly enough, 2 mostly made in America cars, the Camry and the Accord, together account for about 25% of US sedan sales.

    Also interesting, a not untypical Yukon Denali XL costs more than a Mercedes GLS 450 (based on MSRP)
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  11. #11
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    For premium gas right now here we pay $8 a gallon...Canadian gallon for Canadian dollars.

    You?
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  12. #12
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    As soon as the car manufacturers switch to all trucks and SUVs the market for trucks and SUVs will dry up. As sure as the sun rises in the East, oil will skyrocket in price again, and most likely will stay there.
    Bud

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  13. #13
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    As soon as the car manufacturers switch to all trucks and SUVs the market for trucks and SUVs will dry up. As sure as the sun rises in the East, oil will skyrocket in price again, and most likely will stay there.
    What do you drive?

  14. #14
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by mauidan View Post
    What do you drive?

    2005 Mazda3. Got it October 2004, and it’s still going strong. No issues yet.
    Bud

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  15. #15
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    The price of gas here is quite reasonable...$1.75/liter (premium). ...Regular is only $1.55/liter, and should go over $2.00/liter later on when you need to drive your trucks more...pulling campers for summer vacation, mobile home trailers.

    https://www.cheknews.ca/get-your-wal...rivers-443066/
    ___

    Anyone driving a Tesla?

    I just paid $2.71 per gallon for 92R premium today at Costco while other companies were charging $3.39. Costco gas is top tier fuel.

    Back on the original subject. I really wonder if GM will abandon cars since Ford is getting out of the market. They will be the only american company besides Chrysler which makes POS cars except for the beautiful beast Challenger.

    The Malibu, Impala and Cruze are selling like hot cakes around here.
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  16. #16
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    I just paid $2.71 per gallon for 92R premium today at Costco while other companies were charging $3.39. Costco gas is top tier fuel.

    Back on the original subject. I really wonder if GM will abandon cars since Ford is getting out of the market. They will be the only american company besides Chrysler which makes POS cars except for the beautiful beast Challenger.

    The Malibu, Impala and Cruze are selling like hot cakes around here.
    That's three times less than in Vancouver.
    Cars run on gas, so it has some relevance on a grand scale.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.8ceb19fa7554

    GM is not far behind ...

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/26/ford...ar-behind.html
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  17. #17
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    ...I suspect this has a little bit to do with Trump easing the up coming mpg benchmark that cars have to meet in the upcoming years along with low gas prices...
    I think it has more to do with US Tax laws for autos with loaded GVWR >6000 lbs, allowing huge write offs for the self employed and business owners that buy them. If you're self-employed and your CPA has half a brain he should be imploring you to acquire one of these behemoths to reduce your tax burden.

  18. #18
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    I suspect that new car sales are down for various reasons. One reason is that kids just graduating HS and college are having trouble getting jobs or high paying jobs. Housing is sky rocketing (my daughter graduated nursing school 2 years ago, lives in Denver and has a 2 bedroom apartment that cost $1600 per month which she shares with a roommate and she has $600 per month student loan payments.)

    These kids can't afford cars or are buying cheap used cars. The used car market is booming here. And my 26 year old son says many of his friends that have graduated college can't afford new cars. Many are still living at home with their parents. And more people are using Uber and Lyft. Cars are also built better and many people are hanging on to them longer.

    I actually loathe SUV's although we own one to tow our boat and for AWD for the heavy winters in Minnesota. I would hate to drive on the road with mostly SUV's and not being able to see over them in traffic.
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  19. #19
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    I suspect that new car sales are down for various reasons. One reason is that kids just graduating HS and college are having trouble getting jobs or high paying jobs. Housing is sky rocketing (my daughter graduated nursing school 2 years ago, lives in Denver and has a 2 bedroom apartment that cost $1600 per month which she shares with a roommate and she has $600 per month student loan payments.)

    These kids can't afford cars or are buying cheap used cars. The used car market is booming here. And my 26 year old son says many of his friends that have graduated college can't afford new cars. Many are still living at home with their parents. And more people are using Uber and Lyft. Cars are also built better and many people are hanging on to them longer.

    I actually loathe SUV's although we own one to tow our boat and for AWD for the heavy winters in Minnesota. I would hate to drive on the road with mostly SUV's and not being able to see over them in traffic.
    I've been in the car business for 44 years, and been GM of a large Honda dealership for 26 years. right now, Honda and Toyota have the most successful cars by volume. especially if you just consider retail, and not fleet or rental, none of the other makes are very close. the SAAR (seasonally adjusted annual retail) number is holding steady around 17 million units. and is not likely to increase. so there is no anticipated growth in the total market, just segment adjustment.

    for many reasons, there is a push to move from sedans to SUV's and Crossovers.....likely led by demand for AWD and more flexible uses that customers are demanding. it's driven by all age groups. and there is less demand from the entry level buyers for typical entry level sedans, as many young buyers in urban areas are choosing to either go car less or using car sharing options. it's even normal today that many high school students think it's cool not to drive. 10-15 years ago that would have been unheard of. so the negative effect on sedans is coming from many directions.

    back to brands; Ford does not make any sedans that are popular at retail, and mostly sell the few sedans they do sell in the central states, very few on the coasts. Nationally they are trucks and SUV's and sell sedans to rental car companies. and when faced with all the increasing safety and emission regulations and the couple billion (with a B) dollar cost of developing a new competitive sedan they simply made a business decision. Honda and Toyota make too good a product in a declining segment, and sell so many they are able to amortize a much better product over many more units. so Ford is only the first to go this way......not the last.

  20. #20
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    One of Ford's issues was that they kept the Taurus around too long. It was dated and not a very good car. The new Fusion on the other hand is a very good car and right up there with the Camry and Accord. I have driven all 3 many times. Reliability is something else and Fords are not very reliable. The Focus is a very nice car and rides better than the Mazda 3 and Elantra and Kia Forte its competitors. However, Ford never addressed the crappy transmission.

    I hope with the U.S. automakers getting out of the sedan business, that the quality of the Japanese and Korean cars do not take a hit. I have not owned an american car for over 30 years. I am not concerned about the German cars though. And don't get me started with Dodge and Chrysler. Not even Mercedes could help them.
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  21. #21
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    One of Ford's issues was that they kept the Taurus around too long. It was dated and not a very good car. The new Fusion on the other hand is a very good car and right up there with the Camry and Accord. I have driven all 3 many times. Reliability is something else and Fords are not very reliable. The Focus is a very nice car and rides better than the Mazda 3 and Elantra and Kia Forte its competitors. However, Ford never addressed the crappy transmission.

    I hope with the U.S. automakers getting out of the sedan business, that the quality of the Japanese and Korean cars do not take a hit. I have not owned an american car for over 30 years. I am not concerned about the German cars though. And don't get me started with Dodge and Chrysler. Not even Mercedes could help them.
    I was born in St. Paul, and oldest of 29 grandchildren. most of my cousins still live in the Twin Cities, and unlike where I live, most drive domestics. but that situation is not country wide. your reality of viewing the Focus as 'right up there' with Camry and Accord is very regional. (whether you are right or wrong, the USA wide retail marketplace says you are wrong). if you eliminate sales to rental car agencies; Ford almost sells no sedans on the coasts. and the writing is on the wall that the numbers don't work. and it's a product problem and a product perception problem. and Ford has thrown in the towel on overcoming both parts of their sedan problem.

    if you have not driven the new 2018 Accord, you should drive it before you assume i'm wrong. it's amazing.....and more like luxury brands like Mercedes or BMW or Audi than other mass market sedans.

    the quality of Hondas are driven by world-wide pressures, not just the USA market. and the domestic sedans are not considered the competition anyway. so whether they come or go has little to do with their product development. this could change, but that is the current situation.

  22. #22
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Lavigne View Post
    I was born in St. Paul, and oldest of 29 grandchildren. most of my cousins still live in the Twin Cities, and unlike where I live, most drive domestics. but that situation is not country wide. your reality of viewing the Focus as 'right up there' with Camry and Accord is very regional. (whether you are right or wrong, the USA wide retail marketplace says you are wrong). if you eliminate sales to rental car agencies; Ford almost sells no sedans on the coasts. and the writing is on the wall that the numbers don't work. and it's a product problem and a product perception problem. and Ford has thrown in the towel on overcoming both parts of their sedan problem.

    if you have not driven the new 2018 Accord, you should drive it before you assume i'm wrong. it's amazing.....and more like luxury brands like Mercedes or BMW or Audi than other mass market sedans.

    the quality of Hondas are driven by world-wide pressures, not just the USA market. and the domestic sedans are not considered the competition anyway. so whether they come or go has little to do with their product development. this could change, but that is the current situation.
    Mike, I agree. The 2018 Accord is looking like the probable replacement for my wonderful 2004 BMW 330i.

  23. #23
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Hi Mike, I was comparing the Fusion not the Focus to the Accord. Last summer I drove the turbo Fusion and a V6 Accord. Both are excellent. The Fusion handled better, had more precise steering (the Accord had a bit of input lag which was a disappointment), the Fusion had a better ride and was more quiet. I have not driven the 2018 Accord but I am disappointed that they did away with the V6. I was considering a V6 2D Coupe to replace my Maxima and Acura CLS S type.

    I also drove the Buick Regal GS. It rides and handles like a BMW which is no surprise since it was designed in Europe. Unfortunately the Turbo 4 is geared for low end torque and it felt anemic on the highway. I am not sure how the new Regal compares.
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  24. #24
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    For premium gas right now here we pay $8 a gallon...Canadian gallon for Canadian dollars.

    You?
    Bob, the metrics for fuel prices in Canada are totally different than here in the US. But let gas get to five dollars a gallon here (sustained) and thinking will change ......
    Cheers ! …. Dave

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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    For premium gas right now here we pay $8 a gallon...Canadian gallon for Canadian dollars.

    You?
    Socialism has it's price , someone's gotta pay ....

  26. #26
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechnutt View Post
    One of Ford's issues was that they kept the Taurus around too long. It was dated and not a very good car. The new Fusion on the other hand is a very good car and right up there with the Camry and Accord. I have driven all 3 many times. Reliability is something else and Fords are not very reliable. The Focus is a very nice car and rides better than the Mazda 3 and Elantra and Kia Forte its competitors. However, Ford never addressed the crappy transmission.

    I hope with the U.S. automakers getting out of the sedan business, that the quality of the Japanese and Korean cars do not take a hit. I have not owned an american car for over 30 years. I am not concerned about the German cars though. And don't get me started with Dodge and Chrysler. Not even Mercedes could help them.
    Bought a Mercedes o BMW lately ...


    IMO, Only Porsche today making good cars , mostly everything else ( super exotics aside ) is a POS trade it in every 3-4 yrs to avoid warts. Very little made today are keepers , one of the many reasons big money chasing the good old stuff to park cash ...

    Aside many good cars if you plan on rolling them every 3-4 yrs , all good , jap cars dont really work for me , not that they are bad none are really , think of toobs and SS not my Bag, I'm still stuck on German, just trade quickly ..

  27. #27
    mauidan
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueFox View Post
    2005 Mazda3. Got it October 2004, and it’s still going strong. No issues yet.
    Owned an RX-2 and Miata. If I could get a golf bag in the Miata's trunk, I'd buy another one.

  28. #28
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikado463 View Post
    Bob, the metrics for fuel prices in Canada are totally different than here in the US. But let gas get to five dollars a gallon here (sustained) and thinking will change ......
    I know that, our gallon is bigger than the US gallon.
    Still $1.70 a liter for premium is . . .

    ¤ http://www.gallonstoliters.com/

    Edit: Now it is $1.82 a liter for premium gas! ...$1.62 for regular.
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  29. #29
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Socialism has it's price , someone's gotta pay ....
    It's because we have the whales. And gas is rare on the Island, very.
    There is also a fight between Alberta and British Columbia about a pipeline.

    Anyway there's nothing we can do but voting for the right party.
    ~ Bob ~
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  30. #30
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    It's because we have the whales. And gas is rare on the Island, very.
    There is also a fight between Alberta and British Columbia about a pipeline.

    Anyway there's nothing we can do but voting for the right party.

    Voting for the right party maybe, but I'm not to sure that will sway any OPEC or Oil cartel oil price even if the elected official has their hands in oil futures and they strike some deal with a OPEC country. .
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  31. #31
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    It's because we have the whales. And gas is rare on the Island, very.
    There is also a fight between Alberta and British Columbia about a pipeline.

    Anyway there's nothing we can do but voting for the right party.

    Nothing like finding a good inmate to fix the asylum ...

  32. #32
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Nothing like finding a good inmate to fix the asylum ...
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  33. #33
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Nothing like finding a good inmate to fix the asylum ...
    It's Canada; their politics aren't quite as screwed up as ours
    Rob
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  34. #34
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Met Trudeau.....

  35. #35
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by CPP View Post
    Voting for the right party maybe, but I'm not to sure that will sway any OPEC or Oil cartel oil price even if the elected official has their hands in oil futures and they strike some deal with a OPEC country. .
    Chris, you are 100% right; voting for the right party won't do a thing, zero.

    https://globalnews.ca/news/4178274/gas-price-gouging/

    http://vancouversun.com/news/local-n...et-malfunction
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  36. #36
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Nothing like finding a good inmate to fix the asylum ...
    Who's going to pay for their new shoes and suits.

    Quote Originally Posted by CPP View Post
    Exactemente, us.

    Quote Originally Posted by rbbert View Post
    It's Canada; their politics aren't quite as screwed up as ours
    It's impossible to determine with reliable accuracy. But one thing is certain, in Canada electric cars are gaining momentum.

    On another unrelated subject, taxes for the big companies under the new tax reform in the USA, is affecting big time some Canadians with dual nationality passports...US and Canadian citizenship. ...Those who have tax sheltered investments in some offshore companies. They have to pay big taxes now, and there is no rescue door.

    $ http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/tran...ions-1.4639020

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Met Trudeau.....
    You did, how was it, you shook hands?
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  37. #37
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    No politics people!
    Mark


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  38. #38
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post


    IMO, Only Porsche today making good cars ,
    total BS .......
    Cheers ! …. Dave

  39. #39
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikado463 View Post
    total BS .......
    Actually just about everyone makes a car that will go 100k miles without changing plugs and possibly oil. Who worries about anything going wrong on 1300 mile trip?
    Jim

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  40. #40

    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Bought a Mercedes o BMW lately ...


    IMO, Only Porsche today making good cars , mostly everything else ( super exotics aside ) is a POS trade it in every 3-4 yrs to avoid warts. Very little made today are keepers , one of the many reasons big money chasing the good old stuff to park cash ...

    Aside many good cars if you plan on rolling them every 3-4 yrs , all good , jap cars dont really work for me , not that they are bad none are really , think of toobs and SS not my Bag, I'm still stuck on German, just trade quickly ..
    Not true that only Porsche makes good cars today. My experience is that while in the past mostly Japanese brands made reliable cars, today most brands can build good cars.
    (Porsche has had its share of lemons by the way: 996 for example).

  41. #41
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Yes i remember when the Porsche accelerated away and killed its customers, no wait that was toyota,

    then it must be when engaging launch control and destroying the transmission on the spot , no wait that was Nissan ,

    Ok , ok , you must be talking when the airbags were taking off drivers faces , no wait that was Honda ..


    Seriously , Porsche and share of lemons dont mix , the 996 had an early engine issue taken care of , nothing comes close with their reliability and i have tried most of them worth mentioning.

    While most manufactuers are making great cars today , If you like driving instead of ricing the japanese cars dont cut it or hold up , their euro or American counterpart is superior IMO, ..

  42. #42

    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Yes i remember when the Porsche accelerated away and killed its customers, no wait that was toyota,

    then it must be when engaging launch control and destroying the transmission on the spot , no wait that was Nissan ,

    Ok , ok , you must be talking when the airbags were taking off drivers faces , no wait that was Honda ..


    Seriously , Porsche and share of lemons dont mix , the 996 had an early engine issue taken care of , nothing comes close with their reliability and i have tried most of them worth mentioning.

    While most manufactuers are making great cars today , If you like driving instead of ricing the japanese cars dont cut it or hold up , their euro or American counterpart is superior IMO, ..
    Ok ok, I will play. You must be talking about engines catching fire requiring recall of entire production! Yep, that was the GT3

  43. #43
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by nicoff View Post
    Ok ok, I will play. You must be talking about engines catching fire requiring recall of entire production! Yep, that was the GT3
    the GT3 fires were with the 991 series cars (ca 2014). 996es of the non-turbo/GT3 variety used a derivative of the boxster engine block and were prone to rear main seal failures. Porsche themselve were very hush about it but their affected owners--as you can imagine--were quite vocal. Go to Rennlist and see for yourself. if you ever fancied a preowned watercooled 911 avoid the 996 series like the plague.

  44. #44

    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by puroagave View Post
    the GT3 fires were with the 991 series cars (ca 2014). 996es of the non-turbo/GT3 variety used a derivative of the boxster engine block and were prone to rear main seal failures. Porsche themselve were very hush about it but their affected owners--as you can imagine--were quite vocal. Go to Rennlist and see for yourself. if you ever fancied a preowned watercooled 911 avoid the 996 series like the plague.
    Yes , unfortunately I suffered the 996 rear main seal failure... twice! And I must say that Porsche was not very proactive in fixing the problem. Ford Abandoning Cars

  45. #45
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Why do people love pick-up trucks and SUVs so much?

    At many parkings the parking spots are to small for cars like that. My dream cars are cars like a Focus ST Station, or a BMW 3 series touring. But sadly cars like that cost 40k+
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  46. #46
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordante View Post
    Why do people love pick-up trucks and SUVs so much?

    At many parkings the parking spots are to small for cars like that. My dream cars are cars like a Focus ST Station, or a BMW 3 series touring. But sadly cars like that cost 40k+
    I guess it depends on where you live, your family size ( vehicle usage and involvement). We have my wifes Lexus and I have my truck. We will never be without a car, which means it will be Lexus or Mercedes.
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  47. #47
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordante View Post
    Why do people love pick-up trucks and SUVs so much?
    it's a 'Texas' thing ............
    Cheers ! …. Dave

  48. #48
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    I’m a car person - 2 door coupe. My wife loves her sporty SUV.
    _______________

    Mike

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  49. #49
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    I use my car to go on holiday etc so it needs to be practical. I cycle to work. Also audio > car.

    Many companies in the Netherlands don’t allow their personal to come by car. It’s not uncommon to have a office for 200 people and 50 parking spots.
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  50. #50
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    Re: Ford Abandoning Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordante View Post
    Why do people love pick-up trucks and SUVs so much?
    Around here they are mostly used by one person as a commute vehicle. As a car driver I hate being behind one since they block the view of the road ahead. Personally, I will be glad when oil finally goes up again, but no telling when that will happen.
    Bud

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